Top Law Schools

thanks

1. Columbia
2. Chicago
3. NYU
4 (tie) Boalt
4 (tie) UVA
4 (tie) Penn
7 Michigan
8 Duke
9 NU
10 Cornell
11 GULC

You dont think USC/UCLA is on par or better than some of those you mentioned?

badaboom61 wrote:1. Columbia
2. Chicago
3. NYU
4 (tie) Boalt
4 (tie) UVA
4 (tie) Penn
7 Michigan
8 Duke
9 NU
10 Cornell
11 GULC

That seems like a bad list to me. Also I think it depends on where OP is from.

ETA: What I think, rather than just shitting on a post and not being helpful:
If from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia
3. Boalt
4. Penn/NYU
6. UVA/Mich/NU/Dook
10. USC/UCLA
12. GULC/Cornell

If not from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia/Boalt
4. USC/UCLA
6. Penn/NYU
8. UVA/Mich/NU/Dook
12. GULC/Cornell

Too many micro-distinctions ITT.

If from LA:
Berkeley
CCNMVPDNCG UCLA USC

rayiner wrote:Too many micro-distinctions ITT.

If from LA:
Berkeley
CCNMVPDNCG UCLA USC

I get the impression no one commenting necessarily really knows LA biglaw, but to add to the speculation I would actually guess:

HYS
T6 (not so sure about NYU though)/UCBerkeley/UCLA/ USC/ T14 (including NYU)

badaboom61 wrote:1. Columbia
2. Chicago
3. NYU
4 (tie) Boalt
4 (tie) UVA
4 (tie) Penn
7 Michigan
8 Duke
9 NU
10 Cornell
11 GULC

Tom Joad wrote:ETA: What I think, rather than just shitting on a post and not being helpful:
If from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia

Tom Joad wrote:If not from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia/Boalt

What's your rationale for Chicago over CLS?

quiver wrote:

Tom Joad wrote:ETA: What I think, rather than just shitting on a post and not being helpful:
If from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia

Tom Joad wrote:If not from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia/Boalt

What's your rationale for Chicago over CLS?

Small class sizes and nondiluted faculty and quality TLS posters.

Tom Joad wrote:

quiver wrote:

Tom Joad wrote:ETA: What I think, rather than just shitting on a post and not being helpful:
If from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia

Tom Joad wrote:If not from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia/Boalt

What's your rationale for Chicago over CLS?

Small class sizes and nondiluted faculty and quality TLS posters.

I don't think the former matters all that much but touche on the latter.

I'm sorry, unless SoCal is dramatically different than NorCal, nobody in LA knows the difference between Cornell and Columbia. West coasters just aren't the type of people to finely distinguish between a dozen levels of prestige in the way east coasters do.

I say the best would be Boalt, regardless of what the above posters have said.

Boalt is the obvious choice here.

After that? It gets complicated (ties, hypothetical grades, and balancing tests - oh my).

rayiner wrote:I'm sorry, unless SoCal is dramatically different than NorCal, nobody in LA knows the difference between Cornell and Columbia. West coasters just aren't the type of people to finely distinguish between a dozen levels of prestige in the way east coasters do.

+1

Berkeley without a doubt. After that your grades will matter much more than the small distinctions between schools. If I were forced to choose, I'd probably go to Chicago #2 after Berkeley for the Chicago/not East coast location and the small class size but it really doesn't matter much after the two Cali schools.

Tom Joad wrote:

badaboom61 wrote:1. Columbia
2. Chicago
3. NYU
4 (tie) Boalt
4 (tie) UVA
4 (tie) Penn
7 Michigan
8 Duke
9 NU
10 Cornell
11 GULC

That seems like a bad list to me. Also I think it depends on where OP is from.

ETA: What I think, rather than just shitting on a post and not being helpful:
If from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia
3. Boalt
4. Penn/NYU
6. UVA/Mich/NU/Dook
10. USC/UCLA
12. GULC/Cornell

If not from Cali:
1. Chicago
2. Columbia/Boalt
4. USC/UCLA
6. Penn/NYU
8. UVA/Mich/NU/Dook
12. GULC/Cornell

thanks tom, i'm from los angeles by the way and however, would prefer USC/UCLA only if it gave me a better shot at biglaw.

so what im getting here is that the only t14's not better than usc/ucla for biglaw would be GULC/CORNELL?

how much better of a shot @ biglaw do i have comparing usc/ucla to chicago/ penn/ nyu? (is there any way to quantify this? lol)

rayiner wrote:I'm sorry, unless SoCal is dramatically different than NorCal, nobody in LA knows the difference between Cornell and Columbia. West coasters just aren't the type of people to finely distinguish between a dozen levels of prestige in the way east coasters do.

Safe to say then that it takes top third grades to get LA Biglaw regardless of the school?

I had no/few LA ties, went to MVP, and I would bet I had more callbacks at good LA firms than any person from UCLA/USC with equivalent grades (top quarter).

The idea that Berkeley will do better than CCNMVP (or D, or N) in LA is based on nothing more than "hey, they're both in California, bro!"

enigmabk wrote:thanks tom

Listen to Rayiner before you listen to me on anything substantive.

rayiner wrote:I'm sorry, unless SoCal is dramatically different than NorCal, nobody in LA knows the difference between Cornell and Columbia. West coasters just aren't the type of people to finely distinguish between a dozen levels of prestige in the way east coasters do.

Yeah, BigLawyers at Gibson Dunn, Irell, Munger, O'Melveny, Paul Hastings, etc. all went to California law schools and are completely oblivious to fine distinctions in the relative prestige of top law schools. They are basically all surferbrahs and none of them are originally from the east coast.

RVP11 wrote:

rayiner wrote:I'm sorry, unless SoCal is dramatically different than NorCal, nobody in LA knows the difference between Cornell and Columbia. West coasters just aren't the type of people to finely distinguish between a dozen levels of prestige in the way east coasters do.

Yeah, BigLawyers at Gibson Dunn, Irell, Munger, O'Melveny, Paul Hastings, etc. all went to California law schools and are completely oblivious to fine distinctions in the relative prestige of top law schools. They are basically all surferbrahs and none of them are originally from the east coast.

Hmm..

RVP11 wrote:

rayiner wrote:I'm sorry, unless SoCal is dramatically different than NorCal, nobody in LA knows the difference between Cornell and Columbia. West coasters just aren't the type of people to finely distinguish between a dozen levels of prestige in the way east coasters do.

Yeah, BigLawyers at Gibson Dunn, Irell, Munger, O'Melveny, Paul Hastings, etc. all went to California law schools and are completely oblivious to fine distinctions in the relative prestige of top law schools. They are basically all surferbrahs and none of them are originally from the east coast.

It's not a question of knowing, it's a question of caring. I only have experience with SF, maybe LA is different, but people there didn't seem to give a fuck beyond major distinctions like HYS versus T14 versus TT. To put another spin on it: all the Stanford brahs don't really give a shit about Michigan versus Georgetown.

rayiner wrote:

RVP11 wrote:

rayiner wrote:I'm sorry, unless SoCal is dramatically different than NorCal, nobody in LA knows the difference between Cornell and Columbia. West coasters just aren't the type of people to finely distinguish between a dozen levels of prestige in the way east coasters do.

Yeah, BigLawyers at Gibson Dunn, Irell, Munger, O'Melveny, Paul Hastings, etc. all went to California law schools and are completely oblivious to fine distinctions in the relative prestige of top law schools. They are basically all surferbrahs and none of them are originally from the east coast.

It's not a question of knowing, it's a question of caring. I only have experience with SF, maybe LA is different, but people there didn't seem to give a fuck beyond major distinctions like HYS versus T14 versus TT. To put another spin on it: all the Stanford brahs don't really give a shit about Michigan versus Georgetown.

Well rayiner's statement about Cornell vs Columbia is a bit of hyperbole, on the other hand Stanford brahs not giving a shit about Michigan vs Georgetown is probably credited.

For me, the most interesting part of the debate is where to place USC/UCLA. Is their name recognition in CA and their alumni networks enough to pass up T14s? And if so, which ones? UCLA > Georgetown (probably), but UCLA> Virginia?

So much trolling in here. HYS>>CCNB>>MVP>>USC/UCLA

T14 schools are still higher on firms list than USC/UCLA even in LA. They know what the top schools are and they want those graduates. Plus its easy to snag grads from UCLA and USC being so close but those at HYCCNMVP are probably harder to come by in their market. They want to hire from ALL top schools, not just a couple and HYS. Oh, and no way is P>V>M in CA. (in any order, they will be seen as equals there)

moonman157 wrote:For me, the most interesting part of the debate is where to place USC/UCLA. Is their name recognition in CA and their alumni networks enough to pass up T14s? And if so, which ones? UCLA > Georgetown (probably), but UCLA> Virginia?

No to both of these. You have to think, they do like to hire alumni, but they also want students from other top schools. I think V and Georgetown would do better than UCLA (with same grades)