Top Law Schools

I want to work in DC after law school. Either doing something with the government (DOI or EPA) or for some kind of advocacy group like ELI. What law school would be best? Is georgetown the best bet since it's in DC or would a better ranked school like NYU or Columbia be better?

lawschoolboundfuture wrote:I want to work in DC after law school. Either doing something with the government (DOI or EPA) or for some kind of advocacy group like ELI. What law school would be best? Is georgetown the best bet since it's in DC or would a better ranked school like NYU or Columbia be better?

Yale, FTW

DC's hurting on both private and public employment ends. I'm sure GULC continues to place the higher students in DC, but realistically you'll need good great grades at MVP and CCN. FWIW UVA used to call itself a king of DC, and it certainly has a leg up on GULC, but 2008 really changed things for the worse.

Tanicius wrote:you'll need good great grades at MVP and CCN.

I don't know why people continue to use these meaningless groupings. CCN is irrelevant outside of NY. V places significantly better in DC than MP or even CCN. I mean the elite firm in DC, W&C doesn't even recruit at NYU while they have more lawyers from UVA than any other school except Harvard and GTown.

There are basically 2 schools that place people EVERYWHERE in the country at a high level. That is Harvard and Yale. Even Stanford is not considered significantly above a school like Duke or UVA in DC. Or Columbia or NYU in New York. If your a top student at CLS or NYU in New York your considered on equal footing. But take it to LA or DC and I don't think the NYU degree carries as much weight.

At the end of the day students not at the top of their classes at every school except H or Y are largely trapped in the region where alot of their alumni are. Top of the class at any t14 can go anywhere in the country.

liLtuneChi wrote:I don't know why people continue to use these meaningless groupings. CCN is irrelevant outside of NY. V places significantly better in DC than MP or even CCN. I mean the elite firm in DC, W&C doesn't even recruit at NYU while they have more lawyers from UVA than any other school except Harvard and GTown.

There are basically 2 schools that place people EVERYWHERE in the country at a high level. That is Harvard and Yale. Even Stanford is not considered significantly above a school like Duke or UVA in DC. Or Columbia or NYU in New York. If your a top student at CLS or NYU in New York your considered on equal footing. But take it to LA or DC and I don't think the NYU degree carries as much weight.

At the end of the day students not at the top of their classes at every school except H or Y are largely trapped in the region where alot of their alumni are. Top of the class at any t14 can go anywhere in the country.

Where are you getting this information? I don't believe you can have anything substantive validating the latter bold statement, beyond statistical inclinations that can be explained by self-selection.

lawschoolboundfuture wrote:I want to work in DC after law school. Either doing something with the government (DOI or EPA) or for some kind of advocacy group like ELI. What law school would be best? Is georgetown the best bet since it's in DC or would a better ranked school like NYU or Columbia be better?

Georgetown poses networking opportunities that cannot be ignored, but the school cranks out way too many students. I'd recommend NYU, which has a reputation for public interest careers; but go there only if you're unable to attend HYS.

glewz wrote:

liLtuneChi wrote:I don't know why people continue to use these meaningless groupings. CCN is irrelevant outside of NY. V places significantly better in DC than MP or even CCN. I mean the elite firm in DC, W&C doesn't even recruit at NYU while they have more lawyers from UVA than any other school except Harvard and GTown.

There are basically 2 schools that place people EVERYWHERE in the country at a high level. That is Harvard and Yale. Even Stanford is not considered significantly above a school like Duke or UVA in DC. Or Columbia or NYU in New York. If your a top student at CLS or NYU in New York your considered on equal footing. But take it to LA or DC and I don't think the NYU degree carries as much weight.

At the end of the day students not at the top of their classes at every school except H or Y are largely trapped in the region where alot of their alumni are. Top of the class at any t14 can go anywhere in the country.

Where are you getting this information? I don't believe you can have anything substantive validating the latter bold statement, beyond statistical inclinations that can be explained by self-selection.

He's a troll. Check out his post history.

I didn't even mean to make a distinction between CCN and MVP in this case. They're just convenient ways of abbreviating the schools. The point is that you will need very good grades from virtually any school in the T-14, and to an extent that even includes HYS.

glewz wrote:

liLtuneChi wrote:I don't know why people continue to use these meaningless groupings. CCN is irrelevant outside of NY. V places significantly better in DC than MP or even CCN. I mean the elite firm in DC, W&C doesn't even recruit at NYU while they have more lawyers from UVA than any other school except Harvard and GTown.

There are basically 2 schools that place people EVERYWHERE in the country at a high level. That is Harvard and Yale. Even Stanford is not considered significantly above a school like Duke or UVA in DC. Or Columbia or NYU in New York. If your a top student at CLS or NYU in New York your considered on equal footing. But take it to LA or DC and I don't think the NYU degree carries as much weight.

At the end of the day students not at the top of their classes at every school except H or Y are largely trapped in the region where alot of their alumni are. Top of the class at any t14 can go anywhere in the country.

Where are you getting this information? I don't believe you can have anything substantive validating the latter bold statement, beyond statistical inclinations that can be explained by self-selection.

the most desired firms in DC (W&C, Covington, Wilmer) have significantly more grads from Duke/UVA/Gtown than Stanford/Columbia

that can NOT be solely explained by geographic preference cause DC work is unique and attracts top students from every region

Tanicius wrote:I didn't even mean to make a distinction between CCN and MVP in this case. They're just convenient ways of abbreviating the schools. The point is that you will need very good grades from virtually any school in the T-14, and to an extent that even includes HYS.

thats another nonsensical grouping

Stanford is a great school and pretty much guarantees you a biglaw job if you are accepted HOWEVER it isn't Harvard or Yale

check out the attorney pages of the most prestigious non-Cali firms

you'll see that only Harvard and Yale have grads in large numbers (in relation to class size) at all the top firms across the country

There are barely any Stanford lawyers at Wachtell or W&C (which are the two most prestigious non-Cali firms in the country). However both those firms are filled with Harvard and Yale grads. Compare that to a place like Munger (which is the Wachtell or W&C of the west coast) and although there are alot of Stanford grads there, there are just as many, if not more Harvard and Yale grads.

I don't think self-selection alone explains this because I don't know who turns down Wachtell or W&C for a California firm that is of inferior quality.

liLtuneChi wrote:

glewz wrote:

liLtuneChi wrote:I don't know why people continue to use these meaningless groupings. CCN is irrelevant outside of NY. V places significantly better in DC than MP or even CCN. I mean the elite firm in DC, W&C doesn't even recruit at NYU while they have more lawyers from UVA than any other school except Harvard and GTown.

There are basically 2 schools that place people EVERYWHERE in the country at a high level. That is Harvard and Yale. Even Stanford is not considered significantly above a school like Duke or UVA in DC. Or Columbia or NYU in New York. If your a top student at CLS or NYU in New York your considered on equal footing. But take it to LA or DC and I don't think the NYU degree carries as much weight.

At the end of the day students not at the top of their classes at every school except H or Y are largely trapped in the region where alot of their alumni are. Top of the class at any t14 can go anywhere in the country.

Where are you getting this information? I don't believe you can have anything substantive validating the latter bold statement, beyond statistical inclinations that can be explained by self-selection.

the most desired firms in DC (W&C, Covington, Wilmer) have significantly more grads from Duke/UVA/Gtown than Stanford/Columbia

that can NOT be solely explained by geographic preference cause DC work is unique and attracts top students from every region

This can easily be explained by self-selection (view stats below). Think about it...most of us had the option to attend Harvard.

Furthermore, OP's post is concerning public interest jobs, while your argument is entirely focused on Biglaw...

W&C:
Yale: 9 Partners, 8 Associates --> 17 / ~190 annual grads = 8.9%
Harvard: 22 Partners, 23 Associates --> 45 / ~570 = 7.9%
Stanford: 5 Partners, 4 Associates --> 9 / ~170 = 5.3% ==> Difference between Harvard & Stanford for DC is only ~2.5%.
Columbia: 3 Partners, 3 Associates --> 6 / ~400 = 1.5%
Duke: 6 Partners, 12 Associates --> 18 / ~210 = 8.6%
GTown: 18 Partners, 17 Associates --> 35 / ~660 = 5.3%
UVA: 14 Partners, 15 Associates --> 29 / ~382 = 7.6%

liLtuneChi wrote: There are barely any Stanford lawyers at Wachtell or W&C (which are the two most prestigious non-Cali firms in the country). However both those firms are filled with Harvard and Yale grads. Compare that to a place like Munger (which is the Wachtell or W&C of the west coast) and although there are alot of Stanford grads there, there are just as many, if not more Harvard and Yale grads.

I don't think self-selection alone explains this because I don't know who turns down Wachtell or W&C for a California firm that is of inferior quality.

Your statement is not true, if you look at the numbers below.

Wachtell:
Yale #: 18 Partners/Associates / ~190 = 9.5%
Harvard #: 44 Partners/Associates / ~570 = 7.7%
Stanford #: 16 Partners/Associates / ~170 = 9.4%


While we need to account for potentially different hiring practices, this little study of ours supports the conclusion that Stanford performs equally well compared to H or Y.

TBH, I wouldn't go to law school in this climate if I only wanted to work for the government. Hiring is significantly down now and with more cuts coming I'd expect hiring to continue its downard trend. You may even see hiring freezes across the board next year.

I'm not agreeing with much of what I'm reading here.

What kind of law do you want to practice in DC?

I've spent the better part of this year as a law clerk for a major fedral agency in the heart of DC and am halfway through my J.D. at a tier 1 school.

I can safely say that GW & Georgetown have a (weak) hold on the private firm law jobs in the district, though you should note that most grads of those universities actually go on to practice in New York.

Maryland, American, and George Mason are supplying many (probably the majority) of the new government and Public Interest Lawyers who are actually practicing in DC.

Their reputation and connections in DC are much stronger than other highly ranked but more distant schools (Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, WashU, UC-Davis etc.)

I would highly recommended staying in the proximity of DC if you want to practice there. You will find yourself networking and interning with firms there effortlessly - even if you could get into a higher ranked school elsewhere.

There is no way in any situation that going to Georgetown is better than going to Columbia or NYU. I promise that if you are in NYU/Columbia and you apply for the same position as the guy from Georgetown, you'll be the one they're interested in (assuming you don't suck) even though your school isn't in D.C.

Otherwise, the two best law schools in DC are Georgetown and George Washington. They're both good schools but generally speaking, if you don't get higher than a 3.5 you're basically fucked when it comes to employment. Keep that in mind.

liLtuneChi wrote:

glewz wrote:

liLtuneChi wrote:I don't know why people continue to use these meaningless groupings. CCN is irrelevant outside of NY. V places significantly better in DC than MP or even CCN. I mean the elite firm in DC, W&C doesn't even recruit at NYU while they have more lawyers from UVA than any other school except Harvard and GTown.

There are basically 2 schools that place people EVERYWHERE in the country at a high level. That is Harvard and Yale. Even Stanford is not considered significantly above a school like Duke or UVA in DC. Or Columbia or NYU in New York. If your a top student at CLS or NYU in New York your considered on equal footing. But take it to LA or DC and I don't think the NYU degree carries as much weight.

At the end of the day students not at the top of their classes at every school except H or Y are largely trapped in the region where alot of their alumni are. Top of the class at any t14 can go anywhere in the country.

Where are you getting this information? I don't believe you can have anything substantive validating the latter bold statement, beyond statistical inclinations that can be explained by self-selection.

the most desired firms in DC (W&C, Covington, Wilmer) have significantly more grads from Duke/UVA/Gtown than Stanford/Columbia

that can NOT be solely explained by geographic preference cause DC work is unique and attracts top students from every region

are you serious? ive seen your post history as well...stop trolling please

glewz wrote:

liLtuneChi wrote: There are barely any Stanford lawyers at Wachtell or W&C (which are the two most prestigious non-Cali firms in the country). However both those firms are filled with Harvard and Yale grads. Compare that to a place like Munger (which is the Wachtell or W&C of the west coast) and although there are alot of Stanford grads there, there are just as many, if not more Harvard and Yale grads.

I don't think self-selection alone explains this because I don't know who turns down Wachtell or W&C for a California firm that is of inferior quality.

Your statement is not true, if you look at the numbers below.

Wachtell:
Yale #: 18 Partners/Associates / ~190 = 9.5%
Harvard #: 44 Partners/Associates / ~570 = 7.7%
Stanford #: 16 Partners/Associates / ~170 = 9.4%


While we need to account for potentially different hiring practices, this little study of ours supports the conclusion that Stanford performs equally well compared to H or Y.

you're taking the troll way too seriously