NU Accelerated JD: Current student answering Qs Forum

[bet4031]

1 additional quick question whenever you get the chance. When should AJD applicants aim to get our applications in? I know generally the earlier the better but it seems there's less emphasis on promptness for AJDs. From reading some of the other threads it seems the admissions staff waits until January to begin their review. In that case is there any advantage to getting applications in before December or January?

Thanks again.

[paglababa]

I want to apply ED to NU because its my first choice and because of the fantastic 50k merit offer. (My stats are 171 for lsat and 3.9ish for gpa, and I have strong finance work experience). But I am REALLY interested in the AJD program and would actually prefer that. I'm not sure what to do. I could submit my AJD application next week but then it will really be a roll of the dice as to whether I will receive a comparable scholarship offer.

Do you think I can apply for ED and then ask adcom for consideration to the AJD program? I'm thinking no because it looks like a completely separate pool and decision.

[captainplanet]

1 additional quick question whenever you get the chance. When should AJD applicants aim to get our applications in? I know generally the earlier the better but it seems there's less emphasis on promptness for AJDs. From reading some of the other threads it seems the admissions staff waits until January to begin their review. In that case is there any advantage to getting applications in before December or January?

Thanks again.

I believe that AJD admissions are not done on a rolling basis so there is no advantage to submitting your application early.

[captainplanet]

I want to apply ED to NU because its my first choice and because of the fantastic 50k merit offer. (My stats are 171 for lsat and 3.9ish for gpa, and I have strong finance work experience). But I am REALLY interested in the AJD program and would actually prefer that. I'm not sure what to do. I could submit my AJD application next week but then it will really be a roll of the dice as to whether I will receive a comparable scholarship offer.

Do you think I can apply for ED and then ask adcom for consideration to the AJD program? I'm thinking no because it looks like a completely separate pool and decision.

I asked Admissions and they said that you can only apply ED to the 3-year program, but I think you should contact them and discuss your situation and ask if they would make an exception. Make an argument for why you're a really good fit for NU and that's why you're applying ED and why you're also a good fit for the AJD program. Another option is to apply ED and, after you get the scholarship, ask to go into the AJD program instead. I've heard of them allowing RD admits to go into the AJD program instead, so they might allow it, but I don't know if they would with an ED.

With your stats, you'll probably get scholarship money either way, but you're right that you won't know how much you'll get without the ED. At the same time though, if you get a $100K scholarship, it almost ends up coming out even because of the money you save in having 1 less year of living expenses.

If Admissions really is unwilling to budge, I would lean toward applying ED and having a full scholarship. You'll probably know before the AJD application deadline whether you've been admitted ED and, if you're not, you can then probably ask to be considered for AJD admission. Good luck!

[NanaP]

Thanks for answering questions!

I applied to the 3 year program , but the more I learn about the AJD program the more I like the program. I think it would be a better fit for me as I am non traditional applicant with several years of work experience with a masters.....If admitted to the 3 year program, can I make the switch or ask to be considered for the AJD program? Should I wait to be admitted or call right away to be moved into the AJD program?

[captainplanet]

Thanks for answering questions!

I applied to the 3 year program , but the more I learn about the AJD program the more I like the program. I think it would be a better fit for me as I am non traditional applicant with several years of work experience with a masters.....If admitted to the 3 year program, can I make the switch or ask to be considered for the AJD program? Should I wait to be admitted or call right away to be moved into the AJD program?

I would recommend calling right away and asking to switch, or what your options are. If you don't get into the AJD program they'll still consider you for the 3-year program, I believe, but it might be harder the other way since the AJD program only has about 30 spaces (though I believe some people have switched in the past). Good luck!

[NanaP]

Thanks for answering questions!

I applied to the 3 year program , but the more I learn about the AJD program the more I like the program. I think it would be a better fit for me as I am non traditional applicant with several years of work experience with a masters.....If admitted to the 3 year program, can I make the switch or ask to be considered for the AJD program? Should I wait to be admitted or call right away to be moved into the AJD program?

I would recommend calling right away and asking to switch, or what your options are. If you don't get into the AJD program they'll still consider you for the 3-year program, I believe, but it might be harder the other way since the AJD program only has about 30 spaces (though I believe some people have switched in the past). Good luck!

Ok, thanks!

[paglababa]

Do you know people from your 30-people AJD class who got significant, $120k+, scholarship money?

How does the curve work when you're only going up against 30 people in your first summer semester? Someone told me that most of the AJD class had awesome OCI results.

[captainplanet]

The class profile for 2013 is up: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/admissi ... ofile.html

Do you know people from your 30-people AJD class who got significant, $120k+, scholarship money?

Yes, I think it's mostly based on LSAT/GPA so I would guess that someone with a 172 or 173 would be in the $120K range and someone with a 174 would get a full/almost full scholarship (so about 25% of the class, based on the class profile). I don't know most students' scholarship situation but I do know that there are some students with full scholarships in the program. I recommend checking out http://mylsn.info/graph_money.php for scholarship information. This year's 75th percentile GPA jumped to 174, while most programs' ranges have been declining, so I think they may have been very generous with $ to encourage so many applicants with 174s to choose the program.

How does the curve work when you're only going up against 30 people in your first summer semester? Someone told me that most of the AJD class had awesome OCI results.

It's definitely a tight curve. All of our classes were curved except for Negotiation. So the percent of As given out is the same as in the 3-year program, but there are half as many of those As to give out because fewer people are in the class. There are also some very smart students and some who have some legal-like experience, but those students are also found in any law school class. I think most people earned similar grades to what they would have earned had they gone into the 3-year program instead, but I've also heard that the competition may be stiffer in the AJD program. It's also a shorter semester so you really have to be able to hit the ground running (everyone in the program is in the same boat in terms of the time crunch, but if you really struggle with time management, that's going to put you at a disadvantage). Going into OCI, we only had 1 semester of grades, so if one did poorly, he or she wouldn't have had a second semester to improve his or her GPA (unlike the 3-year students). I think that the AJDs' OCI results have a lot to do with their prior work experience, and most students did well but some struggled, as is the case with the 3-year students.

[paglababa]

Thanks, fantastic post. It looks like I won't be getting awesome amounts of money then. Didn't know the AJD class had such higher stats compared to the medians for the 3yr program.

[captainplanet]

Thanks, fantastic post. It looks like I won't be getting awesome amounts of money then. Didn't know the AJD class had such higher stats compared to the medians for the 3yr program.

I think the 174 number was a fluke. In the past the LSAT scores of AJDs slightly trailed those of the 3-year students, I believe, so I wouldn't make any assumptions off of the 174 figure, because it's pretty unusual. I think that the two programs are similar competitiveness-wise. I think with your numbers you'd see some money, since you're above the medians and have a 170+ LSAT. Good luck!

[kcdc1]

Thanks so much for taking questions. I just got accepted yesterday and I'm very excited about the program.

I am interested in pursuing the Northwestern Law Scholars Program--is this an option for AJD students?

Also, I plan to go into IP law, but NU does not seem to offer a concentration in IP. Do you see this as a problem or is a concentration not a big deal?

[NUAJD15]

Can't say I know anything about the Scholars Program, so that's something you'd want to check with admissions about. If they don't know, they'll find someone who does.

I definitely wouldn't worry about concentrations. There's a general philosophy that law school is a general education, and as a result few people do concentrations. Given our time constraints, even fewer AJDs do them. If you have the background to qualify for the patent bar and want to go into IP, you're already in a good position. There's obviously IP-related coursework you'd want to do, but a formal concentration is not something to be concerned about.

[kcdc1]

Was reading up on Plan 2008 and AJD. Seems like the program has been succeeding in a lot of its proposals. Was curious about this bit:

Quantitative Analysis: This requirement would introduce students to basic accounting, finance theory, and statistics from a client’s perspective. Students wishing to gain a deeper understanding could fulfill this requirement by seeking a waiver and, in its place, completing three Kellogg courses: Accounting for Decision-making, Finance I, and Math Methods for Decisions, which are currently open to our students.

Is this still emphasized in the AJD program and are the Kellogg courses still an option? I would love to take those business courses, but I wonder how feasible it is given other demands.

[mirroroferised7]

I'm retaking the LSAT in February, because I am capable of scoring closer to the 175 range than I did (170).

I know AJD scholarship offers go out in the next couple of weeks, but I won't have my new (hopefully higher) LSAT score until the first week in March. Would it be possible to negotiate scholarship offers with a February LSAT score? I'm a bit stressed by the (understandably) compressed decision timeline. (possibly coupled with the fact that I'm also getting married in March...)

Thoughts?

[kcdc1]

Congrats on your engagement! I just got married last May, so I understand the anticipation/potential for stress. Here's some uninformed speculation from a fellow 0L about your negotiation question.

NU says they start reviewing AJD scholly info on Feb 15, and AJD admits start receiving offers on March 1. March 15 is the deadline for our seat deposits. You will have your Feb LSAT score on or before March 5, so NU's initial offer will most likely be based on your 170. But you'll get your new score early in the March 1-March 15 negotiation window, so it seems like it could be a strong card to play if you do well.

FWIW, the regular JD admits get their scholarship information processed a little later than the AJD admits. I don't know how strict they are with budgeting scholarship funds between the two programs, but it seems like NU would have a tough time claiming to be out of money by March 5.

[mirroroferised7]

Thanks for the response! Any amount of (positive) speculation helps to calm me down a bit at this point. Still kind of blown away that I got into the AJD program...

[NUAJD15]

Is this still emphasized in the AJD program and are the Kellogg courses still an option? I would love to take those business courses, but I wonder how feasible it is given other demands.

Yeah, that didn't really work. Turns out AJD students wanted to be treated like regular law students for the most part, so the quantitative stuff is no longer required or emphasized. The Kellogg classes are still available, and folks definitely do take them. It can be a little tricky grade-wise because Kellogg doesn't have +/- grades, but if you're interested, that shouldn't stop you.

I know AJD scholarship offers go out in the next couple of weeks, but I won't have my new (hopefully higher) LSAT score until the first week in March. Would it be possible to negotiate scholarship offers with a February LSAT score? I'm a bit stressed by the (understandably) compressed decision timeline. (possibly coupled with the fact that I'm also getting married in March...)
Thoughts?

You can try, but Northwestern doesn't usually budge on the money they offer you (have a look at --LinkRemoved--). What you might be able to get if you're stressed though is some more time to decide.

[mirroroferised7]

That was incredibly helpful, and gave me great insight! Thanks!

[Leo]

Thanks for answering all our questions. Quick one here: Are AJD students more limited in how many electives they can take?

[captainplanet]

Thanks so much for taking questions. I just got accepted yesterday and I'm very excited about the program.

I am interested in pursuing the Northwestern Law Scholars Program--is this an option for AJD students?

Also, I plan to go into IP law, but NU does not seem to offer a concentration in IP. Do you see this as a problem or is a concentration not a big deal?

Congratulations on your acceptance!

I generally second what NUAJD15 said but, looking at the Law Scholars Program, I don't know that it'll work with the AJD program. It seems that some of the work for the scholars program is done the summer after 1L year, which AJDs don't have (that's the summer we take our 1L classes). NU may be able to let you work around this issue and have you do the work later, but I'd definitely check in with NU if you haven't already.

As for developing connections with professors to go into academia, I think it's doable in 2 years but you do have less time than the 3-year students. On the other hand, our summer 1L classes have 28 students, rather than 65, so you get to know your doctrinal professors better. And, if Law Review is really important for academia, I think it's a little harder to get onto Law Review as an AJD (though we're working on that). Looking beyond the AJD program, it seems to be pretty hard to go into academia from outside the T5, so that's also something to consider.

For IP, as NUAJD15 said, concentrations are not a big deal. You can totally go into IP from NU and will get the education you need here. However, if you're specifically interested in taking more advanced IP classes, a school like Stanford would have more offerings than NU. I suggest looking at curriculum offerings from various schools you're considering--though I wouldn't go to a lower ranked school for an IP program over a higher ranked school with fewer IP offerings, because ranking is going to matter more to employers and most of what you need to know you'll learn on the job.

I hope this doesn't discourage you from coming to the AJD program ... I think it's great and I hope you enroll! I just want to be honest about the challenges if these factors are really important for you.

[captainplanet]

I know AJD scholarship offers go out in the next couple of weeks, but I won't have my new (hopefully higher) LSAT score until the first week in March. Would it be possible to negotiate scholarship offers with a February LSAT score? I'm a bit stressed by the (understandably) compressed decision timeline. (possibly coupled with the fact that I'm also getting married in March...)
Thoughts?

You can try, but Northwestern doesn't usually budge on the money they offer you (have a look at --LinkRemoved--). What you might be able to get if you're stressed though is some more time to decide.

Congratulations on your admission and on getting married! There are several students in the AJD program who are married as well and could probably give great advice on making marriage and law school work.

In addition to NUAJD15's advice, I'd also recommend reaching out to other schools simultaneously once you get your new score so that you can use your offer from School A to convince School B to budge. And tell them your enrollment deadline is coming up so you need to know ASAP. You can also wait until next year and reapply if you think it'll make a big difference for scholarship money ... but I know that's not a great option if you're ready now.

[captainplanet]

Thanks for answering all our questions. Quick one here: Are AJD students more limited in how many electives they can take?

No, AJDs end up with about the same number of electives as 3-year students. There are no restrictions on what classes we can take. The only restrictions that might come up are certain classes that have prerequisites (like advanced writing classes that require having taken CLR II; or FedJur, for which Con Law is strongly recommended but not required). We complete most of our 1L classes in the summer before 2L, except for CLR II, Crim, and Con Law--which we take during our 2L year. The vast majority of classes do not have these classes as prereqs but a few do, so you just have to arrange your schedule to take some electives in your 3L year instead of your 2L year. This isn't really an issue except for FedJur, which they recommend taking your 3L year anyway, so it doesn't make a difference.

AJDs take 1 more class per semester than the 3-year students most of the time, so we end up with the same number of classes upon graduation. An extra class is completely doable, and summer and intersession classes help lighten the load, but it means that you have to be extra conscious of balancing harder and easier classes and not overloading in a single semester.

I believe there's also a restriction on participating in a journal and some moot courts. I think AJDs can't be on some moot courts if they're on a journal due to time constraints, but there are other moot court options if one is interested in both.

[kcdc1]

Flurry of insight today--many thanks. I will contact admissions about the Law Scholars program and see what I can learn. I understand that academia is something of a long shot, but working as a patent attorney is a good back-up. Keep working on putting AJD's on even ground for Law Review--that would certainly help.

[Leo]

Sorry if this isn't the appropriate forum, but I have a question about NU law in general. My goal is to land an IP law job with a top firm. I also currently live in Chicago and have a good professional network here. I have been counseled by many 0Ls that a discounted NU degree is preferable to a T6 degree at sticker. Do you guys agree with that advice? Thanks in advance.