Top Law Schools

Hey guys,

I'm down to my final two choices and I would appreciate some suggestions/comments.

I'm not set on any particular location or any particular career, but I think I might end up doing a JD/MBA to add to my versatility (both school's have pretty good business programs from what I can tell).

I visited both campuses and thought they were both very nice, and were both places I would like to live for the next three years.

Here are some breakdowns:

1. Wake Forest
-$31K annual scholarship, top 2/3 stipulation
-Tuition is $37,940 for 2011-12, up about 3%* from last year's cost

2. Indiana
-$40K annual scholarship, good academic standing stipulation (I guess if I don't drop out or fail too many classes, then I still have a scholarship!)
-Tuition is estimated at about $45,000 for 2011-12, up about 5%* from last year's cost

Thanks for the feedback!

*I'm not working off of a ton of data, but it seems like this is a fair growth rate to expect throughout my studies.

If I were you, I'd contact wake and try to get rid of your stip by leveraging indiana offer.

After that, I'd go to wake and pwn.

mf980 wrote:Hey guys,

I'm down to my final two choices and I would appreciate some suggestions/comments.

I'm not set on any particular location or any particular career, but I think I might end up doing a JD/MBA to add to my versatility (both school's have pretty good business programs from what I can tell).

I visited both campuses and thought they were both very nice, and were both places I would like to live for the next three years.

Here are some breakdowns:

1. Wake Forest
-$31K annual scholarship, top 2/3 stipulation
-Tuition is $37,940 for 2011-12, up about 3%* from last year's cost

2. Indiana
-$40K annual scholarship, good academic standing stipulation (I guess if I don't drop out or fail too many classes, then I still have a scholarship!)
-Tuition is estimated at about $45,000 for 2011-12, up about 5%* from last year's cost

Thanks for the feedback!

*I'm not working off of a ton of data, but it seems like this is a fair growth rate to expect throughout my studies.

Pick the state you want to live in for the next 30 years. Attend accordingly.

Nicholasnickynic wrote:If I were you, I'd contact wake and try to get rid of your stip by leveraging indiana offer.

After that, I'd go to wake and pwn.

Thanks for the feedback.

Why do you think I should pick Wake Forest over Indiana?

Main reason why I picked Wake over Indiana? North Carolina >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Indiana

What sort of work are you interested in? I say Wake, because I feel that their job placement (especially in firm work) > Indiana's and you'll have a bit more mobility with a Wake degree than an Indiana degree. However, if you love the midwest and/or aren't looking for big law, Indiana may be the better choice.

Wake hands down.

Thanks for the feedback so far everybody!

I'm from the East Coast, so I think I have a slight bias toward the coast (I haven't lived anywhere else, so I don't really know if I actually prefer the region to another region).

So far, the thing I've learned most from this thread is that North Carolina people are more vocal on the internet than Indiana people!

mf980 wrote:Thanks for the feedback so far everybody!

I'm from the East Coast, so I think I have a slight bias toward the coast (I haven't lived anywhere else, so I don't really know if I actually prefer the region to another region).

So far, the thing I've learned most from this thread is that North Carolina people are more vocal on the internet than Indiana people!

Well, if you're serious about the JD/MBA, then Indiana's MBA program is quite a bit better than Wake's. On the mobility thing, I don't get how Wake's JD is more mobile, as both are pretty regional schools and I said the Indiana MBA is stronger. Wake has much tougher in-state competition. It's third best behind Duke and UNC.

It really boils down to whether you want to be in the midwest or the south. But all things being equal, I'm struggling with seeing why everyone seems to think Wake is a better choice.

danquayle wrote:

mf980 wrote:Thanks for the feedback so far everybody!

I'm from the East Coast, so I think I have a slight bias toward the coast (I haven't lived anywhere else, so I don't really know if I actually prefer the region to another region).

So far, the thing I've learned most from this thread is that North Carolina people are more vocal on the internet than Indiana people!

Well, if you're serious about the JD/MBA, then Indiana's MBA program is quite a bit better than Wake's. On the mobility thing, I don't get how Wake's JD is more mobile, as both are pretty regional schools and I said the Indiana MBA is stronger. Wake has much tougher in-state competition. It's third best behind Duke and UNC.

It really boils down to whether you want to be in the midwest or the south. But all things being equal, I'm struggling with seeing why everyone seems to think Wake is a better choice.

Yeah, but a hefty majority of Duke graduates leave NC. Wake probably has better placement throughout larger southern cities than Indiana does in larger midwestern cities, simply because there is more competition in the midwest than in the south. What I am hinting at is that if you've never been to the midwest and you enjoy the south (especially the southern Atlantic region) you should probably go with Wake.

indiana. it will free up moar money for my wake scholarship negotiations. k thanks.

For JD/MBA, I would imagine IU is better. Kelley is a very good business school, quite a bit better than Calloway.

For the poster who said that NC>IN, what do you base this on? Have you ever been to Winston-Salem? I've spent time in both places and Bloomington>>>>>W-S. I also prefer Indianapolis to Charlotte.

ndirish2010 wrote:For JD/MBA, I would imagine IU is better. Kelley is a very good business school, quite a bit better than Calloway.

For the poster who said that NC>IN, what do you base this on? Have you ever been to Winston-Salem? I've spent time in both places and Bloomington>>>>>W-S. I also prefer Indianapolis to Charlotte.

insanity.

Stonewall wrote:

ndirish2010 wrote:For JD/MBA, I would imagine IU is better. Kelley is a very good business school, quite a bit better than Calloway.

For the poster who said that NC>IN, what do you base this on? Have you ever been to Winston-Salem? I've spent time in both places and Bloomington>>>>>W-S. I also prefer Indianapolis to Charlotte.

insanity.

What's so great about Charlotte?

Anyway, Wake does place better in biglaw than IU (IU wasn't even top 50 on the latest NLJ survey.) However this really should be a regional decision if there is no JD/MBA option.

Stonewall wrote:

ndirish2010 wrote:For JD/MBA, I would imagine IU is better. Kelley is a very good business school, quite a bit better than Calloway.

For the poster who said that NC>IN, what do you base this on? Have you ever been to Winston-Salem? I've spent time in both places and Bloomington>>>>>W-S. I also prefer Indianapolis to Charlotte.

insanity.

Says the Southerner.

I'm struggling with the exact same thing, except I am getting a lot less $ from Wake right now. Ultimately though, I want to practice in NC. If I can get more out of Wake I will be attending, but if not I guess it will be IU. If you have a location preference (it doesn't sound like you do), just go with whichever state you prefer.

I definitely know I am interested in private practice, and Wake puts almost 1.5 students in the private practice for every students IU puts into private practice. Wake puts more in NLJ 250 firms, but I can't say that this isn't just b/c Indianapolis' market is a little smaller and has some "bigger" firms that just aren't NLJ 250. They aren't too far off overall in employment prospects though. Wake posts higher starting salaries but I think it's just b/c the markets the schools feed into.

I grew up in Indiana and lived in North Carolina for a couple years and I will second the NC >>>>>>> IN.

If you are serious about doing the MBA then Indiana's B school is certainly superior to Wake's reputation-wise.

ndirish2010 wrote:

Stonewall wrote:

ndirish2010 wrote:For JD/MBA, I would imagine IU is better. Kelley is a very good business school, quite a bit better than Calloway.

For the poster who said that NC>IN, what do you base this on? Have you ever been to Winston-Salem? I've spent time in both places and Bloomington>>>>>W-S. I also prefer Indianapolis to Charlotte.

insanity.

What's so great about Charlotte?

Anyway, Wake does place better in biglaw than IU (IU wasn't even top 50 on the latest NLJ survey.) However this really should be a regional decision if there is no JD/MBA option.

the same could really be asked about indy. but having a biased country day perspective and a deep love of all things nascar - charlotte wins in my book.

MattThiessen wrote:I'm struggling with the exact same thing, except I am getting a lot less $ from Wake right now. Ultimately though, I want to practice in NC. If I can get more out of Wake I will be attending, but if not I guess it will be IU. If you have a location preference (it doesn't sound like you do), just go with whichever state you prefer.

I definitely know I am interested in private practice, and Wake puts almost 1.5 students in the private practice for every students IU puts into private practice. Wake puts more in NLJ 250 firms, but I can't say that this isn't just b/c Indianapolis' market is a little smaller and has some "bigger" firms that just aren't NLJ 250. They aren't too far off overall in employment prospects though. Wake posts higher starting salaries but I think it's just b/c the markets the schools feed into.

I grew up in Indiana and lived in North Carolina for a couple years and I will second the NC >>>>>>> IN.

If you are serious about doing the MBA then Indiana's B school is certainly superior to Wake's reputation-wise.

You have work experience? If you don't, you shouldn't bet on the JD/MBA.

Stonewall wrote:

ndirish2010 wrote:

Stonewall wrote:

ndirish2010 wrote:For JD/MBA, I would imagine IU is better. Kelley is a very good business school, quite a bit better than Calloway.

For the poster who said that NC>IN, what do you base this on? Have you ever been to Winston-Salem? I've spent time in both places and Bloomington>>>>>W-S. I also prefer Indianapolis to Charlotte.

insanity.

What's so great about Charlotte?

Anyway, Wake does place better in biglaw than IU (IU wasn't even top 50 on the latest NLJ survey.) However this really should be a regional decision if there is no JD/MBA option.

the same could really be asked about indy. but having a biased country day perspective and a deep love of all things nascar - charlotte wins in my book.

I'm not a native of either, but I've spent a considerable amount of time in both and can say Indianapolis and Charlotte are pretty similar cities. North Carolina is a nicer all around state, however. Though, again, pretty similar. It's hard to find a Midwestern state that matches up better with a Southern state.

All comes down to where you want to work after graduation. Both are very regional schools. IU will struggle to break into Chicago ITE as well. This is going to be a very personal decision for you. You personally could not pay me enough to spend the next 3 years in Indiana, let alone a lifetime and career. But plenty of people are perfectly content with the idea (though they are usually Indiana natives that went to Purdue/IU/ND/Butler/Taylor for undergrad).


But yeah, make Wake get rid of the 2/3 stip.

danquayle wrote:I'm not a native of either, but I've spent a considerable amount of time in both and can say Indianapolis and Charlotte are pretty similar cities. North Carolina is a nicer all around state, however. Though, again, pretty similar. It's hard to a Midwestern state that matches up better with a Southern state.

Truth.

Bloomington is certainly a much more "happening" place than Winston Salem. I would consider Bloomington almost exclusively a college town. I may be wrong, but it seems like the city revolves around IU. Wake, on the other hand, is just a small part of Winston Salem. I personally prefer Winston Salem, but I'm married and am pretty boring, so take that FWIW.

Also OP, can you do a cost of attendance analysis. The scholarship amounts really don't mean much if we don't know the annual tuition, average cost of living, average rent, etc for each school/city.

danquayle wrote:

mf980 wrote:Thanks for the feedback so far everybody!

I'm from the East Coast, so I think I have a slight bias toward the coast (I haven't lived anywhere else, so I don't really know if I actually prefer the region to another region).

So far, the thing I've learned most from this thread is that North Carolina people are more vocal on the internet than Indiana people!

Well, if you're serious about the JD/MBA, then Indiana's MBA program is quite a bit better than Wake's. On the mobility thing, I don't get how Wake's JD is more mobile, as both are pretty regional schools and I said the Indiana MBA is stronger. Wake has much tougher in-state competition. It's third best behind Duke and UNC.

It really boils down to whether you want to be in the midwest or the south. But all things being equal, I'm struggling with seeing why everyone seems to think Wake is a better choice.

Last year 60-some percent of wake's grads found work outside of NC. I'm not sure of indiana's numbers.

As to tough instate competition, are you kidding me?

Duke=NY-DC

Wake>UNC
For (at least) the second year in a row, Wake>UNC in nlj250 #s. Its pretty heft this year too... 15-11%.
Don't know about this year's federal clerkship #s, but when I applied, wake had not only a hirer percent, but a hirer #, despite being something like 1/2 as large.

Also, if you look at the percent of super laywers in NC, it is completley dominated by Wake and UNC

MattThiessen wrote:

danquayle wrote:I'm not a native of either, but I've spent a considerable amount of time in both and can say Indianapolis and Charlotte are pretty similar cities. North Carolina is a nicer all around state, however. Though, again, pretty similar. It's hard to a Midwestern state that matches up better with a Southern state.

Truth.

Bloomington is certainly a much more "happening" place than Winston Salem. I would consider Bloomington almost exclusively a college town. I may be wrong, but it seems like the city revolves around IU. Wake, on the other hand, is just a small part of Winston Salem. I personally prefer Winston Salem, but I'm married and am pretty boring, so take that FWIW.

Compare Indiana to NC, not bloomington to winston-salem.

Lets try to think big picture- where you will likely spend the rest of your life, rather than little picture- where you will spend the next 3 years.

Also, IMO, if you have time to go do stuff in law school, your doing it wrong.

Nicholasnickynic wrote:

danquayle wrote:

mf980 wrote:Thanks for the feedback so far everybody!

I'm from the East Coast, so I think I have a slight bias toward the coast (I haven't lived anywhere else, so I don't really know if I actually prefer the region to another region).

So far, the thing I've learned most from this thread is that North Carolina people are more vocal on the internet than Indiana people!

Well, if you're serious about the JD/MBA, then Indiana's MBA program is quite a bit better than Wake's. On the mobility thing, I don't get how Wake's JD is more mobile, as both are pretty regional schools and I said the Indiana MBA is stronger. Wake has much tougher in-state competition. It's third best behind Duke and UNC.

It really boils down to whether you want to be in the midwest or the south. But all things being equal, I'm struggling with seeing why everyone seems to think Wake is a better choice.

Last year 60-some percent of wake's grads found work outside of NC. I'm not sure of indiana's numbers.

As to tough instate competition, are you kidding me?

Duke=NY-DC

Wake>UNC
For (at least) the second year in a row, Wake>UNC in nlj250 #s. Its pretty heft this year too... 15-11%.
Don't know about this year's federal clerkship #s, but when I applied, wake had not only a hirer percent, but a hirer #, despite being something like 1/2 as large.

Also, if you look at the percent of super laywers in NC, it is completley dominated by Wake and UNC

Credibility = gone.