. Forum

[rickgrimes69]

Troll bro seems to have it out for Michigan. NU, Duke, and Cornell all have worse LST stats generally (although they place more into biglaw, which is largely due to Michigan students self-selecting into PI), and Michigan is one of the more transparent schools in the T-14 in terms of honesty in reporting job figures.

lolno

[cotiger]

Troll bro seems to have it out for Michigan. NU, Duke, and Cornell all have worse LST stats generally (although they place more into biglaw, which is largely due to Michigan students self-selecting into PI), and Michigan is one of the more transparent schools in the T-14 in terms of honesty in reporting job figures.

Unless the "no" is because Michigan tends to throw most students at least a little something in terms of scholarship dollars, so if you go without you're likely a bad negotiator/not a great candidate. That I can get on board with.

Ok.. let's assume that 100% of PI is self-selecting and those students could have totally found firm jobs if they wanted. Adding up FedClerk+BigLaw+PI gives us these results:

Cornell - 77.9%
Duke - 73.3%
Mich - 67.8%

Northwestern does come in at a paltry 62.7%, but if we're being fair about self-selection we should probably replace PI with Business for them, resulting in 67.5%. They probably have more legit JD advantage than usual, so we probably still need to adjust upwards a bit.

Not sure where you're getting this "worse" LST stats thing..

[stillwater]

I think GULC is the only one worth sticker. got dat lay prestige. sick location.

[bruinfan10]

I think GULC is the only one worth sticker. got dat lay prestige. sick location.

+1

[sancho]

These days you should get some real money (like 45k+) from good schools in the T-14. And as someone who didn't take the money I'd recommend that you take the money. But stay within the T-14 of course.

Are you saying that knowing then what you know now you would have taken NU @ 60k over CLS at sticker?

[Tiago Splitter]

These days you should get some real money (like 45k+) from good schools in the T-14. And as someone who didn't take the money I'd recommend that you take the money. But stay within the T-14 of course.

Are you saying that knowing then what you know now you would have taken NU @ 60k over CLS at sticker?

Probably yes, but that's at least in part because I got good grades. 60k is probably the number where it becomes a coin flip either way.

[twenty]

For biglaw gunnerz, basically every T14 except GULC is worth sticker. Enjoy working in a sweatshop in downtown NYC for the next FOREVER.

For PI gunnerz, basically every T14 except Northwestern and Cornell are worth sticker. Enjoy working in a cubicle trying to support yourself on a PI salary for the next FOREVER.

[stillwater]

For biglaw gunnerz, basically every T14 except GULC is worth sticker. Enjoy working in a sweatshop in downtown NYC for the next FOREVER.

For PI gunnerz, basically every T14 except Northwestern and Cornell are worth sticker. Enjoy working in a cubicle trying to support yourself on a PI salary for the next FOREVER.

this seems like a very generous assessment.

[hephaestus]

Troll bro seems to have it out for Michigan. NU, Duke, and Cornell all have worse LST stats generally (although they place more into biglaw, which is largely due to Michigan students self-selecting into PI), and Michigan is one of the more transparent schools in the T-14 in terms of honesty in reporting job figures.

Unless the "no" is because Michigan tends to throw most students at least a little something in terms of scholarship dollars, so if you go without you're likely a bad negotiator/not a great candidate. That I can get on board with.

Cornell frequently outperforms michigan, at least in the past few years. I don't see wha you're trying to say.

[hashashin]

Troll bro seems to have it out for Michigan. NU, Duke, and Cornell all have worse LST stats generally (although they place more into biglaw, which is largely due to Michigan students self-selecting into PI), and Michigan is one of the more transparent schools in the T-14 in terms of honesty in reporting job figures.

Unless the "no" is because Michigan tends to throw most students at least a little something in terms of scholarship dollars, so if you go without you're likely a bad negotiator/not a great candidate. That I can get on board with.

Cornell frequently outperforms michigan, at least in the past few years. I don't see wha you're trying to say.

But Cornell students are sooooo....DUMB....

[Kimikho]

Yale

[Ahamilton]

Only Harvard.

[californiauser]

HYSC

[CitrusFruit]

Is there really any point in going to HYS over CCN at 1/2-full scholarship if your goal is big law? Why do so many people still do it? Are there tangible benefits aside from the prestige?

[Otunga]

Is there really any point in going to HYS over CCN at 1/2-full scholarship if your goal is big law? Why do so many people still do it? Are there tangible benefits aside from the prestige?

I'd speculate it's due to those risk-averse people who just aren't quite sure they want big law. So they want backup plans, and they maximize those backup plans at HYS. But then again, you have backup plans at CCN....yeah, I'm not sure.

[jordan15]

Is there really any point in going to HYS over CCN at 1/2-full scholarship if your goal is big law? Why do so many people still do it? Are there tangible benefits aside from the prestige?

Yes, some biglaw firms openly admit that they have different GPA floors for HYS vs other schools. Also, some firms encourage associates to leave to clerk after a few years, which might be easier with a HYS degree.

[Ti Malice]

Is there really any point in going to HYS over CCN at 1/2-full scholarship if your goal is big law? Why do so many people still do it? Are there tangible benefits aside from the prestige?

There are definitely tangible benefits to YHS (though more so with Y and S than with H). I can only speak about Y from first-hand knowledge. People here even with straight Ps, or three Ps and an H from a graded clinic, still regularly get NYC BigLaw as long as they interview decently. That's security that the bottom 20% at CCN generally doesn't have. (These advantages are not limited to BigLaw, either.) H still confers an advantage over CCN, but people at the bottom of the class definitely struggle more there than at Y (and S).

Whether the extra security is worth ~$85K before interest depends upon your own degree of single-mindedness about BigLaw, aversion to risk, etc.

[jbagelboy]

Is there really any point in going to HYS over CCN at 1/2-full scholarship if your goal is big law? Why do so many people still do it? Are there tangible benefits aside from the prestige?

There are definitely tangible benefits to YHS (though more so with Y and S than with H). I can only speak about Y from first-hand knowledge. People here even with straight Ps, or three Ps and an H from a graded clinic, still regularly get NYC BigLaw as long as they interview decently. That's security that the bottom 20% at CCN generally doesn't have. (These advantages are not limited to BigLaw, either.) H still confers an advantage over CCN, but people at the bottom of the class definitely struggle more there than at Y (and S).

Whether the extra security is worth ~$85K before interest depends upon your own degree of single-mindedness about BigLaw, aversion to risk, etc.

Yale also provides total security via loan repayment cause you dont even have to work a legal job and they will pay your fed loans for you if your salary/wages are under a certain cap. This is unique as far as I know.

Also many people do get need-based grants at HS that close the gap in debt between them and Columbia or Chicago. Those that are truly faced with sticker debt at H will often choose CCN with $$ or full ride at lower T14 instead, but that seems to be rare: another group who get no money in grants from HYS, but whose parents therefore have the resources to help out and avoid the massive debt load, have a different calculus which favors minimizing that 10-15% risk margin near the bottom of the class, and the general anxiety over 1L grades

[twenty]

HYS is a 50k-200k (depending on your scholarship/need aid situation) insurance policy that means you won't be buggered if you end up at the bottom of the class. To me, making a massive financial decision reliant on being in the bottom of the class is about as silly as assuming you can go to a T2 because you'll end up in the top of the class.

80% of the time, a Chicago grad is going to be working across the hall from a Yale grad, but with a substantially better take-home salary.