Top Law Schools

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bump - any help is greatly appreciated, on a small timetable!

Neither school is worth it without significant guaranteed cash money. I wouldn't take either for anything less than a full tuition scholarship that's guaranteed. And even then you have to ask yourself whether these schools, even if free, are worth the time and energy invested. With a Fordham JD, how do you expect to compete with Columbia, NYU, Cornell and Ivy grads, which filter heavily into NYC. It's suicide. The NY market is hideously saturated and with students with better than a Fordham JD.

Paying sticker for Georgetown is insane. It's a JD factory. But assuming, as a thought exercise, both schools offer you full scholarship, Georgetown would probably be better. It still has a prestigious name, and nothing is quite as much of a shit-show as the NYC market..

I'd say step back and re-take or don't go to law school. Pretty simple.

locthebloke wrote:Neither school is worth it without significant guaranteed cash money. I wouldn't take either for anything less than a full tuition scholarship that's guaranteed. And even then you have to ask yourself whether these schools, even if free, are worth the time and energy invested. With a Fordham JD, how do you expect to compete with Columbia, NYU, Cornell and Ivy grads, which filter heavily into NYC. It's suicide. The NY market is hideously saturated and with students with better than a Fordham JD.

Paying sticker for Georgetown is insane. It's a JD factory. But assuming, as a thought exercise, both schools offer you full scholarship, Georgetown would probably be better. It still has a prestigious name, and nothing is quite as much of a shit-show as the NYC market..

I'd say step back and re-take or don't go to law school. Pretty simple.

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TLSwag wrote:

locthebloke wrote:Neither school is worth it without significant guaranteed cash money. I wouldn't take either for anything less than a full tuition scholarship that's guaranteed. And even then you have to ask yourself whether these schools, even if free, are worth the time and energy invested. With a Fordham JD, how do you expect to compete with Columbia, NYU, Cornell and Ivy grads, which filter heavily into NYC. It's suicide. The NY market is hideously saturated and with students with better than a Fordham JD.

Paying sticker for Georgetown is insane. It's a JD factory. But assuming, as a thought exercise, both schools offer you full scholarship, Georgetown would probably be better. It still has a prestigious name, and nothing is quite as much of a shit-show as the NYC market..

I'd say step back and re-take or don't go to law school. Pretty simple.

ok that's not really helpful homie. my choice is between these and besides you don't know what total COA is. what if i told you due to savings, parent contributions F is nearly free and GT would be ~75K

i'm asking how much more GT is worth then Fordham

That poster is way off base. Probably trolling, but still. 30k a year is a lot of money from Fordham. It makes the school actually a decent price. GULC is risky at sticker, but if there is significant parental contribution it's less of a risk. I think this comes down to how much you want big law. GULC doesn't give you tremendous odds, but they are far ahead of Fordham.

Eta: you can try to negotiate with gulc. They didn't budge much this cycle but it's worth a phone call.

TLSwag wrote:

locthebloke wrote:Neither school is worth it without significant guaranteed cash money. I wouldn't take either for anything less than a full tuition scholarship that's guaranteed. And even then you have to ask yourself whether these schools, even if free, are worth the time and energy invested. With a Fordham JD, how do you expect to compete with Columbia, NYU, Cornell and Ivy grads, which filter heavily into NYC. It's suicide. The NY market is hideously saturated and with students with better than a Fordham JD.

Paying sticker for Georgetown is insane. It's a JD factory. But assuming, as a thought exercise, both schools offer you full scholarship, Georgetown would probably be better. It still has a prestigious name, and nothing is quite as much of a shit-show as the NYC market..

I'd say step back and re-take or don't go to law school. Pretty simple.

ok that's not really helpful homie. my choice is between these and besides you don't know what total COA is. what if i told you due to savings, parent contributions F is nearly free and GT would be ~75K

i'm asking how much more GT is worth then Fordham

i'd probably go to Georgetown. Fordham wouldn't be completely insane though, especially if you want to work in NY.

top30man wrote:

TLSwag wrote:

locthebloke wrote:Neither school is worth it without significant guaranteed cash money. I wouldn't take either for anything less than a full tuition scholarship that's guaranteed. And even then you have to ask yourself whether these schools, even if free, are worth the time and energy invested. With a Fordham JD, how do you expect to compete with Columbia, NYU, Cornell and Ivy grads, which filter heavily into NYC. It's suicide. The NY market is hideously saturated and with students with better than a Fordham JD.

Paying sticker for Georgetown is insane. It's a JD factory. But assuming, as a thought exercise, both schools offer you full scholarship, Georgetown would probably be better. It still has a prestigious name, and nothing is quite as much of a shit-show as the NYC market..

I'd say step back and re-take or don't go to law school. Pretty simple.

ok that's not really helpful homie. my choice is between these and besides you don't know what total COA is. what if i told you due to savings, parent contributions F is nearly free and GT would be ~75K

i'm asking how much more GT is worth then Fordham

That poster is way off base. Probably trolling, but still. 30k a year is a lot of money from Fordham. It makes the school actually a decent price. GULC is risky at sticker, but if there is significant parental contribution it's less of a risk. I think this comes down to how much you want big law. GULC doesn't give you tremendous odds, but they are far ahead of Fordham.

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Well, alright, homie. Thanks for clarifying. But hey, if you want to go to Fordham for "nearly free" (whatever that actually means) Then it's not a horrible option, but it could still be a bad one. You have to ask yourself if it's worth the investment in time and energy. Your chances of getting gainful legal employment with a Fordham JD aren't great. And your JD will hurt your prospects in looking for employment in other realms. JDs "overqualify" you outside the legal sphere.

Having 75k in debt for a GT JD is absurd. Don't go to GT. Fordham if you must, but I'd say don't go. Why are you so dead set on law school. There are many more profitable, more fulfilling, less stressful and uncertain things to do with 3 years of your life.

"Off-base". Okay. Whatever.

locthebloke wrote:Well, alright, homie. Thanks for clarifying. But hey, if you want to go to Fordham for "nearly free" (whatever that actually means) Then it's not a horrible option, but it could still be a bad one. You have to ask yourself if it's worth the investment in time and energy. Your chances of getting gainful legal employment with a Fordham JD aren't great. And your JD will hurt your prospects in looking for employment in other realms. JDs "overqualify" you outside the legal sphere.

Having 75k in debt for a GT JD is absurd. Don't go to GT. Fordham if you must, but I'd say don't go. Why are you so dead set on law school. There are many more profitable, more fulfilling, less stressful and uncertain things to do with 3 years of your life.

"Off-base". Okay. Whatever.

go troll another thread man. i think ud be hard-pressed to find people on this site (which is saying something) that would call 75K in debt for a GT JD absurd... other people are giving meaningful advice that is actually constructive to my situation.

locthebloke wrote:Well, alright, homie. Thanks for clarifying. But hey, if you want to go to Fordham for "nearly free" (whatever that actually means) Then it's not a horrible option, but it could still be a bad one. You have to ask yourself if it's worth the investment in time and energy. Your chances of getting gainful legal employment with a Fordham JD aren't great. And your JD will hurt your prospects in looking for employment in other realms. JDs "overqualify" you outside the legal sphere.

Having 75k in debt for a GT JD is absurd. Don't go to GT. Fordham if you must, but I'd say don't go. Why are you so dead set on law school. There are many more profitable, more fulfilling, less stressful and uncertain things to do with 3 years of your life.

"Off-base". Okay. Whatever.

It's because it's not a TOP 8 SCHOOL MIRITE

Also Georgetown for 75K is a great deal. Enjoy and good luck.

Based on 2010 data, Fordham placed 33% in biglaw&federal clerkship, 37% including midlaw, and about 52% in real legal jobs, while Georgetown placed 44%, 46% and 70%, respectively.

Coming debt-free out of Fordham, you should be looking at those last two numbers, 37% corporate and 52% overall vs Georgetown's first two numbers, biglaw for a good outcome, midlaw as a backup that can afford to pay off the loan. There's a reasonable gap, but you need to decide whether improving your odds by that little is worth the debt.

I'm also a believer that going to a lower ranked school should give you a better class rank, although how big a difference is debatable (note: 0L here)

In my opinion, it's a close call, with Fordham being the safer option

The Class of 2011 ABA data shows GULC with 37% going to 100+ firms or federal clerkships, and 63% going to full time, long term, JD-required jobs. For Fordham the corresponding figures are 27% and 57%. That significant but not huge differential, plus whatever general prestige advantage GULC has, doesn't impress me as being worth 75K. Especially since (a) you want NYC where Fordham is at its strongest, and (b) the way the numbers line up in your particular case, you could be debt-free at F. There is a LOT to be said for being debt-free.

Congrats on having great choices.

I don't think 75k for GULC is a bad deal, especially given your ties to DC.

TLSwag wrote:basically if my preferences are: Big Law>>>>>>>>>>>NYC>>DC what would you do?

Does this mean Big Law in either>>>>>>>>>> (and then)NYC>>DC for midlaw? If so, I vote GTown

1. Ask Fordham for more money.
2. Ask Georgetown for money.

Doorkeeper wrote:1. Ask Fordham for more money.
2. Ask Georgetown for money.

1) not gonna happen (he's already at their maximum)
2) unlikely if he got pulled off the waitlist (but no harm in asking)

RodneyBoonfield wrote:

TLSwag wrote:basically if my preferences are: Big Law>>>>>>>>>>>NYC>>DC what would you do?

Does this mean Big Law in either>>>>>>>>>> (and then)NYC>>DC for midlaw? If so, I vote GTown

yes, sorry for the confusion but that's exactly what i mean.

Doorkeeper wrote:1. Ask Fordham for more money.
2. Ask Georgetown for money.

so I did indeed ask Fordham for more, and as dingbat indicated, 30K/year is apparently their highest award. i emailed georgetown and am awaiting patiently. i don't really expect anything, but i would think even a small offer would probably seal the deal for me.

in the meantime, i am just trying to justify if GULC is worth ~$75-80 K more then F. it's not even the debt that bothers me, im not really a risk adverse person and I just want the best for my long-term career. I'm leaning towards yes

TLSwag wrote:in the meantime, i am just trying to justify if GULC is worth ~$75-80 K/year more then F. it's not even the debt that bothers me, im not really a risk adverse person and I just want the best for my long-term career. I'm leaning towards yes

Yes

Also what are your numbers?

TLSwag wrote:

Doorkeeper wrote:1. Ask Fordham for more money.
2. Ask Georgetown for money.

so I did indeed ask Fordham for more, and as dingbat indicated, 30K/year is apparently their highest award. i emailed georgetown and am awaiting patiently. i don't really expect anything, but i would think even a small offer would probably seal the deal for me.

in the meantime, i am just trying to justify if GULC is worth ~$75-80 K/year more then F. it's not even the debt that bothers me, im not really a risk adverse person and I just want the best for my long-term career. I'm leaning towards yes

I was in the same boat (different T14, though) and I chose Fordham. But, I'm in a different position from you, and the finances matter a bit more

tfleming09 wrote:

TLSwag wrote:in the meantime, i am just trying to justify if GULC is worth ~$75-80 K/year more then F. it's not even the debt that bothers me, im not really a risk adverse person and I just want the best for my long-term career. I'm leaning towards yes

Yes

Also what are your numbers?

169 / 3.4 - lets just say i consider myself pretty fortunate to be in this situation

TLSwag wrote:

tfleming09 wrote:

TLSwag wrote:in the meantime, i am just trying to justify if GULC is worth ~$75-80 K/year more then F. it's not even the debt that bothers me, im not really a risk adverse person and I just want the best for my long-term career. I'm leaning towards yes

Yes

Also what are your numbers?

169 / 3.4 - lets just say i consider myself pretty fortunate to be in this situation

GULC must be getting pretty desperate. I got in this cycle with a 169/3.7 and I thought that was crazy. If those are your goals, I'd go Georgetown. It doesn't get much credit from tls but I think it's a great school for this price.

GULC is worth 75k more than Fordham imo. It is not worth sticker, but you and your family's choice to spend your savings on it is none of my concern.

Dude, if you're not going to Yale full scholly then you should probably, like, reconsider this whole law thing... roughly 97.3% of Georgetown JDs end up working at TGI Fridays (but with great advancement opportunities!!).

But, in all seriousness, congrats on that email bud. I think Georgetown is the way to go, unless of course you have a driving desire to start your NYC life this fall.

Go GULC man. I'm not the biggest fan of GULC, and I still would consider this a great deal if you're graduating 75k in debt. Congrats