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UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 12:50 am
by Highway61
Schools considering and COA: (Pretty rough estimates)
UChicago: $165,000
Michigan: $150,000
ND: $85,000
UCLA: $65,000
Financing COA with loans
From Chicago, but don't have a set place I want to practice. Would definitely prefer midwest or west coast, though.
Probably looking for mid size firm with a better work/life balance than big law.
Very debt averse
Absolutely NOT retaking
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 1:09 am
by pcthenls
UCLA seems like the best option if you would like the west coast and are debt adverse. Not sure about your goals though. Have you visited any of these schools? Have you tried to negotiate for more money between UCLA and UMich?
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 1:17 am
by staysha
Considering your goals there is no reason to consider Michigan over Chicago for 15k difference. So Michigan should be out.
Also, no reason to consider ND over UCLA for West Coast, and at a higher price.
So FWIW, it seems you're between UChi and UCLA. Either are defensible. If not biglaw, maybe UCLA.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 1:20 am
by 2014
The big law placement disparity between UChi and ND/UCLA is HUGE. We actually place into boutique sized firms as well as moderate sized Chicago firms too (though it's not as assured as big law just because of numbers). Admittedly ND/UCLA will give you more freedom to take non well paying jobs, but the odds of you working as a lawyer is markedly lower.
I don't see how Michigan should be under consideration though unless you have some really unique reason to prefer it. Chicago is worth 15k more for sure.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 2:35 am
by Highway61
As far as Michigan vs. Chicago go, I think Michigan is a better fit environment wise than Chicago for me. I felt a lot safer in Ann Arbor and love the Big Ten college town atmosphere a lot more than Hyde Park. (I've visited all 4 schools for the record). I haven't tried negotiating with Michigan. I heard if you are offered anything they won't increase it?
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:37 am
by WheninLaw
Highway61 wrote:As far as Michigan vs. Chicago go, I think Michigan is a better fit environment wise than Chicago for me. I felt a lot safer in Ann Arbor and love the Big Ten college town atmosphere a lot more than Hyde Park. (I've visited all 4 schools for the record). I haven't tried negotiating with Michigan. I heard if you are offered anything they won't increase it?
Once in a while they will. I popped in to say this is a bad reason to choose Michigan. You will need biglaw to pay back those loans at either Mich/Chi, and Chicago gives you a substantially better shot at paying them back.
You only live in HP for one year (if at all). Do not let that be the reason.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:39 am
by thebobs1987
Unless Michigan offers you more money and you don't think you'd be happy at Chicago, UC is the easy choice.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:46 am
by BigZuck
I would re-adjust career goals or not go to law school
Also retake cuz debt aversion. UCLA without ties and a burning desire to work in LA ain't too bueno
Post removed.
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:08 am
by MistakenGenius
Post removed.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:17 am
by elterrible78
MistakenGenius wrote:thebobs1987 wrote:Unless Michigan offers you more money and you don't think you'd be happy at Chicago, UC is the easy choice.
Pretty much this. I see how you can feel unsafe at UC. Chicago is basically America's killing field. At the same time, Michigan is pretty damn sweet (and I'm just going to say this again, looks like Hogwarts.) That said, without a substantial price tag difference, you have to go where you're going to have better employment chances. Law school isn't a place to be comfortable, it's a professional school designed to make you a lawyer. At 150k+ debt, you need Biglaw. While Michigan certainly can get Biglaw, Chicago gets more students there. Have you negotiated with Michigan using the Chicago offer?
I get that Ann Arbor feels safer than Hyde Park, but the whole "dangerous Hyde Park" things is SO overblown. I was concerned before I came here too, so I understand, but this is just not a dangerous neighborhood. That isn't to say things can't and don't happen, but it's not even approaching the war zone some people would have you believe. I walk around at all hours of the night, by myself, and have never really even felt nervous.
Chicago v. Michigan (without a substantial cost difference), for me, is just a complete one-sided blowout if you're at all concerned about job prospects.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:44 am
by transferror
UChi at 165k is pretty damn reasonable. If you had ties to CA and weren't set on biglaw, UCLA at 65k would be a consideration. But you're not. ND shouldn't be part of this conversation. I wouldn't consider UM here unless the COA drops to 115k or lower, and it would still be a tough call.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:51 am
by Crowing
MistakenGenius wrote:Chicago is basically America's killing field.
I don't have any idea why people say this. Chicago's per capita homicide rate hasn't even cracked the top 30 among U.S. cities in most recent years.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:55 am
by thebobs1987
Crowing wrote:MistakenGenius wrote:Chicago is basically America's killing field.
I don't have any idea why people say this. Chicago's per capita homicide rate hasn't even cracked the top 30 among U.S. cities in most recent years.
Yeah, there are only a couple neighborhoods that unfortunately are responsible for the majority of homicides. Hyde Park isn't one of them. The majority of the city is incredibly safe
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:15 am
by 3L2014
Chicago.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:21 pm
by Nomo
You do realize that there are very few midsized firms with good work/life balance hiring people out of school, right? Its biglaw or small law. Those are the only options.
If you want biglaw, U Chicago. If you want big law, but would be cool with small law then UCLA. If you would prefer small law, then UCLA. That's my advice.
Re: UCHI vs MICH vs ND vs UCLA
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:54 pm
by El Principe
I'd probably go to Chicago, only because small law with Cali's cost of living is rough.