C/O 2016 Class Profiles Forum

[09042014]

UVA Dropped to 169.

http://www.law.virginia.edu/html/news/2 ... f_2016.htm

Bye bye, NU's 170. Unless someone REALLY screwed up at UVA.

NU cut class size, might be the reason they did.

UVA "cut" its class size too. Down 22 (6%) and it didn't stop the drop

NU went down to 10%. That extra 4% is key.

Though I don't think NU typically leaks their class numbers so it'll be a while til we find out.

[twenty]

It astonishes me that UVA dropped class size and LSAT median. My friend with a 173 was just dropped from UVA's waitlist a few days ago after many LOCIs and promises to attend with a 90k scholarship.

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

Bye bye, NU's 170. Unless someone REALLY screwed up at UVA.

NU cut class size, might be the reason they did.

UVA "cut" its class size too. Down 22 (6%) and it didn't stop the drop

NU went down to 10%. That extra 4% is key.

Though I don't think NU typically leaks their class numbers so it'll be a while til we find out.

I honestly didn't see UVA losing the 170--thought it was possible but not likely. I would've put NU's odds of losing the 170 at 60/40 earlier. I'm guessing, given how hard UVA games medians, that they did everything they could for the 170 but it just wasn't in their power. I'd now be pretty confident in saying NU will drop. They pretty shamelessly accepted ANY 170+. I guess they're leading the charge on the return of the idea that 170+ is automatic T14.

[t-14orbust]

It astonishes me that UVA dropped class size and LSAT median. My friend with a 173 was just dropped from UVA's waitlist a few days ago after many LOCIs and promises to attend with a 90k scholarship.

It would be easier to pull more 170/171/172s without giving any(as much) aid and each of those people(171/172) would affect the LSAT median just as much as the 173 would. Don't really know how to answer the smaller class size question though

[shifty_eyed]

It astonishes me that UVA dropped class size and LSAT median. My friend with a 173 was just dropped from UVA's waitlist a few days ago after many LOCIs and promises to attend with a 90k scholarship.

Because they accepted the 169 median and took 169s off the waitlist who would attend at sticker? They started pulling 169s off and leaving 170+ until the end.

[twenty]

Yeah, okay. I'm just bitter.

[t-14orbust]

I'm still wondering about the class size drop though. If they 'accepted' the 169 median, does a smaller class size imply that they barely even held on to the 169?

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

It astonishes me that UVA dropped class size and LSAT median. My friend with a 173 was just dropped from UVA's waitlist a few days ago after many LOCIs and promises to attend with a 90k scholarship.

That's the thing. UVA left a whole bunch of 170+ students on the table. It looks like they totally could have kept it with minimal disruption to the GPA median if they were willing to drop class size by the amount they did.

[09042014]

Going from 170 to 169 isn't really a big deal. They probably decided it wasn't worth trying to buy a bunch of 170 lsat scores.

In fact, Boalt shows that its not even that big of a deal. They've been rocking some barely better than WUSTL numbers for a decade, no harm done.

It's absolutely insane that these schools throw around so much money for fucking USNEWs rankings. If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

[t-14orbust]

Going from 170 to 169 isn't really a big deal. They probably decided it wasn't worth trying to buy a bunch of 170 lsat scores.

In fact, Boalt shows that its not even that big of a deal. They've been rocking some barely better than WUSTL numbers for a decade, no harm done.

It's absolutely insane that these schools throw around so much money for fucking USNEWs rankings. If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

How do you signal to employers that your grads are worth hiring besides USNWR and historical placement?

[09042014]

Going from 170 to 169 isn't really a big deal. They probably decided it wasn't worth trying to buy a bunch of 170 lsat scores.

In fact, Boalt shows that its not even that big of a deal. They've been rocking some barely better than WUSTL numbers for a decade, no harm done.

It's absolutely insane that these schools throw around so much money for fucking USNEWs rankings. If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

How do you signal to employers that your grads are worth hiring besides USNWR and historical placement?

By being Cal, or Northwestern, or Cornell.

[bouleversement]

If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

...and yesterday then would have been your last day on the job. Law in the US is a prestige profession. In Europe less so, but it will take many years until we are there.

[hephaestus]

If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

...and yesterday then would have been your last day on the job. Law in the US is a prestige profession. In Europe less so, but it will take many years until we are there.

Yeah but firms don't care at the high end. No hiring partner is going to hire less people from Duke if it slides to 13 next year.

[04102014]

If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

...and yesterday then would have been your last day on the job. Law in the US is a prestige profession. In Europe less so, but it will take many years until we are there.

Yeah but firms don't care at the high end. No hiring partner is going to hire less people from Duke if it slides to 13 next year.

I think the fear would be that the short term slide would lead to a long term slide and everything that could entail, which I think is entirely plausible (if, of course, unlikely).

[MyNameIsFlynn!]

If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

...and yesterday then would have been your last day on the job. Law in the US is a prestige profession. In Europe less so, but it will take many years until we are there.

Yeah but firms don't care at the high end. No hiring partner is going to hire less people from Duke if it slides to 13 next year.

All of these schools can ride their preftigious reputations for a few years, but at some point declining medians / general decline -> declining rank will catch up with you. See all the talk surrounding Michigan, for example.

As for UVA, they had the chance to buy up more 17Xs but looks like they passed on it. Maybe they didn't have the money or didn't feel like it was worth it to play the game. Almost everyone else's medians will be dropping anyways.

[jbagelboy]

If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

...and yesterday then would have been your last day on the job. Law in the US is a prestige profession. In Europe less so, but it will take many years until we are there.

Yeah but firms don't care at the high end. No hiring partner is going to hire less people from Duke if it slides to 13 next year.

Hasnt Duke stayed at 169 for a long time anyway?

[09042014]

If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

...and yesterday then would have been your last day on the job. Law in the US is a prestige profession. In Europe less so, but it will take many years until we are there.

Nothing says PREFTSIGE like a failed magazine dictating your admissions or bribing someone with a 3.3/171 from UCONN with 90k.

[09042014]

Boalt has had TTT admissions numbers for a long time, and its not a TTT in decline.

Sixigan's decline is entirely internet trolling.

[bouleversement]

Someone mentioned WUSTL on another thread but their website hasn't been updated. Has there been a leak?

[Tiago Splitter]

If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

...and yesterday then would have been your last day on the job. Law in the US is a prestige profession. In Europe less so, but it will take many years until we are there.

Yeah but firms don't care at the high end. No hiring partner is going to hire less people from Duke if it slides to 13 next year.

Hasnt Duke stayed at 169 for a long time anyway?

Just this past year.

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

Those saying drops in medians don't matter are right only in an intrinsic context. To the extent that medians affect USNWR (or are metrics themselves used by applicants), it is important because USNWR is still far and away the number one metric applicants use to decide what school to attend, much as we may all think LST is more valid. It's a positive feedback loop that can become a vicious circle for schools who decline--ask Illinois. Each one-spot difference in USNWR is worth millions--literally millions--to any school.

[timbs4339]

Those saying drops in medians don't matter are right only in an intrinsic context. To the extent that medians affect USNWR (or are metrics themselves used by applicants), it is important because USNWR is still far and away the number one metric applicants use to decide what school to attend, much as we may all think LST is more valid. It's a positive feedback loop that can become a vicious circle for schools who decline--ask Illinois. Each one-spot difference in USNWR is worth millions--literally millions--to any school.

A more cynical version of this is that USNWR rank is the easiest metric (along with donations) to track the job performance of deans, and some deans want to move up the dean career path, which at the highest (sometimes lowest in the law school setting) is extraordinarily lucrative.

[bouleversement]

Those saying drops in medians don't matter are right only in an intrinsic context. To the extent that medians affect USNWR (or are metrics themselves used by applicants), it is important because USNWR is still far and away the number one metric applicants use to decide what school to attend, much as we may all think LST is more valid. It's a positive feedback loop that can become a vicious circle for schools who decline--ask Illinois. Each one-spot difference in USNWR is worth millions--literally millions--to any school.

Exactly. It is delusional to believe school #n does not want to beat school #n-1. We have seen that may be a greater motivator than the employment prospects of a given school's graduates.

[Mal Reynolds]

Going from 170 to 169 isn't really a big deal. They probably decided it wasn't worth trying to buy a bunch of 170 lsat scores.

In fact, Boalt shows that its not even that big of a deal. They've been rocking some barely better than WUSTL numbers for a decade, no harm done.

It's absolutely insane that these schools throw around so much money for fucking USNEWs rankings. If I were a dean, I'd end that shit yesterday.

How do you signal to employers that your grads are worth hiring besides USNWR and historical placement?

This shit already? JFC

[BigZuck]

I'm still wondering about the class size drop though. If they 'accepted' the 169 median, does a smaller class size imply that they barely even held on to the 169?

I was one of the last people they let in off the waitlist (I believe I was the last one to report so on this site) and they offered me 60K with a 169/3.75. I assumed they were barely keeping the 169 considering that. But as other people said, looks like they could have easily had higher LSAT scores so I guess not.