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Hi everyone:

Anyone have any insights about Wharton's PhD program in Business Ethics and Legal Studies? It sounds pretty great, but I don't know if it would go beyond what one could learn in law school or help with prospects in academia?

If you were to choose between doing a dual JD/PhD at Penn with Wharton's Legal Studies PhD program for free (plus stipend) or going to HYS with 120k in loans, what would you choose?

Thanks for your input!

Wouldn't waste time with the PhD, but I might take Penn for free over H, thought maybe not if H only cost you 120k

Grizz wrote:Wouldn't waste time with the PhD, but I might take Penn for free over H, thought maybe not if H only cost you 120k

It's not a waste of time if the OP wants to teach business or legal ethics at a business school or law school. It's a rather narrowly tailored PhD, so it's not very widely useful, but if the OP wants to go into academia for that, the PhD would be very much useful in getting a position in a business or law school.

I wouldn't plan ex ante on going into legal academia.

OP, neither of the above posters are wrong, as it is mostly a matter of opinion.

However, I would be weary of an "ethics" PhD. Most business schools currently only seems interested in candidates in finance, marketing/operations, accounting, and in other similar fields. Honestly, I have never seen a business school posting for an ethics assistant professor.

In terms of law school, the same problem exists. Legal Profession is somewhat of a throw away course that most law schools just give to anyone (criminal law/con law professors, maybe?). So, I'm not sure the PhD would be helpful for even that.

Aberzombie1892 wrote:However, I would be weary of an "ethics" PhD. Most business schools currently only seems interested in candidates in finance, marketing/operations, accounting, and in other similar fields. Honestly, I have never seen a business school posting for an ethics assistant professor.

I agree with you that this particular PhD program would not be very useful for legal academia, but I have indeed seen a few postings for business ethics professorships at business schools. However, the ones I know about have mostly gone to Philosophy PhD applicants, perhaps the OP should go that route if they are interested in business/legal ethics.

Thanks for your feedback. I tend to agree with the gist of what's been posted above. Let me throw out a few other thoughts, though, just to see if I can cover all the bases.

I'm also wondering if the way business school ethics and law school academics jobs aren't being filled by Wharton PhD grads has anything to do with how small and relatively new that Wharton PhD program is though - maybe the program will become more dominant as the years?

As for thinking about legal academia while choosing law schools, I agree that it's not wise to choose a law school solely on academic prospects. Nevertheless, if a Penn JD was free or near-free, maybe it's not such a bad proposition? Perhaps employers would see a Wharton PhD and not be biased against it like other PhDs if I were to go into securities law? Plus, the Wharton PhD could open up chances at both business and law schools, and from what I see, business school job prospects in ethics might not be too bad in five or six years, especially since I'm open to living abroad. But then again, a JD from Harvard or Yale might compensate for the debt I'd incur (some of which will probably be forgiven) in opportunities, particularly overseas?

What do you think?

Aberzombie1892 wrote:OP, neither of the above posters are wrong, as it is mostly a matter of opinion.

However, I would be weary of an "ethics" PhD. Most business schools currently only seems interested in candidates in finance, marketing/operations, accounting, and in other similar fields. Honestly, I have never seen a business school posting for an ethics assistant professor.

In terms of law school, the same problem exists. Legal Profession is somewhat of a throw away course that most law schools just give to anyone (criminal law/con law professors, maybe?). So, I'm not sure the PhD would be helpful for even that.

Weary = tired
Wary = cautious

That is all.

InGoodFaith wrote:

Aberzombie1892 wrote:OP, neither of the above posters are wrong, as it is mostly a matter of opinion.

However, I would be weary of an "ethics" PhD. Most business schools currently only seems interested in candidates in finance, marketing/operations, accounting, and in other similar fields. Honestly, I have never seen a business school posting for an ethics assistant professor.

In terms of law school, the same problem exists. Legal Profession is somewhat of a throw away course that most law schools just give to anyone (criminal law/con law professors, maybe?). So, I'm not sure the PhD would be helpful for even that.

Weary = tired
Wary = cautious

That is all.

It was 10:55 and I had been drinking?

I love giving people career advice while I'm drinking.

InGoodFaith wrote:I love giving people career advice while I'm drinking.

+1

Not bad.

OP, you sound like the teaching type, not the gunner type.

In my opinion, if you go the Ethics PhD/JD route, you'd stand out as a prospective clerk. The training is almost tailor made for clerkship.

Obligatory:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRT62J80iyI

It's hard to assess these opportunities without knowing how long the JD/PhD program is.

4 years of coursework as opposed to 3. But have to expect another 2 for dissertation writing for the degree.

pcwcecac wrote:OP, you sound like the teaching type, not the gunner type.

In my opinion, if you go the Ethics PhD/JD route, you'd stand out as a prospective clerk. The training is almost tailor made for clerkship.

What? No it doesn't. That's dumb.

Grizz wrote:

pcwcecac wrote:OP, you sound like the teaching type, not the gunner type.

In my opinion, if you go the Ethics PhD/JD route, you'd stand out as a prospective clerk. The training is almost tailor made for clerkship.

What? No it doesn't. That's dumb.

love you too Grizz

Doorkeeper wrote:

Grizz wrote:Wouldn't waste time with the PhD, but I might take Penn for free over H, thought maybe not if H only cost you 120k

It's not a waste of time if the OP wants to teach business or legal ethics at a business school or law school. It's a rather narrowly tailored PhD, so it's not very widely useful, but if the OP wants to go into academia for that, the PhD would be very much useful in getting a position in a business or law school.

Does teaching in law school require a law degree from law school first?

suchana wrote:

Doorkeeper wrote:

Grizz wrote:Wouldn't waste time with the PhD, but I might take Penn for free over H, thought maybe not if H only cost you 120k

It's not a waste of time if the OP wants to teach business or legal ethics at a business school or law school. It's a rather narrowly tailored PhD, so it's not very widely useful, but if the OP wants to go into academia for that, the PhD would be very much useful in getting a position in a business or law school.

Does teaching in law school require a law degree from law school first?

Not necessarily - some schools hire people with PhDs who don't have JDs - but I'd say the vast majority of law profs have a JD, sometimes (more often these days?) on top of another degree.

OP - are you required to take moral philosophy courses in a graduate philosophy department for the degree? It would seem pivotal but that's my bias to philosophy speaking.

Otunga wrote:OP - are you required to take moral philosophy courses in a graduate philosophy department for the degree? It would seem pivotal but that's my bias to philosophy speaking.

Two year old necro.