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OK- Last time. BU just increased my scholarship offer, so I'm putting it out there one last time.

BU (17k per year) vs. Notre Dame (20k) per year.

I'd like to go into PI law. That's the reason I'm pursuing law at all. I come from Not-for-profit background and work with children and families in poverty. I'm pursuing a career working with child or poverty advocacy. Exactly how this looks, I'm not sure, I'll iron it out as I get into the thick of things.

I'm from NJ originally. My parents are still there. I have an ill mother who is doing very poorly. I live in PA currently. I plan on returning to the area each summer and when I graduate.

I am leaning heavily towards Notre Dame as I liked the campus, the feel of things, the atmosphere, the people a whole lot more. I am not a city person and hate living in them. Although i don't mind working there. I live in the middle of nowhere right now where it takes me half an hour to get to a grocery store and that's fine. So, Notre Dame is probably the better fit as far as that is concerned. Boston didn't impress me.

Anyway, feel free to discuss. I looked for similar topics on this conversation and most people said between BU and ND, it's basically a toss-up, go wherever you feel more comfortable. I do think Boston is a good school, many people have suggested I go there, I'm very interested in why it's a better choice than ND.

Thanks!

Where are you from in pa? I'd lean nd. No Philly schools?

top30man wrote:Where are you from in pa? I'd lean nd. No Philly schools?

I'm in the pocono area now. I did get in to Penn State. Rejected at UPenn. Did not apply to Temple, widener, drexel, etc.

Do not like either option, tbh.

ND raised their tuition 15% this past year. By the time you are a 3L you will be looking at possibly 55K per year tuition. That makes your 20K look very, very small.

Bump.

I was debating the same thing. Then Cornell came along.

Well I go to BU, but based on your situation, I'd say ND.

- They're pretty equal as schools. Boston is a bit closer to home for you, but neither school has particularly strong placement numbers in your target area. And I don't think BU's geographical advantage would matter much as far as getting a job, as I don't recall BU having a ton of PA employers at OCI. If anything, ND's lay prestige advantage might help.
- ND will be cheaper (both b/c of your scholarship as well as the COL in general), which is extremely important given your PI goal.
- ND's campus setting seems to be more your style. This is less important than the other factors, but absolutely does matter, since people do better in school when they are comfortable in their surroundings

JDProspect wrote:I was debating the same thing. Then Cornell came along.

Grumble...grumble...

bceagles182 wrote:Well I go to BU, but based on your situation, I'd say ND.

- They're pretty equal as schools. Boston is a bit closer to home for you, but neither school has particularly strong placement numbers in your target area. And I don't think BU's geographical advantage would matter much as far as getting a job, as I don't recall BU having a ton of PA employers at OCI. If anything, ND's lay prestige advantage might help.
- ND will be cheaper (both b/c of your scholarship as well as the COL in general), which is extremely important given your PI goal.
- ND's campus setting seems to be more your style. This is less important than the other factors, but absolutely does matter, since people do better in school when they are comfortable in their surroundings

Disagree - you will see a lot more BU people in Philly than ND. BU does an offsite recruiting fair there with BC and people get offers. ND is a great school, but it just doesn't translate well to the NE. BU places people in PA/NJ in firms and clerkships (state courts typically). 3k/year is not enough to justify the difference. BU also places better overall, and if you would be open to NYC, does fairly well there.

bceagles182 wrote:Well I go to BU, but based on your situation, I'd say ND.

- They're pretty equal as schools. Boston is a bit closer to home for you, but neither school has particularly strong placement numbers in your target area. And I don't think BU's geographical advantage would matter much as far as getting a job, as I don't recall BU having a ton of PA employers at OCI. If anything, ND's lay prestige advantage might help.
- ND will be cheaper (both b/c of your scholarship as well as the COL in general), which is extremely important given your PI goal.
- ND's campus setting seems to be more your style. This is less important than the other factors, but absolutely does matter, since people do better in school when they are comfortable in their surroundings

I'm pretty sure we didn't have anyone who transferred from Villanova and you applied 2010-2011, so I'm calling BS on you attending BU. Not that it matters, but weird that your profile is very different from your LSN page.

Blindmelon wrote:

bceagles182 wrote:Well I go to BU, but based on your situation, I'd say ND.

- They're pretty equal as schools. Boston is a bit closer to home for you, but neither school has particularly strong placement numbers in your target area. And I don't think BU's geographical advantage would matter much as far as getting a job, as I don't recall BU having a ton of PA employers at OCI. If anything, ND's lay prestige advantage might help.
- ND will be cheaper (both b/c of your scholarship as well as the COL in general), which is extremely important given your PI goal.
- ND's campus setting seems to be more your style. This is less important than the other factors, but absolutely does matter, since people do better in school when they are comfortable in their surroundings

Disagree - you will see a lot more BU people in Philly than ND. BU does an offsite recruiting fair there with BC and people get offers. ND is a great school, but it just doesn't translate well to the NE. BU places people in PA/NJ in firms and clerkships (state courts typically). 3k/year is not enough to justify the difference. BU also places better overall, and if you would be open to NYC, does fairly well there.

According to the most recent employment data, nd actually places marginally better than bu, unless you're looking at some data I'm missing. As fars as Philly or pa area, the placement is the same.

tallgaloot wrote:

Blindmelon wrote:

bceagles182 wrote:Well I go to BU, but based on your situation, I'd say ND.

- They're pretty equal as schools. Boston is a bit closer to home for you, but neither school has particularly strong placement numbers in your target area. And I don't think BU's geographical advantage would matter much as far as getting a job, as I don't recall BU having a ton of PA employers at OCI. If anything, ND's lay prestige advantage might help.
- ND will be cheaper (both b/c of your scholarship as well as the COL in general), which is extremely important given your PI goal.
- ND's campus setting seems to be more your style. This is less important than the other factors, but absolutely does matter, since people do better in school when they are comfortable in their surroundings

Disagree - you will see a lot more BU people in Philly than ND. BU does an offsite recruiting fair there with BC and people get offers. ND is a great school, but it just doesn't translate well to the NE. BU places people in PA/NJ in firms and clerkships (state courts typically). 3k/year is not enough to justify the difference. BU also places better overall, and if you would be open to NYC, does fairly well there.

According to the most recent employment data, nd actually places marginally better than bu, unless you're looking at some data I'm missing. As fars as Philly or pa area, the placement is the same.

Well, you're wrong, but seems like you want to go to ND. Both schools are regional, so you should probably go to the school that places in the region you want to practice in (BU). But, if you think resume bombing from ND would be more effective than networking with alums/doing recruitment programs from BU then go for it.

Blindmelon wrote:

tallgaloot wrote:

Blindmelon wrote:

bceagles182 wrote:Well I go to BU, but based on your situation, I'd say ND.

- They're pretty equal as schools. Boston is a bit closer to home for you, but neither school has particularly strong placement numbers in your target area. And I don't think BU's geographical advantage would matter much as far as getting a job, as I don't recall BU having a ton of PA employers at OCI. If anything, ND's lay prestige advantage might help.
- ND will be cheaper (both b/c of your scholarship as well as the COL in general), which is extremely important given your PI goal.
- ND's campus setting seems to be more your style. This is less important than the other factors, but absolutely does matter, since people do better in school when they are comfortable in their surroundings

Disagree - you will see a lot more BU people in Philly than ND. BU does an offsite recruiting fair there with BC and people get offers. ND is a great school, but it just doesn't translate well to the NE. BU places people in PA/NJ in firms and clerkships (state courts typically). 3k/year is not enough to justify the difference. BU also places better overall, and if you would be open to NYC, does fairly well there.

According to the most recent employment data, nd actually places marginally better than bu, unless you're looking at some data I'm missing. As fars as Philly or pa area, the placement is the same.

Well, you're wrong, but seems like you want to go to ND. Both schools are regional, so you should probably go to the school that places in the region you want to practice in (BU). But, if you think resume bombing from ND would be more effective than networking with alums/doing recruitment programs from BU then go for it.

Where are you getting your data from? I already mentioned I was leaning heavily towards ND. According to BU's self reported data- 86.8% of BU students were employed 9 months out vs. 91.3% of Notre Dame graduates. 8% of BU students employed were only employed part time vs. 0% of Notre Dame Students. 7% of BU students were still actively seeking work vs. 0% of Notre Dame Students.

I think you're wrong to classify either Notre Dame or BU as "regional schools" as they both have good placement across the country. They're both well known schools

As far as PA (my preferred market) BU had only 1 student working there from 2010 and ND had 2. So, unless I'm missing something important, I don't think I'm wrong on the employment stats.

Absolutely BU. BU has a strong presence in NYC, and mid-Atlantic. NYC area is the 2nd biggest place where alumni end up. I am from NJ as well, as I was getting lots of looks when I had BU Law on my resume.

To add an opinion from someone who doesn't attend BU: Neither of these schools are great for placing in PA, and I don't think either is worth the amount of debt you will be taking on. That said, if retake/reapply is not an option, ND is probably a bit better for central/western PA (basically the midwest) and BU is probably a bit better for Philly. But I don't think the difference is large enough to overcome a strong personal preference for either school.

JDProspect wrote:I was debating the same thing. Then Cornell came along.

Boom goes the dynamite.

OP, I'd do BU, but there's no real CR. So it's not like you're having a tug-of-war between your heart and your head. Your head rightly acknowledged that it's a toss-up. So follow your heart.

woeisme wrote:

JDProspect wrote:I was debating the same thing. Then Cornell came along.

Boom goes the dynamite.

OP, I'd do BU, but there's no real CR. So it's not like you're having a tug-of-war between your heart and your head. Your head rightly acknowledged that it's a toss-up. So follow your heart.

Excuse my ignorance, but what is CR?

tallgaloot wrote:
Excuse my ignorance, but what is CR?

credited response

Seems like you're just justifying taking ND - so man-up and go to ND. I'm not going to tell you its the better choice, because it isn't, but you seriously shouldn't be trying to convince me, a random stranger on TLS, that you're doing the right thing.

Blindmelon wrote:Seems like you're just justifying taking ND - so man-up and go to ND. I'm not going to tell you its the better choice, because it isn't, but you seriously shouldn't be trying to convince me, a random stranger on TLS, that you're doing the right thing.

Dude, he asked you where you were getting your data, and you essentially told him to fuck off.

Blindmelon wrote:Seems like you're just justifying taking ND - so man-up and go to ND. I'm not going to tell you its the better choice, because it isn't, but you seriously shouldn't be trying to convince me, a random stranger on TLS, that you're doing the right thing.

I'm honestly not trying to convince you of anything. My original question included the fact that I was leaning toward ND and interested into why many people think BU is a better choice. You mentioned employment statistics, but according to self-reported data on the school's website, ND has better (although marginal) placement as far as percentage of graduates employed. If I'm missing the point of your argument, then I apologize, but I am honestly asking if there is some employment data that I'm missing. I'm not trying to argue that ND is a better school than BU, I think they're peer schools in many respects, I'm just trying to understand your point about employment.

Where did you get those employment statistics?

If those came from the schools, I would be EXTREMELY skeptical of them. Are some of those "full-time" students employed by the school? Are they jobs that required a JD? All the usual questions. Secondly, you want PI, which can be in some ways tougher than your other avenues of employment (firms, judges) depending on what you want to practice and where.

You mentioned you got into Penn State, since BU and ND suck at PA placement, have you looked harder into Penn State and their placement? Granted they are ranked about 50 spots lower, but you might find they place better in PA just because they are bound to be more Penn State grads in the area. I'm completely ignorant of Penn State, its quality, and its placement, but its an idea I would consider.

I'd go ND.

BU, not even close.

Which has a better LRAP program, as you are interested in PI?