Intl human rights - Harvard, Stanford or Yale? Forum

[balagan]

Hello,

I have had the very good fortune of being admitted to my top three law school choices: Harvard, Stanford and Yale... Unfortunately, too much good news has resulted in a very difficult decision for me, and I would greatly appreciate your advice, specifically with regard to each school's relative strength in the fields of international human rights and transitional justice.

I do not intend to pursue a career in academia, but would instead like to work in post-genocide and post-mass atrocity contexts, devising accountability mechanisms to enable the delivery of justice. I hope to be based in New York, and/or to work with governments and international NGOs.

I realize that there can be no bad choice at this point - but surely there can be a best choice. Thank you so much for your help!!

[John_rizzy_rawls]

If you got into Yale, go to Yale.

Also - http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... 1&t=163901

[K Rock]

Nobody is going to be able to answer this. There aren't very many people practicing "international human rights law" so it is impossible for any of us to tell you how these schools compare in this regard. I would also be prepared to not work in that field since there are likely very few jobs in it.

That said, at equal cost go to Yale.

[BerkeleyBear]

I do not intend to pursue a career in academia, but would instead like to work in post-genocide and post-mass atrocity contexts, devising accountability mechanisms to enable the delivery of justice

Cut the shit and go to Yale.

[Ti Malice]

All three will have clinics, classes, and other programs and resources relevant to your interests.

But the correct answer is Yale.

[Bobnoxious]

If you want to work in international human rights, you'd probably be better off if you went and got yourself a Masters or PhD in Poli-Sci with a concentration in comparative politics or international relations and make sure you get your hands on the right internships and contacts while you're on that path. Otherwise, publish, publish, present, present, and make a name for yourself as *the* expert in whatever little niche you want to work in. IMHO

http://www.ohchr.org/EN/AboutUs/Pages/W ... ities.aspx

[Redamon1]

Welcome to TLS. Glad to have you contribute.

[UtilityMonster]

I do not intend to pursue a career in academia, but would instead like to work in post-genocide and post-mass atrocity contexts, devising accountability mechanisms to enable the delivery of justice. I hope to be based in New York, and/or to work with governments and international NGOs.

How are you so dead set on this? What a random thing to base a law decision on. Genocides are declining in frequency and magnitude, so I wouldn't be surprised if you have serious trouble landing a job.

[balagan]

Thanks for your helpful contributions, please keep them coming!

I was under the impression that Harvard might offer some advantages to Yale in this case, given the specific nature of my interests, and the greater amount of resources HLS offers (in part due to its sheer size and number of classes).
...thoughts, anyone?

FYI Harvard, Yale and Stanford all admitted me based on this particular interest of mine, around which all of my application materials were tailored, so I have no reason (at all) to assume that there are no related legal jobs (think ICC, No Peace Without Justice, tribunals in Cambodia, Sierra Leone, etc.). Genocides may (or may not) be declining in frequency, but the need for justice post-genocide is not.

[jselson]

H or Y, if you got into HYS, you're a top 50 candidate out of everyone, so you should do fine no matter what. H you'll have to work harder because of the bigger class, and Y you'll have more to fall back on. Really, just visit the schools and whichever you "feel" is better is the one I'd go to. Personally, I'd give the edge to Y, but I don't wanna do international justice, so I don't know much.

[Rahviveh]

Thanks for your helpful contributions, please keep them coming!

I was under the impression that Harvard might offer some advantages to Yale in this case, given the specific nature of my interests, and the greater amount of resources HLS offers (in part due to its sheer size and number of classes).
...thoughts, anyone?

FYI Harvard, Yale and Stanford all admitted me based on this particular interest of mine, around which all of my application materials were tailored, so I have no reason (at all) to assume that there are no related legal jobs (think ICC, No Peace Without Justice, tribunals in Cambodia, Sierra Leone, etc.). Genocides may (or may not) be declining in frequency, but the need for justice post-genocide is not.

FYI, I'm sure there were other parts of your app that HYS liked - I'm betting you have a 3.9 and a 175+ score - at least one or the other.

Not saying your interest wasn't a factor. But don't pay any attention to what admissions offices think about the job market, even at HYS.

[Dr. Dre]

I do not intend to pursue a career in academia, but would instead like to work in post-genocide and post-mass atrocity contexts, devising accountability mechanisms to enable the delivery of justice

Cut the shit and go to Yale.

[Dr. Dre]

don't pay any attention to what admissions offices think about the job market, even at HYS.

[monathenomad]

Thanks for your helpful contributions, please keep them coming!

I was under the impression that Harvard might offer some advantages to Yale in this case, given the specific nature of my interests, and the greater amount of resources HLS offers (in part due to its sheer size and number of classes).
...thoughts, anyone?

FYI Harvard, Yale and Stanford all admitted me based on this particular interest of mine, around which all of my application materials were tailored, so I have no reason (at all) to assume that there are no related legal jobs (think ICC, No Peace Without Justice, tribunals in Cambodia, Sierra Leone, etc.). Genocides may (or may not) be declining in frequency, but the need for justice post-genocide is not.

I have so much respect for you. Couldn't agree more with that last sentence. Have you thought about applying to a public policy/international relations graduate program? I'm sure HKS (Harvard Kennedy School) would admit you in a heartbeat.

[nebula666]

Idk if Yale offers an "I want to save the world" certificate but you can try

[Elston Gunn]

I understand that TLS has a (justifiable) eye-roll reflex when they hear "international human rights law," but I don't think it's quite justified in this case. That said, OP, understand that even with an HYS degree and a background in this stuff, there's a really good chance that you won't find someone to pay you to do this out of law school. In fact, if you're really set on it, you're the classic case of someone who will end up in one of the school-funded jobs, possibly even for two years, as I don't think international NGOs really hire entry-level. People do take this career path from Yale, however, it's just difficult.

Also, I don't know about what H and S offer in the area, but Yale has this fairly badass clinic in International Human Rights: http://www.law.yale.edu/intellectuallif ... clinic.htm
I'd say one of your best possible outcomes in the area is to end up as a fellow for the Lowenstein Clinic or something similar when you graduate.

[worldtraveler]

I'm working in this field after graduation, so I know a fair bit about what it takes to get a job. Go to Yale. Seriously. I don't know how this is even a question. To get a job in this field it's far easier if your law school will just pay you to do a fellowship after graduation, and Yale does this for just about anyone.

However, I'm really confused as to how you have this goal and are also hoping to stay in NY. The ICC is not in NY, nor are any of the hybrid tribunals. There are some UN jobs (incredibly competitive) and jobs with the ICTJ, HRW, and such in NY but if you are working out of your head office then you would likely be working on other initiatives. In addition, the ICTY and the ICTR are almost finished, and the Special Court for Sierra Leone is done. If you want to work on this now, the ICC is where to be, and getting hired there as an American is pretty tough.

Any decent NGO is also going to expect you to have some field experience. Are you comfortable living and working in places where genocides occur? If you get a job to go to Syria to be a human rights observer, can you actually handle that? It's astounding the number of people I meet who want to do international human rights and also want to live in comfort and want to approach it from behind the safety of a desk.

[Bobnoxious]

It's astounding the number of people I meet who want to do international human rights and also want to live in comfort and want to approach it from behind the safety of a desk.

This!

[jyrkchicken]

I'm a 0L so take what I say with a huge helping of salt, and I will be attending HLS next fall, so I really only know about them, but this is one of my area's of interest so as far as Human Rights resources go at HLS:

There is a dedicated HR journal, one of the clinics is specifically HR focused, and there is also a human rights Student Practice Organization. If you want to do Human Rights, there will be more Human Rights than you could handle at Harvard.

They also make it very easy to apply to the joint degree program with the Kennedy School (they will accept your LSAT and let you apply during your 1L year) and they would probably also be totally open to you doing a joint degree with the Fletcher school at Tufts, although obviously that might be more complicated.

Edit: I'm sure Yale does this too, but HLS will also give you summer funding during your 1L summer to do basically whatever PI thing you want, which could get you some cool HR experience.

[worldtraveler]

I'm a 0L so take what I say with a huge helping of salt, and I will be attending HLS next fall, so I really only know about them, but this is one of my area's of interest so as far as Human Rights resources go at HLS:

There is a dedicated HR journal, one of the clinics is specifically HR focused, and there is also a human rights Student Practice Organization. If you want to do Human Rights, there will be more Human Rights than you could handle at Harvard.

They also make it very easy to apply to the joint degree program with the Kennedy School (they will accept your LSAT and let you apply during your 1L year) and they would probably also be totally open to you doing a joint degree with the Fletcher school at Tufts, although obviously that might be more complicated.

Edit: I'm sure Yale does this too, but HLS will also give you summer funding during your 1L summer to do basically whatever PI thing you want, which could get you some cool HR experience.

No one in human rights cares about you being on a journal. The things you should be looking at are LRAP and debt costs, post-graduate fellowship options, placement of fellows in Skadden/EJW type fellowships, summer funding opportunities, alumni base in organizations/places you might want to work.

Every T14 has some kind of human rights/public interest clinic. All of them offer roughly the same courses. They all have big name profs. They all have human rights committees and clubs and externship options.

The big differences are name recognition and alumni base, where Harvard and Yale have a big advantage. The second is in graduate fellowship opportunities. It is HARD to get a paid position in human rights straight out of a JD. If your school will fund you for a year or two, you have such a massive advantage that it's hard to even describe.

[awal41]

I'm in a similar situation in terms of interests and schools.

I'm interested to hear what TLSers think with money thrown in the mix too. Full tuition NYU vs. sticker at HYS?

[Elston Gunn]

I'm in a similar situation in terms of interests and schools.

I'm interested to hear what TLSers think with money thrown in the mix too. Full tuition NYU vs. sticker at HYS?

How badly do you want to work in international human rights? Which HYS?

[worldtraveler]

I'm in a similar situation in terms of interests and schools.

I'm interested to hear what TLSers think with money thrown in the mix too. Full tuition NYU vs. sticker at HYS?

What are your specific interests?