Notre Dame Forum

[DaRascal]

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[TheSpanishMain]

My vote: ND is a good school if you want to work in the Midwest AND you get a fat discount. At sticker, no.

C'mon, on some level you know this. Liking the weather and LSAT retake pressure are not good reasons.

[twenty]

Notre Dame Law is not an exceptionally great school by any means, and does not seem to place very well for what it intends to accomplish. Less than a third are getting a federal clerkship or biglaw. That's bad.

Also, Notre Dame's LRAP program is fairly shoddy.

EDIT> I still voted yes, though. If you want to go to law school this badly, go. With PAYE, no amount of debt is going to "ruin" you, it's just going to suck for, oh, 10-20 years.

[DaRascal]

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[balzie94]

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[DaRascal]

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[TA923]

You already turned down BC at sticker, which, if you're gunning for NYC, is a much better option.

[TheThriller]

You already turned down BC at sticker, which, if you're gunning for NYC, is a much better option.

DaRasc, I know you've heard this but you gotta retake. Volunteer for a year or something while you study for a retake.

[Nova]

You obviously know TLS will not endorse T30 at sticker. The odds are stacked too high against you to make attending a reasonable choice. Are you cool with a small law salary + being a lrap slave?

As a urm with a 3.5, schools where you are at or above the lsat median will definitely offer you big scholarships if admitted.

[ManoftheHour]

You already turned down BC at sticker, which, if you're gunning for NYC, is a much better option.

[zozin]

I'm thinking I should attend seeing as it won't necessarily ruin my life

Yea bro, $240K in graduating debt is no big deal. That accruing interest is killer. Going to law school at sticker because you can't pay your $35K is stupid.

[DaRascal]

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[ManoftheHour]

OP, don't go.

You can get a better LSAT score. As you said, you've been making strides. Even if you don't reach your goal, you can still retake December, no?

Regardless of whether you can do better on the LSAT or not, going to ND with your goals is insane. You'd be much better going to a lesser ranked school in the area in which you want to practice in with $$$.

It's not worth going for that "top 25 prestige."

I would know. I was someone who almost made the mistake of going:

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=203182

[andythefir]

Hey guys, just off the ND waitlist. I was really high on Notre Dame and I know from everything I've read on here that most TLSers think attending at sticker price wouldn't be a sound decision.


Pros:
-Great School
-Excellent chance at a legal job
-Prefer colder weather
-Having trouble finding a job (recent college grad) and have 35k in loans to pay back starting in December
-Saves me the pressure of an LSAT retake
-Still could gamble on getting off a T14 waitlist really late

Cons:
-Sticker Price
-shoddy biglaw chances
-Unsure about NDLS' LRAP
-Have been making strides for my October retake
-Worried the debt could ruin me

I'm thinking I should attend seeing as it won't necessarily ruin my life and law school is a gamble in general. Thoughts?

As a total ND homer, I would not recommend going at sticker without any family contribution. That being said, 2012 did much better than 2011 and 2013 did much better than 2012. The CDO had a complete turnover in the middle of the year for the class of 2012. The new CDO is much, much better. In my experience ND is a niche school, great for getting big firms in small towns or clerkships with conservative judges. The downside is that it doesn't do as well in the huge cities, which is where you need to be to pay off $300k in loans.

[francesfarmer]

You already turned down BC at sticker, which, if you're gunning for NYC, is a much better option.

Are you sure about that??? Doesn't seem quite right.

Besides, you also have to consider the small class size at ND and much cheaper cost of living.

BC has only marginally better employment rates and placement in NY, but ND's higher tuition makes your COA a wash.
http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=bc
http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=notredame

Neither is a good choice at sticker. Retake. You won't regret it.

[DaRascal]

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[WokeUpInACar]

Bro you know the answer to this question.

[francesfarmer]

As a urm with a 3.5, schools where you are at or above the lsat median will definitely offer you big scholarships if admitted.

Therein lies a big part of the problem. I think I'm improving a lot but anything can happen on test day. It's just so tempting to go right now and just work like a beast especially since Notre Dame has a small class. I do remember reading some posts on TLS validating attending schools like ND, Vandy, and WUSTL at sticker price because of the lifelong value of the degree even if you don't get biglaw.

Do you honestly think it is easier to get stellar grades during your 1L year than it is to do well on the LSAT, a highly learnable and generally predictable test? You are obviously just trying to justify the (poor) decision to go to ND at sticker. Don't do it. You have your whole life to go to law school. I almost went to Georgetown 3 years ago for sticker price but decided not to at the last second and now I'm going to a T6 for less than sticker, bro! Don't do it! Sky's the limit!

[DaRascal]

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[francesfarmer]

The downside is that it doesn't do as well in the huge cities, which is where you need to be to pay off $300k in loans.

Forgot to mention that I'll get helped out with living expenses so I'd take out only ~$170k in loans to cover tuition, books, and my end of the rent.

Still a shit ton, still too much.

[DaRascal]

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[twenty]

Ugh looks like this might not be such a good idea.
I'm about 50/50 on this. Strongly considering Twenty's advice.

I'm not advising you to go as much as I'm advising you to completely understand what you're getting yourself into. Suppose you do PAYE for the next 20 years because you either 1) can't get a legal job or 2) can't get a legal job that is enough to pay off your debt. There is a 2/3rds likelihood that "that" will end up being you.

Even with PAYE, you'll likely be paying 105k or so over the next 20 years. That's a ton of money. Granted, it's over a long period of time, but just understand that before you make any big decisions here.

[CourCour]

I'm non-URM w/ a 3.01 and I got cash from schools $90k in T-25 and $30k in T-14. How many questions going the other way are standing between you and going to the law school you want?

You can request a forbearance if you don't find a job on your current debt. Do something meaningful with your time though like intern. Maybe work on a campaign (teaches you work ethic like nothing else.) I'm usually not a naysayer (esp. by TLS standards) but it seems like you can do better. Truthfully I'm surprised that you didn't already (you're 3.49, 161 right?). Retake that LSAT and put together a solid app ready to submit early.

[unc0mm0n1]

Ugh looks like this might not be such a good idea.
I'm about 50/50 on this. Strongly considering Twenty's advice.

Just go. You clearly couldn't care less what anyone on here says unless they agree with you. So I agree with you. Go have a great time and after you graduate come on here and educate the next crop of prospective law students on the perils of going into huge debt with uncertain job prospects.

[Clearly]

You're either trolling, or actually delusional. Just retake, ND doesn't place well, and you'll never get back to ny. You are aurm, no one cares about your gpa, go get a 170 and enjoy t10.