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First poast here

Schools: As of now I'm deciding between mich, GULC, and UVA all at sticker. I have half scholarships at vandy and wustl.

Goals: I want to clerk after law school, then biglaw litigation, then eventually transition to AUSA or DOJ. Ideally I'd like DC>Chicago> NYC.

Numbers: 3.2/170. Taken LSAT three times.

I have a humanities major and no prospect for making a substantial amount of money in my current job. I'm 3 years out of undergrad and I've worked in a private school making around 30k. I will be paying loans for tuition but family will cover COL. I dont have substantial ties in any area where I want to end up.

As of now I'm leaning UVA due to placement in DC.

Also, I've tried negotiating but no $ from anyone.

Advice?

Clerk then big law and then AUSA? Are you sure? What about a SCOTUS clerkship? Don't you want to make partner also?

Mal Reynolds wrote:Clerk then big law and then AUSA? Are you sure? What about a SCOTUS clerkship? Don't you want to make partner also?

I'm aware they're lofty goals, and i may have to reevaluate at some point. That said, is there a good option here?

wambo wrote:First poast here

Schools: As of now I'm deciding between mich, GULC, and UVA all at sticker. I have half scholarships at vandy and wustl.

Goals: I want to clerk after law school, then biglaw litigation, then eventually transition to AUSA or DOJ. Ideally I'd like DC>Chicago> NYC.

Numbers: 3.2/170. Taken LSAT three times.

I have a humanities major and no prospect for making a substantial amount of money in my current job. I'm 3 years out of undergrad and I've worked in a private school making around 30k. I will be paying loans for tuition but family will cover COL. I dont have substantial ties in any area where I want to end up.

As of now I'm leaning UVA due to placement in DC.

Also, I've tried negotiating but no $ from anyone.

Advice?

UVa can get you to DC, Chicago, and NYC biglaw. Obviously sticker is a lot, but good luck to you. Think about back-up plans now (such as other smaller markets you can target regional biglaw pre-OCI), but your goals are fine for this level of school (I mean who knows if you'll end up a AUSA but Biglaw as a first outcome is realistic goal).

Also, UVa > GULC. Michigan could be better for Chicago, but UVa does not close any of those doors either. So, I'd go to UVa if I were you.

UVA seems like the right call for you

Thanks a bunch! I had been going back and forth mostly on UVA and Mich, so thanks for the advice!

You need a realistic backup plan. Ideally 2 or 3 realistic backup plans. And you need to be excited about those backup plans. If you're not then you shouldn't be going to these schools, especially at these prices.

If you can get Virginia residency for 2L and 3L, 3 yrs w/ interest but no CoL will shackle you at roughly ~$175,000.

I would take UVa. This is heavy debt, but given you're a splitter, there are worse outcomes. Congrats and good luck.

Nothing, but than again there's no school I'd take at sticker, however, given the choices and your goals, UVA by far, but sheesh, sticker?

Nomo wrote:You need a realistic backup plan. Ideally 2 or 3 realistic backup plans. And you need to be excited about those backup plans. If you're not then you shouldn't be going to these schools, especially at these prices.

I do have a couple of back up plans, and I have a few family legal connections in a smaller market if I absolutely strike out. I don't love the idea of so much debt, but since I can't repeat college I don't see a better option than going to the best possible law school to try and reach my initial goals.

El Principe wrote:Nothing, but than again there's no school I'd take at sticker, however, given the choices and your goals, UVA by far, but sheesh, sticker?

Yeah I think my GPA is really my downfall. I've considered retaking, but 1. I hit my practice test average at 170, and 2. I've spoken with admitted students at all these schools with much better GPAs and higher LSAT scores and many of them didn't receive aid, either.

jbagelboy wrote:If you can get Virginia residency for 2L and 3L, 3 yrs w/ interest but no CoL will shackle you at roughly ~$175,000.

I would take UVa. This is heavy debt, but given you're a splitter, there are worse outcomes. Congrats and good luck.

Do you get in-state residency by performing well 1L and convincing the school to offer a better deal for the remaining years? And thanks for the advice and encouragement!

You get in-state residence by presenting evidence that you intend to live in VA after law school. This seems unlikely. I guess if you were to get a job in DC you could theoretically still be living in VA, but I doubt evidence of a job in DC would convince them of much. I wouldn't count on getting in-state tuition.

wambo wrote:

Nomo wrote:You need a realistic backup plan. Ideally 2 or 3 realistic backup plans. And you need to be excited about those backup plans. If you're not then you shouldn't be going to these schools, especially at these prices.

I do have a couple of back up plans, and I have a few family legal connections in a smaller market if I absolutely strike out. I don't love the idea of so much debt, but since I can't repeat college I don't see a better option than going to the best possible law school to try and reach my initial goals.

I actually think anyone telling you that you have to reevaluate your goals is being harsh. Those seem like good goals. Michigan or UVA would set you up well for them. There's a difference between district court AIII clerkships and doing something on an appellate court. One is available to maybe a third of students at UVA or Mich., the other is available only to a handful. If you want to do litigation, this sounds like a good plan. Granted, it's a lot of debt. See if you can get a scholarship from one of the schools. Maybe, tell both UVA and Michigan that for $15,000 a year, you're there.

None of the above. Try to get $$

See you at UVA!

I'd pit Vandy and WUSTL against your Michigan and UVA acceptances and see if you can't bounce those up to 105kish. Barring that, go enlist for three years and come back with the full GI bill or something. Even if someone else is picking up your COL, that's still a bit nuts.

nordi wrote:

wambo wrote:

Nomo wrote:You need a realistic backup plan. Ideally 2 or 3 realistic backup plans. And you need to be excited about those backup plans. If you're not then you shouldn't be going to these schools, especially at these prices.

I do have a couple of back up plans, and I have a few family legal connections in a smaller market if I absolutely strike out. I don't love the idea of so much debt, but since I can't repeat college I don't see a better option than going to the best possible law school to try and reach my initial goals.

I actually think anyone telling you that you have to reevaluate your goals is being harsh. Those seem like good goals. Michigan or UVA would set you up well for them. There's a difference between district court AIII clerkships and doing something on an appellate court. One is available to maybe a third of students at UVA or Mich., the other is available only to a handful. If you want to do litigation, this sounds like a good plan. Granted, it's a lot of debt. See if you can get a scholarship from one of the schools. Maybe, tell both UVA and Michigan that for $15,000 a year, you're there.

A third of Michigan and UVA students might have a shot at federal district court clerkships (particularly in less desirable locations). But, in my experience a student in the top 25% probably only has a 10% chance of landing a d.ct. clerkship, and that's assuming they apply to pretty much every opening on OSCAR.

UVA is the only good option for your choices but sticker is a lot to take on, especially since your goals are such a crapshoot at any school outside HYS. I think the only thing you can bet on getting is BigLaw, and even that isn't 100%. Reevaluate your goals and make sure that you understand you will either be paying a lot each month to pay back debt via LRAP for 10 years, or you will have to work at BigLaw for 5+ years.

wambo wrote:

jbagelboy wrote:If you can get Virginia residency for 2L and 3L, 3 yrs w/ interest but no CoL will shackle you at roughly ~$175,000.

I would take UVa. This is heavy debt, but given you're a splitter, there are worse outcomes. Congrats and good luck.

Do you get in-state residency by performing well 1L and convincing the school to offer a better deal for the remaining years? And thanks for the advice and encouragement!

As a Virginia resident, I can tell you it is extremely hard to get in-state tuition to any school in Virginia without moving there and working for a year before you start school.

twenty wrote:I'd pit Vandy and WUSTL against your Michigan and UVA acceptances and see if you can't bounce those up to 105kish. Barring that, go enlist for three years and come back with the full GI bill or something. Even if someone else is picking up your COL, that's still a bit nuts.

I'm still attempting to negotiate, though I doubt it will do much, considering my low GPA. Also, I'd rather go to Cooley than enlist--it's something I'm very much against. But thanks for the candid advice.

mylifeis24 wrote:UVA is the only good option for your choices but sticker is a lot to take on, especially since your goals are such a crapshoot at any school outside HYS. I think the only thing you can bet on getting is BigLaw, and even that isn't 100%. Reevaluate your goals and make sure that you understand you will either be paying a lot each month to pay back debt via LRAP for 10 years, or you will have to work at BigLaw for 5+ years.

Yeah I understand that it's somewhat unlikely that I'll be able to clerk, more likely I'll be in Biglaw, and a significant chance I'll strike out altogether. With that said, I have a backup plan for each scenario. While not ideal, I think this gives me the best chance at my targeted goals, thought I may be an indentured servant for 5-10+ years after graduation!

wambo wrote:

twenty wrote:I'd pit Vandy and WUSTL against your Michigan and UVA acceptances and see if you can't bounce those up to 105kish. Barring that, go enlist for three years and come back with the full GI bill or something. Even if someone else is picking up your COL, that's still a bit nuts.

I'm still attempting to negotiate, though I doubt it will do much, considering my low GPA. Also, I'd rather go to Cooley than enlist--it's something I'm very much against. But thanks for the candid advice.

People haven't had much luck negotiating with UVa this cycle.
Enlisting in the military just for the GI Bill is a pretty terrible idea IMO.

Gooner91 wrote:

wambo wrote:

twenty wrote:I'd pit Vandy and WUSTL against your Michigan and UVA acceptances and see if you can't bounce those up to 105kish. Barring that, go enlist for three years and come back with the full GI bill or something. Even if someone else is picking up your COL, that's still a bit nuts.

I'm still attempting to negotiate, though I doubt it will do much, considering my low GPA. Also, I'd rather go to Cooley than enlist--it's something I'm very much against. But thanks for the candid advice.

People haven't had much luck negotiating with UVa this cycle.
Enlisting in the military just for the GI Bill is a pretty terrible idea IMO.

I agree, so when I say sticker at any of these is a worse idea, that's how bad of an idea this is.

I know it's a ton of debt, but if I'm going to law school at all, I don't see my prospects improving beyond these options.