Top Law Schools

I've been looking at the US News rankings for California law schools:
--LinkRemoved--

I had been looking at the following schools because I thought I might have some chance of obtaining a scholarship from them (3.2/175), and they're in the US News top 100.
Pepperdine, Loyola, U of San Diego, Chapman, Santa Clara, U of San Francisco.

However, they ALL have some form of religious affiliation. I was wondering whether others had been to them and how strongly one feels their religious affiliation. I'd rather go to a liberal school full of hippies than one full of conservatives but UC Davis doesn't give much scholarship money. Are there jesus crosses everywhere at these schools? I couldn't live with that, those things creep me out. I heard they have them at Santa Clara, and I also heard that Pepperdine is full of conservative Christians, so those two are probably out. But what about the others? Is there a more liberal-minded environment at U of San Francisco, just do to its location?

I live in the Bay Area (East Bay) and know friends and co-workers that go/have gone to both Santa Clara Law and USF Law. Both of the schools are great schools; they don't push religious affliation upon others eventhough they are Jesuit affliated, just like Fordham. Its just the heritage (The Missions in California). People there are not judgemental but very chill.

(3.2 and 175 LSAT) With numbers like that why don't you go to UC Hastings, its also in San Francisco. You have better chance at employment in California especially in the Bay Area.

If you're a CA native I'd take UVa at sticker over a full ride at any of those schools, but there is always the argument of higher ranking versus larger scholarship.

bluebeetle72 wrote:I live in the Bay Area (East Bay) and know friends and co-workers that go/have gone to both Santa Clara Law and USF Law. Both of the schools are great schools; they don't push religious affliation upon others eventhough they are Jesuit affliated, just like Fordham. Its just the heritage (The Missions in California). People there are not judgemental but very chill.

(3.2 and 175 LSAT) With numbers like that why don't you go to UC Hastings, its also in San Francisco. You have better chance at employment in California especially in the Bay Area.

Thanks for the input. As for UC Hastings, they give out a lot of grants, but in very small amounts - median $6000. It would be great to go there but too expensive.

bk187: As for the ranking/scholarship argument, at the moment a larger scholarship is the more important factor. I'm not limiting my options for next year to "law school or bust," and have decided only to go to law school if offered significant grants/scholarships.

ack wrote:I've been looking at the US News rankings for California law schools:
--LinkRemoved--

I had been looking at the following schools because I thought I might have some chance of obtaining a scholarship from them (3.2/175), and they're in the US News top 100.
Pepperdine, Loyola, U of San Diego, Chapman, Santa Clara, U of San Francisco.

However, they ALL have some form of religious affiliation. I was wondering whether others had been to them and how strongly one feels their religious affiliation. I'd rather go to a liberal school full of hippies than one full of conservatives but UC Davis doesn't give much scholarship money. Are there jesus crosses everywhere at these schools? I couldn't live with that, those things creep me out. I heard they have them at Santa Clara, and I also heard that Pepperdine is full of conservative Christians, so those two are probably out. But what about the others? Is there a more liberal-minded environment at U of San Francisco, just do to its location?

UC Irvine has a free application and they will offer every single member of the next class at least a 1/3 tuition scholarship. Students with particularly strong numbers will receive even larger scholarships. You might qualify for a larger scholarship.

ViP wrote:UC Irvine has a free application and they will offer every single member of the next class at least a 1/3 tuition scholarship. Students with particularly strong numbers will receive even larger scholarships. You might qualify for a larger scholarship.

One big caveat here is that Irvine is new and not yet accredited; however, I believe you don't have to graduate from an ABA-accredited law school to sit the bar in CA, so this would only affect attempts to practice in other states, and only until they get accredited (which they very likely will).

For people content to stay in CA and aren't looking at the T20, Irvine might not be a bad choice.

bk187 wrote:If you're a CA native I'd take UVa at sticker over a full ride at any of those schools, but there is always the argument of higher ranking versus larger scholarship.

I'd rather go Michigan.

vanwinkle wrote:

ViP wrote:UC Irvine has a free application and they will offer every single member of the next class at least a 1/3 tuition scholarship. Students with particularly strong numbers will receive even larger scholarships. You might qualify for a larger scholarship.

One big caveat here is that Irvine is new and not yet accredited; however, I believe you don't have to graduate from an ABA-accredited law school to sit the bar in CA, so this would only affect attempts to practice in other states, and only until they get accredited (which they very likely will).

For people content to stay in CA and aren't looking at the T20, Irvine might not be a bad choice.

Actually, provisional accreditation is enough to allow students to sit the bar in any state.

UCI has applied for provisional accreditation. If it passes, it will be provisionally accredited starting next summer, at which point all UCI grads will be eligible to take the bar (not the baby bar) in any state. Of course, no one will have graduated from UCI by that time, so everyone will be good.

Exactly 2 years later UCI will receive full accreditation (assuming it passes all the tests, which even the most ardent naysayers don't doubt).

And I don't think UCI is for people not "looking at the T20," but rather students that want to work in California, want a top education, and don't want to be broke. Virtually every UCI student at the moment was accepted to a T20 or T14 school.

ViP wrote:Actually, provisional accreditation is enough to allow students to sit the bar in any state.

Well, they haven't yet received even this much accreditation, hence the risk.

Please don't quote this because I want to edit it out in a little so as not to out myself too much:

Edited

I know quite a few alumni from both USF and SCU undergrad as well as grad schools (law/business). The religious aspect isn't what you probably envision. I was never raised in a religious household and have little interest in it, and I'm applying to some Jesuit schools without hesitation.

Pepperdine has a real religious take. San Diego doesn't - it's totally secular (at least the law school). Don't know about the others.

These schools are all fine, but get a 165+ and a 3/4 scholarship. None of them are worth anything close to sticker.

And as a Hastings student, I can tell you that T14 is definitely a smarter choice than Davis, Hastings, UCI with money.

You could get enough money at better schools to make this a non-issue. Going outside the T1 with those numbers is just absurd. The GPA might be a little low, but if you're hell-bent on staying in CA the LSAT might make you competitive for a Rothman at USC.

ack wrote:Are there jesus crosses everywhere at these schools? I couldn't live with that, those things creep me out.

lol really? I'm not even christian and I think that's retarded

--ImageRemoved--

I can speak for Jesuit schools when I say that there won't be a lot of Christian stuff in class.

The most Christian influence you'll get at Jesuit schools is a huge emphasis on social justice and public service.

NZA wrote:I can speak for Jesuit schools when I say that there won't be a lot of Christian stuff in class.

The most Christian influence you'll get at Jesuit schools is a huge emphasis on social justice and public service.

This.

I have talked with Pepperdine, USD, and Loyola students when I went and visited last summer. All of them said the same thing: the schools are only religious for those people who want it to be. Pepperdine is probably the most "religious" of the three, but the 2L that I spoke to said that he is atheist and never once felt uncomfortable.

Basically, if you want religion to be a part of your education, all of these schools allow that to happen. If you don't want it to be, it wont. The only religious presence I felt when I was on all of the campuses were the chapels...but as I said, you don't have to step foot in them if you don't want to. I think religion is more of an undercurrent at all of these schools rather than the central force.

as a splitter, you probably will not get a full scholarship in california except at chapman. California is not a very splitter friendly state. You would do better other places