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Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:02 pm
by Real Madrid
Ok, so I'm undecided on what type of law I want to practice, but for this thread let's say
Big Law (as PI seems like it'd be a no-brainer in favor of Boalt with their LRAP).
I've been awarded a small scholarship at UMich (think ~$10k/year), and nothing so far at Boalt (though I will try the matching scholarship program and see if they'll match it).
Some considerations:
-I'm out-of-state for both.
-I have no undergraduate debt.
-I have about $80k stored away that I can use to mitigate the debt.
-SLIGHT preference for California, though I recognize that the legal market there is not great these days (understatement of the year).
Please advise. Thanks.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:09 pm
by American_in_China
Where do you want to work. East Coast or West Coast.
/thread
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:11 pm
by Real Madrid
American_in_China wrote:Where do you want to work. East Coast or West Coast.
/thread
Ah, yes. Could do either, honestly. I have a slight preference for California, though I recognize that their legal market is a hot mess right now.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:13 pm
by 20130312
I'd say Mich if you aren't really sure. They seem to place well in lots of different markets, whereas the common perception on TLS is that Berkley places much better in CA than anywhere else.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:27 pm
by sach1282
Visit both law schools and just see which one has more intuitive appeal, keeping in mind the higher cost of Berkeley (because of tuition plus COL minus scholarship).
Feeling "at home" at a school is not something you can quantify and it can make a big difference in quality of life.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:28 pm
by jkpolk
InGoodFaith wrote:I'd say Mich if you aren't really sure. They seem to place well in lots of different markets, whereas the common perception on TLS is that Berkley places much better in CA than anywhere else.
I'd say this too- maybe it's the east coast bias talking
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:32 pm
by 20130312
polkij333 wrote:InGoodFaith wrote:I'd say Mich if you aren't really sure. They seem to place well in lots of different markets, whereas the common perception on TLS is that Berkley places much better in CA than anywhere else.
I'd say this too- maybe it's the east coast bias talking
Full disclosure: I also have an East cost bias...
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:53 pm
by quiver
Real Madrid wrote:as PI seems like it'd be a no-brainer in favor of Boalt with their LRAP
I thought Mich's new LRAP was pretty sweet; at least comparable to Boalt's. I'll defer to others on this though.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:07 pm
by ScrabbleChamp
I voted for Michigan, though I have an obvious bias. Even if Berkeley matches the scholarship, there may be stipulations to it that Michigan does not have. Also, COL, as stated before, is much lower in Ann Arbor than Berkeley. And, last but not least, since it seems as if CA would be nice, but you aren't dying to get the CA market, Michigan will give you much more protability AND Michigan does place in CA.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:12 pm
by keg411
Have you already gotten all of your decisions?
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:38 pm
by Shaggier1
Where do you want to work. East Coast or West Coast.
/thread
Are you suggesting that Michigan places better on the East Coast? I am not sure that is true. This is purely anecdotal, of course, but I go to Boalt and I had no problem getting offers in DC and NY (V10's by the way). I am not ranked especially high in my class at Boalt, nor do I have any especially unique "softs." This was true for pretty all of my friends who wanted East Coast SA's (assuming they are competent interviewers/interesting people)
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:41 pm
by AriGoldButNicer
Shaggier1 wrote:Where do you want to work. East Coast or West Coast.
/thread
Are you suggesting that Michigan places better on the East Coast? I am not sure that is true. This is purely anecdotal, of course, but I go to Boalt and I had no problem getting offers in DC and NY (V10's by the way). I am not ranked especially high in my class at Boalt, nor do I have any especially unique "softs." This was true for pretty all of my friends who wanted East Coast SA's (assuming they are competent interviewers/interesting people)
Yeah, I'd imagine a lot of Boalt grads staying on the west coast is related to choice. After all, they're choosing a CA school, and not one of the other top 14's they could get into.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:45 pm
by Addy
Unless you are adverse to living in a major northeast city, Penn is a great choice and the most likely to join the coveted T-6, which should give you a leg up during these overly competitive times.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:50 pm
by 071816
I would go with Michigan. It will end up being cheaper and they place well in many different regions. Can't really go too wrong either way though.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:51 pm
by moneybagsphd
I would choose Berkeley, but I did my undergraduate there and I love the Bay Area...
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:54 pm
by moneybagsphd
InGoodFaith wrote:I'd say Mich if you aren't really sure. They seem to place well in lots of different markets, whereas the common perception on TLS is that Berkley places much better in CA than anywhere else.
Does anyone have evidence to support this assertion? .
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:03 pm
by MachineLemon
Real Madrid wrote:PI seems like it'd be a no-brainer in favor of Boalt with their LRAP.
--LinkRemoved--
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:19 pm
by JoeMo
choose Mich, then you get to come with awesome people like "ScrabbleChamp" "UnamSanctam" and Myself!
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:15 pm
by Mal Reynolds
Shaggier1 wrote:Where do you want to work. East Coast or West Coast.
/thread
Are you suggesting that Michigan places better on the East Coast? I am not sure that is true. This is purely anecdotal, of course, but I go to Boalt and I had no problem getting offers in DC and NY (V10's by the way). I am not ranked especially high in my class at Boalt, nor do I have any especially unique "softs." This was true for pretty all of my friends who wanted East Coast SA's (assuming they are competent interviewers/interesting people)
Can I just ask, was there something on your resume that made you stand out? Im not trying to disagree but this goes against a lot of TLS wisdom so I would be curious to hear if you had anything special to offer DC firms or if any of your peers found DC easier to enter also. Thanks a lot I love B so this would be very helpful insight.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:34 pm
by Boggs
Real Madrid wrote:Ok, so I'm undecided on what type of law I want to practice, but for this thread let's say
Big Law (as PI seems like it'd be a no-brainer in favor of Boalt with their LRAP).
I've been awarded a small scholarship at UMich (think ~$10k/year), and nothing so far at Boalt (though I will try the matching scholarship program and see if they'll match it).
Some considerations:
-I'm out-of-state for both.
-I have no undergraduate debt.
-I have about $80k stored away that I can use to mitigate the debt.
-SLIGHT preference for California, though I recognize that the legal market there is not great these days (understatement of the year).
Please advise. Thanks.
This was a decision I had to make last cycle (lots of $$ at Mich, etc).
First off, I chose Boalt and just finished my first semester.
Second, you'll be in great shape at either school. They're both phenomenal institutions and any minutia of difference that TLS loves to focus on, won't make a difference in practical life. Your decision should really come down to where you want to be and what kind of culture you want around you.
I'm a small town kind of guy and I would have had a great time in Ann Arbor. Further, I really liked the people at Mich. I thought the culture of the law school had a little bit more of an undergrad feel, which can be good or bad depending on what you're looking for.
That said, San Francisco is great to live near (for instance I just took BART into the city to interview with a firm today).
I ended up choosing Boalt for several reasons. The students at Berkeley simply care about making the world a better place. That's not a knock against Mich, I got that vibe there too, but not to the same degree. That attitude really translates into the second reason I chose Boalt, which is that students at Boalt want experiential learning immediately and there are all kinds of opportunities for that. This semester I worked on two journals and participated in a student run clinic. Ultimately, I think Boalt students are really interested in putting their learning to work.
Again, you'll be great either way.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:41 pm
by CanadianWolf
Visit both, then decide.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2011 8:05 am
by worldtraveler
Are there things you are interested in participating in during school? Clinics? Certain classes? Externships? Really the schools are pretty close in terms of job prospects and cost so start thinking about what kind of environment you want to be in and really look at different programs.
Visit then make your choice. I think a lot of people pick between these two and there really isn't a wrong choice.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:57 pm
by FlightoftheEarls
worldtraveler wrote:Are there things you are interested in participating in during school? Clinics? Certain classes? Externships? Really the schools are pretty close in terms of job prospects and cost so start thinking about what kind of environment you want to be in and really look at different programs.
Visit then make your choice. I think a lot of people pick between these two and there really isn't a wrong choice.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2011 6:51 pm
by Real Madrid
worldtraveler wrote:Are there things you are interested in participating in during school? Clinics? Certain classes? Externships? Really the schools are pretty close in terms of job prospects and cost so start thinking about what kind of environment you want to be in and really look at different programs.
Visit then make your choice. I think a lot of people pick between these two and there really isn't a wrong choice.
Unfortunately I can't visit both - I'm living in a foreign country this year with a job so the cost and time are prohibitive.
Re: Berkeley vs. Michigan
Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2011 7:00 pm
by CanadianWolf
Coin flip ? If you don't like the result, then you know where you should go.