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Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:02 pm**

I've been lucky enough to have had a pretty lucky cycle so far, which leaves me with the paradox of choice. I know that S is the TLS answer, but I, as an east coaster, am very torn. Financially, I am very lucky to have parents who can help out interest free (so 'debt' but not formal loans). I have substantial ties to NYC, Philly, and NC (friends, family, college, grad school, etc.) which make the prospect of leaving hard. Professionally, I am interested in government/PI work but could easily do IP (engineering/natural science undergraduate degree).

I am waiting on financial aid from S and Columbia; I've received ~50k from Penn and NYU, ~90k from Chicago and ~125k from Duke (over three years).

I'm really torn and would really appreciate any thoughts and advice. Thanks!

Edited to reflect chicago award. Does this change anything?

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:09 pm**

Obviously Stanford

But nonstanford wise and for PI/govt, NYU places.the most in those categories.

I'd say Duke=NYU then Penn. But really, Stanford.

Chicago and CLS are out at sticker

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:26 pm**

I would kill babies for S and not even blink. Take the S and run.

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:32 pm**

I'd go Stanford, obviously. But, it sounds like you would be really unhappy out there. I don't like Duke at all, and NYU is only marginally better than Penn. So, it really comes down to Philly vs. NYC.

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:35 pm**

5buildingsin1 wrote:Professionally, I am interested in government/PI work but could easily do IP (engineering/natural science undergraduate degree).

Your goals point to Stanford. S will place among the best into prestigious gov/PI and S + IP is the closest thing to a guaranteed job as you can realistically get.

5buildingsin1 wrote:I have substantial ties to NYC, Philly, and NC (friends, family, college, grad school, etc.) which make the prospect of leaving hard.

I know this makes it tougher to choose S, but you could always come back east for summers if you want. Some people would even say that the separation from your current friends may make bonding with other law students easier. Maybe you're not that type of person, but the distance may not be a completely negative thing.

5buildingsin1 wrote:Financially, I am very lucky to have parents who can help out interest free (so 'debt' but not formal loans).

This will mitigate the cost of S if you choose to go that direction.

Obviously you can't go wrong with any of your options. Congrats!

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:36 pm**

twinkletoes16 wrote:I would kill babies for S and not even blink. Take the S and run.

+1

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:50 pm**

Eh, I don't think it's as easy as people think. I think Duke is pretty close to Stanford.

There are some problems though. Since you're taking out a "loan" from your folks, you won't be eligible for IBR/PSLF/LRAP coverage that you would if you took out gov loans. This is important since you want to do PI/gov work. As nice as it is that you could have interest free loans, I suspect you might actually save more money by getting fed loans and PSLF/LRAPing them away (assuming you get PI/gov work). If you truly want PI/gov work, I'd probably take fed loans and go to SLS.

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:56 pm**

bk187 wrote:Eh, I don't think it's as easy as people think. I think Duke is pretty close to Stanford.

There are some problems though. Since you're taking out a "loan" from your folks, you won't be eligible for IBR/PSLF/LRAP coverage that you would if you took out gov loans. This is important since you want to do PI/gov work. As nice as it is that you could have interest free loans, I suspect you might actually save more money by getting fed loans and PSLF/LRAPing them away (assuming you get PI/gov work). If you truly want PI/gov work, I'd probably take fed loans and go to SLS.

Good point on the eligibility of LRAP loans. Also, not sure if private loans are eligible for LRAP at Stanford, but if they are, have your parents co-sign on your loans there so you can get a lower interest rate than what the federal government offers.

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:55 pm**

This is going to sound horrible, but who cares if you're not completely happy for 3 years... it's SLS. SLS. You'll have more than enough mobility after graduating to return to the east coast to practice law.

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:59 pm**

Stanford. Stanford. Stanford.

If you hate living in Palo Alto you can live in SF your 2L or 3L year. Stanford has the best IP program of the schools listed and leaves you none-the-worse off for any PI/government jobs. In fact, the high clerkship rate probably opens up a number of prestigious PI jobs that would otherwise be unavailable if you didn't get a clerkship out of your other choices.

Posted: **Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:43 am**

If you love NYC, go to Columbia or NYU. Yeah, TLS says Stanford, but hey, it's your life. But I'm pretty sure going to Stanford isn't going to deter you from coming back to east coast at all. If you want to minimize your debt (since you mentioned your interest in government/PI work) choose either Penn or Duke.

Just by curiosity, any chance with Harvard or Yale? If you love east coast and get into any of those two, I guess it's for the best.

If I were you, I'm going to Columbia, I love NYC too much. To me, the only two schools that can turn Columbia down are Harvard and Yale.

Posted: **Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:50 am**

Can you please come back and tell us if the notoriously stingy Columbia gives you $$$??? Are they going to make your make your cash flow? Kinda like that song by Krayzie Bone- Paper. Please do tell.

Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKgidyBncZI

Posted: **Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:03 pm**

Edited OP to reflect 90k Chicago award. Does that change anything?

Posted: **Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:16 pm**

5buildingsin1 wrote:Edited OP to reflect 90k Chicago award. Does that change anything?

Definitely. I think you would be crazy to take stanford at sticker with 90k sitting at Chicago

Posted: **Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:18 pm**

BigLawer wrote:
5buildingsin1 wrote:Edited OP to reflect 90k Chicago award. Does that change anything?
Definitely. I think you would be crazy to take stanford at sticker with 90k sitting at Chicago

Posted: **Sat Apr 06, 2013 2:56 am**

BigLawer wrote:
5buildingsin1 wrote:Edited OP to reflect 90k Chicago award. Does that change anything?
Definitely. I think you would be crazy to take stanford at sticker with 90k sitting at Chicago

Incorrect. Stanford is worth every penny. Stanford owns. Go there, earn them big bucks, kill life.

Posted: **Sat Apr 06, 2013 3:22 am**

Yeah the immediate 180 to Chi confused me as well. With OP's stated interest in career choice SLS still seems like a pretty easy choice.
Move away from fam for a few years, enjoy the best coast, profit.

Posted: **Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:39 pm**

jselson wrote:
BigLawer wrote:
5buildingsin1 wrote:Edited OP to reflect 90k Chicago award. Does that change anything?
Definitely. I think you would be crazy to take stanford at sticker with 90k sitting at Chicago
Incorrect. Stanford is worth every penny. Stanford owns. Go there, earn them big bucks, kill life.

You must be an 0L, seriously if you think Stanford is worth 90k more than Chicago, you are crazy.

Posted: **Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:43 pm**

jselson wrote:
BigLawer wrote:
5buildingsin1 wrote:Edited OP to reflect 90k Chicago award. Does that change anything?
Definitely. I think you would be crazy to take stanford at sticker with 90k sitting at Chicago
Incorrect. Stanford is worth every penny. Stanford owns. Go there, earn them big bucks, kill life.

Yeah, you seem like you dont know what you are talking about, or you are just trolling?

OP, 90k over Chicago is an easy choice over Stanford at sticker. I know you want PI work right now, but this could change. In any case, having that 100+ less in debt (with less interest and lower COL in Chicago than neat Stanford) will give you much more freedom to do what you want. Stanford will not give you a huge leg up on Chicago.

Posted: **Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:38 am**

BigLawer wrote:
jselson wrote:
BigLawer wrote:
5buildingsin1 wrote:Edited OP to reflect 90k Chicago award. Does that change anything?
Definitely. I think you would be crazy to take stanford at sticker with 90k sitting at Chicago
Incorrect. Stanford is worth every penny. Stanford owns. Go there, earn them big bucks, kill life.
You must be an 0L, seriously if you think Stanford is worth 90k more than Chicago, you are crazy.

I think jselson has a perfectly valid point. depending on career goals stanford could easily be worth 90k more than any school other than hy. just for getting a biglaw job, I agree BigLawyer, OP can go to uchicago or better yet make columbia match it and go there and be just as well off. but there are other opportunities (arguably unpriceable IMO) offered by stanford esp on west coast and in DC that you would have to get top 10% of the class at chicago to attain

Posted: **Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:52 am**

Are you sure Stanford isn't giving you any aid? If $0 from Stanford, unless you are sure you don't want BigLaw, take Chi - your starting salary from Chi is 160K, your starting salary from Stanford... 160K.

However, if you are 100% sure that you want PI, why not just take out loans (which you won't have to repay) and go to Stanford?

Actually, if you really wanna make shit happen, take the money from your parents, now, earn interest on it (I know, interest rates are extremely low), go to S, take out loans also, use those loans to pay tuition. Go into PI, let the Gov pay your way. Profit. (The interest on money from your parents will still be sitting there, waiting for your use, after you repay your parents.).

Posted: **Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:54 am**

Pope Francis wrote: Actually, if you really wanna make shit happen, take the money from your parents, now, earn interest on it (I know, interest rates are extremely low), go to S, take out loans also, use those loans to pay tuition. Go into PI, let the Gov pay your way. Profit. (The interest on money from your parents will still be sitting there, waiting for your use, after you repay your parents.).

Wut.

Posted: **Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:20 am**

Bildungsroman wrote:
Pope Francis wrote: Actually, if you really wanna make shit happen, take the money from your parents, now, earn interest on it (I know, interest rates are extremely low), go to S, take out loans also, use those loans to pay tuition. Go into PI, let the Gov pay your way. Profit. (The interest on money from your parents will still be sitting there, waiting for your use, after you repay your parents.).
Wut.

Look, all I'm saying is someone is giving me interest free loans and I'm not taking them? I know, probably a bad idea considering the things that could go wrong, but I feel like the odds of not getting PI coming from S are low enough that OP can at least entertain the possibility.

Posted: **Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:29 am**

Can you qualify for LRAP or w/e the PI repayment program is if you have 200k+ sitting in bonds? I hope not.

Posted: **Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:35 am**

sinfiery wrote:Can you qualify for LRAP or w/e the PI repayment program is if you have 200k+ sitting in bonds? I hope not.

Fine, FFS, just skip the charade and ask your parents for the interest they earn on the money they would have given you.

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