If your scores are less than 3.0 and 160 you have no chance Forum

[dingbat]

Before you ask, with such a low score you will not get a scholarship anywhere and the only schools that will accept you have such abysmal employment prospects that you will fuck up your life by paying to attend. So don't ask.

[florida1949]

but i'm gonna work really hard and be #1 in my class

[WhiteyCakes]

Best TLS PSA there has ever been!

[Burne182]

That's not always fair. I'm below both and got into several T1 schools with reasonable in-state tuition and got nearly full tuition scholarships to a few regionally solid T2s. I'm nontraditional but not URM, so it's obviously possible.

[dingbat]

That's not always fair. I'm below both and got into several T1 schools with reasonable in-state tuition and got nearly full tuition scholarships to a few regionally solid T2s. I'm nontraditional but not URM, so it's obviously possible.

When I wrote it, I was thinking of someone at my T30 whose scores are lower than that. However, we're talking about a non-trad with exceptional softs. There are exceptions, but apart from the fact that it's impossible to predict their chances, they are few and far between, and hopefully aware of their exceptional/unusual status, to the point that A) they don't ask a bunch of twenty-somethings for advice and B) they know that they don't fit the typical mold

[20130312]

That's not always fair. I'm below both and got into several T1 schools with reasonable in-state tuition and got nearly full tuition scholarships to a few regionally solid T2s. I'm nontraditional but not URM, so it's obviously possible.

--ImageRemoved--

[dingbat]

but i'm gonna work really hard and be #1 in my class

that and a ticket will get you a ride on the bus for to the welfare office

[justonemoregame]

I wonder how many law students this would wipe out - like 20,000?

That's not always fair. I'm below both and got into several T1 schools with reasonable in-state tuition and got nearly full tuition scholarships to a few regionally solid T2s. I'm nontraditional but not URM, so it's obviously possible.

Your post-grad debt at that T-2 is still likely to be over $100,000 even with your scholarship. And in-state sticker at a flagship public below Texas being worth it is blue flame. I know that's touted around here as being a reasonable option, but it's really just a less-bad decision than taking out more debt for a school with comparable options.

Even the cheapest public at sticker will virtually guarantee you a 2-1 debt-income ratio at graduation, if not worse, for a coin-flip's chance of becoming an attorney.

Now if your other option is to mop floors at McDonald's for a living, well then I can see how gunning for a 2-1 DTI sounds pretty good.

[Burne182]

That's not always fair. I'm below both and got into several T1 schools with reasonable in-state tuition and got nearly full tuition scholarships to a few regionally solid T2s. I'm nontraditional but not URM, so it's obviously possible.

When I wrote it, I was thinking of someone at my T30 whose scores are lower than that. However, we're talking about a non-trad with exceptional softs. There are exceptions, but apart from the fact that it's impossible to predict their chances, they are few and far between, and hopefully aware of their exceptional/unusual status, to the point that A) they don't ask a bunch of twenty-somethings for advice and B) they know that they don't fit the typical mold

That makes perfect sense. I probably shouldn't have commented here, just thought it was unfair to assume anyone with those numbers cannot succeed.

Also it's sort of rediculous to assume I will be taking mountains of debt. Even with a moderate cost of living, with scholarships (and partial GI bill) I will not have to take out a dime in loans should I attend the T2's I'm considering.

I really wasn't trying to instigate, nor am I now, I just think it's possible to succeed outside of T14.

[WhiteyCakes]

It isn't really fair to compare anyone with a GI bill to anyone without....you're a unique case.

[FeelTheHeat]

I'd probably stick to orgasm advice

[dingbat]

Also it's sort of rediculous to assume I will be taking mountains of debt. Even with a moderate cost of living, with scholarships (and partial GI bill) I will not have to take out a dime in loans should I attend the T2's I'm considering.

I'm not surprised by the fact you're military. That seems to be the big exception.
Beside that, if someone can live at home and is guaranteed employment in their parent's 10 attorney firm, or guaranteed in-house in the family business, then sure, it makes sense. For the other 99% of applicants, no, it doesn't

I just think it's possible to succeed outside of T14.

I firmly agree with this. However, there are very few (if any) schools outside the T14 that can possibly justify sticker (some would even say no school is worth sticker) and in order to get a scholarship, numbers will need to be higher than those listed.
There are schools that give small scholarships to people with lower scores, but it will only be an insignificant amount and those schools are barely worth attending for free.

[ajax]

Before you ask, with such a low score you will not get a scholarship anywhere and the only schools that will accept you have such abysmal employment prospects that you will fuck up your life by paying to attend. So don't ask.

If this post is serious, then I am in absolute agreement with you Dingbat. Never thought I'd see the day!

[dingbat]

Before you ask, with such a low score you will not get a scholarship anywhere and the only schools that will accept you have such abysmal employment prospects that you will fuck up your life by paying to attend. So don't ask.

If this post is serious, then I am in absolute agreement with you Dingbat. Never thought I'd see the day!

You and I have a difference on where it lies, but we both agree that there is a minimum bar for what school and cost of attendance is reasonable. In all likelihood, I think we're not that far off, either.

[dextermorgan]

It's not that you have no chance (of getting in), but that you SHOULD NOT go.

[dingbat]

It's not that you have no chance (of getting in), but that you SHOULD NOT go.

It's not that you have no chance of getting in, it's that you have no chance of succeeding at life owing an exceedingly large, non-dischargeable debt and a degree barely worth its weight in used toilet paper.

[Zoomie]

That's not always fair. I'm below both and got into several T1 schools with reasonable in-state tuition and got nearly full tuition scholarships to a few regionally solid T2s. I'm nontraditional but not URM, so it's obviously possible.

When I wrote it, I was thinking of someone at my T30 whose scores are lower than that. However, we're talking about a non-trad with exceptional softs. There are exceptions, but apart from the fact that it's impossible to predict their chances, they are few and far between, and hopefully aware of their exceptional/unusual status, to the point that A) they don't ask a bunch of twenty-somethings for advice and B) they know that they don't fit the typical mold

100% agree with this. This post was for the masses. You know if you don't fit in the typical law school applicant pool.

[20130312]

That's not always fair. I'm below both and got into several T1 schools with reasonable in-state tuition and got nearly full tuition scholarships to a few regionally solid T2s. I'm nontraditional but not URM, so it's obviously possible.

When I wrote it, I was thinking of someone at my T30 whose scores are lower than that. However, we're talking about a non-trad with exceptional softs. There are exceptions, but apart from the fact that it's impossible to predict their chances, they are few and far between, and hopefully aware of their exceptional/unusual status, to the point that A) they don't ask a bunch of twenty-somethings for advice and B) they know that they don't fit the typical mold

100% agree with this. This post was for the masses. You know if you don't fit in the typical law school applicant pool.

Don't give people an excuse to call themselves a special snowflake. Prospective lawl students would jump at the opportunity.

[SemperLegal]

Just because you can, does not mean you should.

The GI Bill is a one time benefit potentially worth 250k. Do not waste it anywhere that you wouldn't be willing to pay. Use your savings to get a personal tutor and get those LSATs up. If you did UG pre-military, most adcomms will ignore your GPA.

[dingbat]

Just because you can, does not mean you should.

The GI Bill is a one time benefit potentially worth 250k. Do not waste it anywhere that you wouldn't be willing to pay. Use your savings to get a personal tutor and get those LSATs up. If you did UG pre-military, most adcomms will ignore your GPA.

Now you're overstating things.
It depends on the school, how many years it's been, and what you've accomplished.
It's entirely possible to get to the point where scores don't matter, but 18 months guard duty on a domestic base won't make any difference

[SemperLegal]

Just because you can, does not mean you should.

The GI Bill is a one time benefit potentially worth 250k. Do not waste it anywhere that you wouldn't be willing to pay. Use your savings to get a personal tutor and get those LSATs up. If you did UG pre-military, most adcomms will ignore your GPA.

Now you're overstating things.
It depends on the school, how many years it's been, and what you've accomplished.
It's entirely possible to get to the point where scores don't matter, but 18 months guard duty on a domestic base won't make any difference

If you have 3 years of active duty (2 deployments for us Reservists with a little creativity), thats 100% of tuition + Housing allowance which equals around $200,000. Rather than waste it at a TTT state school, spend a couple grand on an LSAT tutor and shoot for a full scholarship or Uva, Mich, or Berk.

If your name doesn't rhyme with Rakota Liar, military softs are never going to be that much of a game changer when it comes to LSATS

[dingbat]

If your name doesn't rhyme with Rakota Liar, military softs are never going to be that much of a game changer when it comes to LSATS

I don't understand what you're rhyming, but there are a few people at my school who have significantly outperformed their LSAT - including someone more than 10 points below median

[BarbellDreams]

While I don't agree with the statement as a whole, I think you have the right idea. If I had a 2.9/159, refused to retake, refused to work for WE and to save $, and wanted law school and nothing else I would go to a TTTT in a region where I was 100% sure I wanted to live for at least 10 years, the competition isn't horrendous and I get some sort of scholly with no stips. Duquesne is a prime example, they are as widely represented in Pittsburgh as Pitt in terms of alums, and the attorneys in Pittsburgh absolutely do not care about the ranking at all. Outside of Pitt there is little competition. Many schools in the south have the same type of reputation. But, with all that said, the smart play is to retake and work.

[justonemoregame]

This message should be posted up on I-95 billboards every 30 miles from Miami to New York.

[indo]

but i'm gonna work really hard and be #1 in my class

I would NOT hard and be LAST in the class.