UVa (90k) vs. Michigan (45k) Forum

[r6_philly]

For IP, short of stanford, I'd go to Berkeley.

I'm sure that you already know this r6, but just get them to match. I think that you you could do it.
http://www.law.berkeley.edu/6957.htm

Not if you are looking at 90K from UVa, and zero from Berkeley.

That matching programs is mostly myth. Boalt gives out subpar merit aid.

Also subtle anti Northwestern Trolling Boalt, very subtle.

I noticed that right away, I have no idea why they don't want to consider NU offers.

I guess I will wait to see. It would of course make sense to be in the state where I want to work, but my instinct is that it's probably not worth 100k+ extra.

[TheTallOne0602]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but is there no possibility of sending an email to Michigan saying that, more or less, you'd love to go there but the financial difference is too great to overcome as is and see if you can get more money out of them?

[09042014]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but is there no possibility of sending an email to Michigan saying that, more or less, you'd love to go there but the financial difference is too great to overcome as is and see if you can get more money out of them?

This is a great suggestion because OP is at or above both 75%'s.

[Aggiegrad2011]

Mich probably has slightly more access to CA firms. But with the Loyola Patent Interview Program, and SFIPLA (the SanFran patent fair), I'd be shocked if was 50K worth of difference.

This. I didn't really care much for UVA but I'd be there with that large a difference.

Thanks guys. This is my guess as well. I appreciate you saying so, since I don't really know much about Michigan and what it offers at this point.

Berkeley, because the bay area is a lot nicer place to live than either Ann Arbor or C-ville.

PLUS - I'll be close!

[A&O]

Just because a school has better IP curriculum, that doesn't mean it places better at IP firms. I'm, therefore, not understanding why the recommendation is there for Berkeley, if one wants to do IP. Whether one wants to do IP is irrelevant in this matter.

[legends159]

I was making a similar decision and then got into SLS and the point became moot. I'd wait until you have all your ducks lined up before you drive yourself crazy thinking of this decision. Looking at your stats you have a very good chance at SLS, especially since you already got into Boalt.

[09042014]

Just because a school has better IP curriculum, that doesn't mean it places better at IP firms. I'm, therefore, not understanding why the recommendation is there for Berkeley, if one wants to do IP. Whether one wants to do IP is irrelevant in this matter.

If all else were equal Boalt would be a good choice if you wanted CA, and you wanted IP. But dear god turning down 90K at a peer school is fucking madness.

Hell I'd consider turning down HYS for 90K at UVA.

[NoleinNY]

Really happy to have received 2 merit offers so far, trying to do a head to head comparison.

UVa 30k/year, Michigan 15k/year.

Goal: IP/tech law, in CA if possible. I have 10+ years of WE in the field I want to specialize in, with a lot of exposure/experience to legal work - from the tech point of view. Not interested in NYC.

I do have Berkeley as an option (as well as Penn) but no merit offers yet, so I am trying to work with what I know for certain.

I am guessing UVa wins, but would like some varying opinions. Thoughts?

FWIW:

UVA

http://californiabar.globl.org/results. ... ergrad=&s=

http://californiabar.globl.org/results. ... d=&status=

V. Michigan

http://californiabar.globl.org/results. ... ergrad=&s=

http://californiabar.globl.org/results. ... ergrad=&s=

Looks like more Wolverines than Cavaliers in IP and in general for the major tech and entertainment cities. On the grand total, you have about 1700 M versus <900 V.

[LLB2JD]

UVA

Disclosure: I am biased

[A&O]

If all else were equal Boalt would be a good choice if you wanted CA, and you wanted IP.

If you want CA, yes. No school will give you a better chance at doing IP. That's almost as ridiculous as the "GW is great at IP" meme.

[CanadianWolf]

The law school culture at Virginia may be substantially different than that at Berkeley.
Michigan offers a reasonable compromise with national placement. The correct answer, therefore, is Texas.

P.S. My understanding from your profile is that you received substantial merit scholarship money from Texas which is located in an area (Austin) that matches your professional interests.

[afcanoe]

Do you know COA at each school? I know C-ville is supposed to be cheap and AA isn't bad either, but factoring in COA could put UVa ahead by even more than the scholly does. (BTW, congrats on both schollies!)

Thanks! It's awesome to not think about 250k in loans no matter how confident I may be about the future.

I don't know Ann Arbor that well, but I do know Charlottesville is pretty cheap. I think cost of living should be pretty close, so around $50k should be the difference between the two. Michigan probably has better placement in CA, but is it $50k better?

Rent in Ann Arbor's cheap cheap cheap, most of friends in A2 with one bedroom apts pay around 400-450 a month. I was living in a pretty nice house in a2 for a few months and it was only 200/month per person. Just don't be fooled by the housing that's advertised towards students those places are always extremely overpriced

Just fyi - as someone who went to UM for undergrad and still lives in the area, A2 is not necessarily this cheap. As an undergrad, I paid approx. $500/month for a room in a 7-bedroom house, and a decent 3-br. house or apt. is going to run you at least $1500-$2000/month. Maybe I was fooled by the housing advertised towards students, but I've done a fair amount of research within the past few months (UM is a serious option for me, too), and I've never seen prices that low.

dr123 - did you live in a sublet when you lived in A2 for a few months? I've seen summer sublets that cheap, but not otherwise...

[r6_philly]

Looks like more Wolverines than Cavaliers in IP and in general for the major tech and entertainment cities. On the grand total, you have about 1700 M versus <900 V.

Thanks for that link, I will poke around.

(IP/All)
Boalt: 204/3384 (6%)
V: 24/367 (6.5%)
M: 57/806 (7%)

Maybe A&O is right about a more extensive IP curriculum doesn't necessarily produce more IP jobs.

[A&O]

Maybe A&O is right about a more extensive IP curriculum doesn't necessarily produce more IP jobs.

...at this point, I'm just wondering who originated this stupid notion.

[r6_philly]

Just because a school has better IP curriculum, that doesn't mean it places better at IP firms. I'm, therefore, not understanding why the recommendation is there for Berkeley, if one wants to do IP. Whether one wants to do IP is irrelevant in this matter.

If this true, it will change my thinking quite a bit. I haven't been able to find relevant stats to prove/disprove this. Can you recommend sources? Would I be able to useful info from career services?

Since they are all peer schools, I would like to find out if chances at the nice IP jobs I want will be similar out of any of the 4, if so I can focus the decision making to other factors.

[r6_philly]

Maybe A&O is right about a more extensive IP curriculum doesn't necessarily produce more IP jobs.

...at this point, I'm just wondering who originated this stupid notion.

Well schools market it well, and this is true for UG in science/engineering majors because of recruiting.

[r6_philly]

I was making a similar decision and then got into SLS and the point became moot. I'd wait until you have all your ducks lined up before you drive yourself crazy thinking of this decision. Looking at your stats you have a very good chance at SLS, especially since you already got into Boalt.

I hope to follow your footsteps. It is considerably harder for me to move to another state to attend school than others due to the fact that I have a family. So I am doing research now to present a plan for each options. I need to have a preference list and plan accordingly before deposit deadlines since we will have to look up housing, schools, jobs, arrange for visit outside of ASW etc...

Already visited SLS and Boalt, so if they come calling, I will be ready But obviously can't bank on a SLS acceptance... If you say Boalt is a good sign, I will take it!

[A&O]

Well schools market it well, and this is true for UG in science/engineering majors because of recruiting.

...so what? Some random Tier 2 will advertise that they have an excellent Tax curriculum, and then cite the USNews curriculum-specific rankings where that's the case. Does that mean that the school places well in tax practices at law firms? No.

[Bumi]

For IP, short of stanford, I'd go to Berkeley.

I'm sure that you already know this r6, but just get them to match. I think that you you could do it.
http://www.law.berkeley.edu/6957.htm

This is pretty funny:

ELIGIBILITY
Students admitted to Berkeley Law that have also received a scholarship offer from one of the 12 law schools listed below can apply for a Berkeley Law Matching Scholarship.

Columbia University
Cornell University
Duke University
Georgetown University
Harvard University
New York University
Stanford University
University of Chicago
University of Michigan
University of Pennsylvania
University of Virginia
Yale University

T13?

[A&O]

More like NU is very generous with money and some schools feel like they can't compete.

[r6_philly]

Well schools market it well, and this is true for UG in science/engineering majors because of recruiting.

...so what? Some random Tier 2 will advertise that they have an excellent Tax curriculum, and then cite the USNews curriculum-specific rankings where that's the case. Does that mean that the school places well in tax practices at law firms? No.

If you are looking at 2 random T2 schools maybe it's more relevant? These are peer schools so I am guessing overall prospects are similar. Although you are right, as I understand legal education, it isn't entirely necessary to take the electives.

[paulinaporizkova]

philly, i think your choice is clear! ::

[CanadianWolf]

The Berkeley matching scholarship list is unusual in that Yale, Stanford & Harvard are listed even though merit scholarships are not offered by those schools.

[Moxie]

I would personally hold off on making a decision until you have visited each school, and completed your spreadsheet. Look it over, compare the notes on the spreadsheet to how you felt on each campus. You might realize that you like one of them better. Personally, if you like one over the other- thats the winner.

There is no wrong choice. You have done well, sir

+1 to this. Barring all else, the money should put UVA over the top (considering similar COL numbers), but your happiness is more important than the small differences these two provide in placement.

Just curious if you applied to Stanford or Harvard? Your numbers would give you a decent shot at one of those two.

[paulinaporizkova]

The Berkeley matching scholarship list is unusual in that Yale, Stanford & Harvard are listed even though merit scholarships are not offered by those schools.

i think they just wanted to throw those names in there to make themselves look better.