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I just found out today that I have been named a Hamilton Fellow by Columbia. This fellowship covers full tuition for all three years, and also provides me with the opportunity to work one-on-one with a Faculty Mentor.

I had already found out that I was admitted to HLS and Stanford, and I'm still waiting to hear from Yale (although I went there as an undergrad, so a part of me wants to try something else).

I'm particularly interested in international law and possibly academia, and I'm planning on eventually working in California, where I'm from.

I'm planning on going to the admit weekends to get a better feel for the schools, but I would also be interested in hearing your thoughts. Thanks!

sb512 wrote:I just found out today that I have been named a Hamilton Fellow by Columbia. This fellowship covers full tuition for all three years, and also provides me with the opportunity to work one-on-one with a Faculty Mentor.

I had already found out that I was admitted to HLS and Stanford, and I'm still waiting to hear from Yale (although I went there as an undergrad, so a part of me wants to try something else).

I'm particularly interested in international law and possibly academia, and I'm planning on eventually working in California, where I'm from.

I'm planning on going to the admit weekends to get a better feel for the schools, but I would also be interested in hearing your thoughts. Thanks!

Any idea if you would get need based financial aid from HLS or SLS?

i hoap you understand how many hysccn people would love to graduate w/o 75% of their debt.

go to columbia and do not look back.

edit: MAYBE yale. big maybe. that matters how committed you are to PI/govt/academia work

columbia is a fucking shitty school. run while you still can.

Really should be between the Hamilton and SLS here (unless you get Y). Most ppl here will probably say take the Hamilton, and its probably the right path, but with your end goal being California and having an interest in academia I think Stanford is a fine decision which may provide you some minor boosts towards those goals at the cost of having to pay tuition.

TL;DR - If you're not debt averse/have assistance for paying for law school, go SLS. Otherwise, take the money and run.

Personally I'd choose Yale over the Hamilton, but not HS.

I'm facing the exact same decision and I've been mulling it over since I got the Hamilton news in the mail. I'm trying to suspend too much judgment until I've been to all three ASWs, since I think gut feeling will be a big factor. That said, there is a ton of good info in threads from past cycles that has been informative as well.

I made this exact same decision last cycle and chose SLS. If you don't have your aid package yet, don't bother thinking about it until you do. If your aid packages from HLS or SLS are very low, you'll also want to consider whether you're going to be written out of any wills or anything to that effect.

Academia and international are both fields where HYS have a huge advantage. I think Harvard has a decent advantage over SLS in international law and Stanford has a decent advantage over HLS in academia placement (you need to look at the placement of actual academia applicants to see this but I don't think there is much dispute Stanford places a much higher proportion of its academia job applicants than Harvard), but both are in a different league than Columbia. I think it is hard to see how large an advantage they have from the outside, but it is real. And forget about the "mentor"--I have a "mentor" at SLS that was set up by the student association, but the truth is that the faculty student ratio is so good here that it isn't hard to find professors who are willing to mentor you.

I think taking the Hamilton is being penny wise and pound foolish unless you want NYC biglaw. I think the decision is between HLS and SLS, and you should choose the school that fits your personality more (both can place you in California just fine). SLS probably wins the tiebreaker since it is always easier to work in your school's home market.

I would go for the Hamilton. I don't think the schools are in such different leagues that they're worth >$150,000+. Also, I think people forget that you will be able to put the Hamilton on your resume, which will help compensate for a slight decrease in prestige. Since you're likely to do well in whichever school you go to, you will be set up for your choice of employment regardless of where you go. I think turning down a free ride at CLS to attend sticker anywhere else is putting too much emphasis on small differences in prestige.

You'll be mad as fuck when you are 3'rd at Cooley San Fran and you have 125K in debt still because you chose prefstige.

Objectively retarded to not choose Hamilton.

Desert Fox wrote:You'll be mad as fuck when you are 3'rd at Cooley San Fran and you have 125K in debt still because you chose prefstige. *preftige*

Objectively retarded to not choose Hamilton.

ftfy, but otherwise correct

YourCaptain wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:You'll be mad as fuck when you are 3'rd at Cooley San Fran and you have 125K in debt still because you chose prefstige. *preftige*

Objectively retarded to not choose Hamilton.

ftfy, but otherwise correct

tyty

Ship87 wrote:I would go for the Hamilton. I don't think the schools are in such different leagues that they're worth >$150,000+. Also, I think people forget that you will be able to put the Hamilton on your resume, which will help compensate for a slight decrease in prestige. Since you're likely to do well in whichever school you go to, you will be set up for your choice of employment regardless of where you go. I think turning down a free ride at CLS to attend sticker anywhere else is putting too much emphasis on small differences in prestige.

It's funny how great people from CLS think CLS is, versus how people from HYS view it. It's funny, I was actually ashamed to come here for the first few weeks. The sense I get from CLS is that people who go there, are all the people who couldn't get into HYS--mainly the waitlisted. I'm getting over it though. If you took the Hamilton, perhaps you would feel a sense of shame too. But you get over it. I'm mad tho.

Good part of HYS is no real grades. Also, employers outside of NYC like you WAY more if you go to HYS.

I'm curious, do most people think HYS is worth 200k over CLS? This is not rhetorical, I can see both perspectives. I would argue that most people that come to CLS say it is NOT worth 200k. Those people probs couldn't get into S, LOLZ

If OP is paying sticker at SLS he/she has been making bundles of cash prior to law school or has parents who have a very large bank account, and that should factor into the decision.

hung jury wrote: I think Harvard has a decent advantage over SLS in international law and Stanford has a decent advantage over HLS in academia placement (you need to look at the placement of actual academia applicants to see this but I don't think there is much dispute Stanford places a much higher proportion of its academia job applicants than Harvard), but both are in a different league than Columbia.

As someone interested in academia, I really would love to see some numbers here to back up this claim that SLS places into academia better than HLS per academia applicant.

Doorkeeper wrote:

hung jury wrote: I think Harvard has a decent advantage over SLS in international law and Stanford has a decent advantage over HLS in academia placement (you need to look at the placement of actual academia applicants to see this but I don't think there is much dispute Stanford places a much higher proportion of its academia job applicants than Harvard), but both are in a different league than Columbia.

As someone interested in academia, I really would love to see some numbers here to back up this claim that SLS places into academia better than HLS per academia applicant.

http://www.concurringopinions.com/archi ... iring.html

hung jury wrote:

Doorkeeper wrote:

hung jury wrote: I think Harvard has a decent advantage over SLS in international law and Stanford has a decent advantage over HLS in academia placement (you need to look at the placement of actual academia applicants to see this but I don't think there is much dispute Stanford places a much higher proportion of its academia job applicants than Harvard), but both are in a different league than Columbia.

As someone interested in academia, I really would love to see some numbers here to back up this claim that SLS places into academia better than HLS per academia applicant.

http://www.concurringopinions.com/archi ... iring.html

Thank you very much. This makes Chicago look pretty damned good too. I wonder if Harvard's numbers are depressed at all by students assuming that HLS = academia. I have nothing to back up this claim, but I'm very surprised at how many Harvard applicants there are compared to other schools, minus Yale. Might some schools do a better job at deterring alumni to apply if they don't have a legitimate chance than others?

if you think the placement of S or H is that stark compared to C that's just incorrect. reading the oci threads shows that columbia students did very well. MAYBE w&c or wachtell is going to take 2 more hls kids than columbia, but for academia/int'l law that's much more reliant on your progress in school and your pre-ls background.

maybe you want academia, maybe you dont. heres the thing - if you take columbia, in 3 years, you wont have to worry what youre doing because no matter what job youll have youll be comfortable without 200k over your head.

Guchster wrote:

Ship87 wrote:I would go for the Hamilton. I don't think the schools are in such different leagues that they're worth >$150,000+. Also, I think people forget that you will be able to put the Hamilton on your resume, which will help compensate for a slight decrease in prestige. Since you're likely to do well in whichever school you go to, you will be set up for your choice of employment regardless of where you go. I think turning down a free ride at CLS to attend sticker anywhere else is putting too much emphasis on small differences in prestige.

It's funny how great people from CLS think CLS is, versus how people from HYS view it. It's funny, I was actually ashamed to come here for the first few weeks. The sense I get from CLS is that people who go there, are all the people who couldn't get into HYS--mainly the waitlisted. I'm getting over it though. If you took the Hamilton, perhaps you would feel a sense of shame too. But you get over it. I'm mad tho.

Good part of HYS is no real grades. Also, employers outside of NYC like you WAY more if you go to HYS.

I'm curious, do most people think HYS is worth 200k over CLS? This is not rhetorical, I can see both perspectives. I would argue that most people that come to CLS say it is NOT worth 200k. Those people probs couldn't get into S, LOLZ

I'm having trouble taking this CLS trolling seriously. No way HYS is worth 200k over CLS on any metric.

Ship87 wrote:
I'm having trouble taking this CLS trolling seriously. No way HYS is worth 200k over CLS on any metric.

says the person who goes to CLS, lol.

Any HYS people here disagree? Sure we both do just as fine at OCI/EIP, but we're def. not equal on the academia playing field with HYS. Is the bump in percentage worth shelling out 200k (plus the prestige+less pressure for good grades)? I guess if you're loaded and have the monies.

Guchster wrote:

Ship87 wrote:
I'm having trouble taking this CLS trolling seriously. No way HYS is worth 200k over CLS on any metric.

says the person who goes to CLS, lol.

Any HYS people here disagree? Sure we both do just as fine at OCI/EIP, but we're def. not equal on the same playing field like academica HYS. Is the bump in percentage worth shelling out 200k? I guess if you're loaded.

HLS student here. I'd say it's probably not worth 200k more.

Again, it is very rarely a 150k decision. The difference between the Hamilton and S for me and a few people I know here at S was almost always in the five figures. And if it isn't it is usually because you come from a wealthy background--meaning that choosing the school that will help you get the very difficult jobs (academia, international law, government) makes more sense because you don't really have 200k hanging over your head in that situation.

Average grant at S is somewhere in the 20s.

Edit to add: if I had to go 200k in the hole with no other real financial support to attend SLS or HLS, I would have went to CCN. But whether it is worth it is pretty specific to an individual's situation.

I wonder how many people turn down the Hamilton from HYS?

SLS>Hamilton>Harvard.

Go to stanford for the weather.