Top Law Schools

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Not this guy. Free ride for me.

HJO wrote:I can't wait to get out of here, and I have always planned on leaving after UG.

Sounds like you did the right thing. If it's the only T100 in your state, then that means you probably would have stayed in your state waaaay after law school as well.

I turned down the full ride at UC Irvine last year. Given the uncertainty about the school, not really wanting to live in Irvine, and the fact that I got into one of my top choices, it was not a terribly difficult decision. I do question it sometimes though, graduating without much debt would have been kind of nice, and it looks like they did end up recruiting a pretty good first class and will probably be ranked relatively well when they are first ranked.

HJO wrote:Does this scare you guys at all? I turned down a full ride to my local T2, only top 100 school in my state. I can't wait to get out of here, and I have always planned on leaving after UG. I feel really good about where i'm headed so it wasn't a big decision for me to make considering all you can do out of my state school is work in this state. Just curious about who all is turning down a free education, im sure with so many great applicants on TLS many of you are.

I might because 50% @ t10 > 100% @ t25, and let's not forget that a "full ride" is really only 100% tuition, which still leaves most people with over $10,000/year in additional cost of living expenses.

cavebat2000 wrote:I might because 50% @ t10 > 100% @ t25, and let's not forget that a "full ride" is really only 100% tuition, which still leaves most people with over $10,000/year in additional cost of living expenses.

This. I turned down "full rides" and substantial scholarships at a number of schools to go to a T10 school. If I had taken one of the full rides I still would've come up with close to $60K/debt (COL can go as high as $20K/year). I strongly considered a half-tuition offer at BC, but that would've still ended up giving me $80-90K in debt.

Having been here for a semester I'm very, very glad I paid more to come here. Of course, my circumstances are not the same as everyone else's, but I'm adding my voice to the convo.

vanwinkle wrote:

cavebat2000 wrote:I might because 50% @ t10 > 100% @ t25, and let's not forget that a "full ride" is really only 100% tuition, which still leaves most people with over $10,000/year in additional cost of living expenses.

This. I turned down "full rides" and substantial scholarships at a number of schools to go to a T10 school. If I had taken one of the full rides I still would've come up with close to $60K/debt (COL can go as high as $20K/year). I strongly considered a half-tuition offer at BC, but that would've still ended up giving me $80-90K in debt.

Having been here for a semester I'm very, very glad I paid more to come here. Of course, my circumstances are not the same as everyone else's, but I'm adding my voice to the convo.

Why do you think your school will be worth the 100k-ish difference between it and a substantial scholarship somewhere lower in the rankings? I'm not being snarky, I really want to know.

wakefield wrote:Why do you think your school will be worth the 100k-ish difference between it and a substantial scholarship somewhere lower in the rankings? I'm not being snarky, I really want to know.

It's actually a good question, and one I'm glad to answer.

1) ITE things are sucking badly for everyone, including current 1Ls. The lack of paying law firm jobs for 2Ls is making them grab up unpaid internships that traditionally went to 1Ls. This is making it much harder for 1Ls to even be considered for a lot of public interest internships, which I'm highly interested in. The fact that I'm attending a nationally recognized law school is giving us more options, especially since the Public Service Center is willing to leverage its alumni network to help those of us interested in PI to find jobs in what we're interested in. I'm still looking, but I have a feeling I wouldn't have nearly the same options if I were going to a more regional school.

I've also heard that at some regional schools it's turning out to be hard right now to find jobs no matter how well you do. Folks in the top 10% at ND have been shut out of jobs they wanted from what I've heard, and I've heard worse things from lower-ranked regional schools. If I'm going to take on any real amount of debt to go to law school, I want to do it at a place where I know I'll actually be rewarded if I end up being successful there.

2) Because of the flood of applicants some places aren't even interviewing at lower-ranked schools. One of the Federal Public Defender offices in this state (FPD is the equivalent of the US Attorney's Office, handling defense for federal crimes cases) told me he was only visiting my school because he could fill his internship positions with folks from here easily, so there was no point going to the lower-ranked regional schools in the area. I imagine this kind of thing is also going on elsewhere in the country.

3) IBR will help manage my debt if I go into PI, which is still my intention. Given that, I'll end up paying the same amount every month on my loans if my debt is $60K, $90K, or $150K. Running the numbers, given the salary of typical PI jobs I will likely end up paying the exact same amount over 10 years no matter which of those amounts I borrow, and the rest will be forgiven.

Essentially, what it boils down to is: I'll be much happier as a lawyer if I can get a job doing what I want, where I want, and I can leverage the value of the degree here and the alumni connections and networking I have here to do that. Is the debt manageable enough to manage that? My answer is yes.

There are risks (maybe I won't be able to find the job I want in a place I want anyway when I graduate, maybe IBR will go away and I'll be left shouldering a large amount of debt) but I have decided in my case I'm willing to accept those risks. That combined with other factors (BC would've had an unusually high COL, other schools that gave me full rides were in regions I really wasn't excited to live) influenced me to choose to come here.

vanwinkle wrote:

wakefield wrote:Why do you think your school will be worth the 100k-ish difference between it and a substantial scholarship somewhere lower in the rankings? I'm not being snarky, I really want to know.

It's actually a good question, and one I'm glad to answer.

1) ITE things are sucking badly for everyone, including current 1Ls. The lack of paying law firm jobs for 2Ls is making them grab up unpaid internships that traditionally went to 1Ls. This is making it much harder for 1Ls to even be considered for a lot of public interest internships, which I'm highly interested in. The fact that I'm attending a nationally recognized law school is giving us more options, especially since the Public Service Center is willing to leverage its alumni network to help those of us interested in PI to find jobs in what we're interested in. I'm still looking, but I have a feeling I wouldn't have nearly the same options if I were going to a more regional school.

I've also heard that at some regional schools it's turning out to be hard right now to find jobs no matter how well you do. Folks in the top 10% at ND have been shut out of jobs they wanted from what I've heard, and I've heard worse things from lower-ranked regional schools. If I'm going to take on any real amount of debt to go to law school, I want to do it at a place where I know I'll actually be rewarded if I end up being successful there.

2) Because of the flood of applicants some places aren't even interviewing at lower-ranked schools. One of the Federal Public Defender offices in this state (FPD is the equivalent of the US Attorney's Office, handling defense for federal crimes cases) told me he was only visiting my school because he could fill his internship positions with folks from here easily, so there was no point going to the lower-ranked regional schools in the area. I imagine this kind of thing is also going on elsewhere in the country.

3) IBR will help manage my debt if I go into PI, which is still my intention. Given that, I'll end up paying the same amount every month on my loans if my debt is $60K, $90K, or $150K. Running the numbers, given the salary of typical PI jobs I will likely end up paying the exact same amount over 10 years no matter which of those amounts I borrow, and the rest will be forgiven.

Essentially, what it boils down to is: I'll be much happier as a lawyer if I can get a job doing what I want, where I want, and I can leverage the value of the degree here and the alumni connections and networking I have here to do that. Is the debt manageable enough to manage that? My answer is yes.

There are risks (maybe I won't be able to find the job I want in a place I want anyway when I graduate, maybe IBR will go away and I'll be left shouldering a large amount of debt) but I have decided in my case I'm willing to accept those risks. That combined with other factors (BC would've had an unusually high COL, other schools that gave me full rides were in regions I really wasn't excited to live) influenced me to choose to come here.

Good post. I was originally determined to go to law school for free, but I've since come around to this sort of thinking.

Turned down a full ride at Cardozo.

vanwinkle wrote:

wakefield wrote:Why do you think your school will be worth the 100k-ish difference between it and a substantial scholarship somewhere lower in the rankings? I'm not being snarky, I really want to know.

It's actually a good question, and one I'm glad to answer.

1) ITE things are sucking badly for everyone, including current 1Ls. The lack of paying law firm jobs for 2Ls is making them grab up unpaid internships that traditionally went to 1Ls. This is making it much harder for 1Ls to even be considered for a lot of public interest internships, which I'm highly interested in. The fact that I'm attending a nationally recognized law school is giving us more options, especially since the Public Service Center is willing to leverage its alumni network to help those of us interested in PI to find jobs in what we're interested in. I'm still looking, but I have a feeling I wouldn't have nearly the same options if I were going to a more regional school.

I've also heard that at some regional schools it's turning out to be hard right now to find jobs no matter how well you do. Folks in the top 10% at ND have been shut out of jobs they wanted from what I've heard, and I've heard worse things from lower-ranked regional schools. If I'm going to take on any real amount of debt to go to law school, I want to do it at a place where I know I'll actually be rewarded if I end up being successful there.

2) Because of the flood of applicants some places aren't even interviewing at lower-ranked schools. One of the Federal Public Defender offices in this state (FPD is the equivalent of the US Attorney's Office, handling defense for federal crimes cases) told me he was only visiting my school because he could fill his internship positions with folks from here easily, so there was no point going to the lower-ranked regional schools in the area. I imagine this kind of thing is also going on elsewhere in the country.

3) IBR will help manage my debt if I go into PI, which is still my intention. Given that, I'll end up paying the same amount every month on my loans if my debt is $60K, $90K, or $150K. Running the numbers, given the salary of typical PI jobs I will likely end up paying the exact same amount over 10 years no matter which of those amounts I borrow, and the rest will be forgiven.

Essentially, what it boils down to is: I'll be much happier as a lawyer if I can get a job doing what I want, where I want, and I can leverage the value of the degree here and the alumni connections and networking I have here to do that. Is the debt manageable enough to manage that? My answer is yes.

There are risks (maybe I won't be able to find the job I want in a place I want anyway when I graduate, maybe IBR will go away and I'll be left shouldering a large amount of debt) but I have decided in my case I'm willing to accept those risks. That combined with other factors (BC would've had an unusually high COL, other schools that gave me full rides were in regions I really wasn't excited to live) influenced me to choose to come here.

Thanks for sharing that, you make a lot of good points. I'm also interested in PI, and I'm torn between keeping my debt down and going to the highest ranked school I'm accepted to. When I I know I'd pay 48k at Cornell vs 20k at W&M, it gets harder to continue focusing on the opportunities provided. It sounds like you made the right choice given your situation and goals, and I hope I can do the same.

vanwinkle wrote:

wakefield wrote:Why do you think your school will be worth the 100k-ish difference between it and a substantial scholarship somewhere lower in the rankings? I'm not being snarky, I really want to know.

It's actually a good question, and one I'm glad to answer.

1) ITE things are sucking badly for everyone, including current 1Ls. The lack of paying law firm jobs for 2Ls is making them grab up unpaid internships that traditionally went to 1Ls. This is making it much harder for 1Ls to even be considered for a lot of public interest internships, which I'm highly interested in. The fact that I'm attending a nationally recognized law school is giving us more options, especially since the Public Service Center is willing to leverage its alumni network to help those of us interested in PI to find jobs in what we're interested in. I'm still looking, but I have a feeling I wouldn't have nearly the same options if I were going to a more regional school.

I've also heard that at some regional schools it's turning out to be hard right now to find jobs no matter how well you do. Folks in the top 10% at ND have been shut out of jobs they wanted from what I've heard, and I've heard worse things from lower-ranked regional schools. If I'm going to take on any real amount of debt to go to law school, I want to do it at a place where I know I'll actually be rewarded if I end up being successful there.

2) Because of the flood of applicants some places aren't even interviewing at lower-ranked schools. One of the Federal Public Defender offices in this state (FPD is the equivalent of the US Attorney's Office, handling defense for federal crimes cases) told me he was only visiting my school because he could fill his internship positions with folks from here easily, so there was no point going to the lower-ranked regional schools in the area. I imagine this kind of thing is also going on elsewhere in the country.

3) IBR will help manage my debt if I go into PI, which is still my intention. Given that, I'll end up paying the same amount every month on my loans if my debt is $60K, $90K, or $150K. Running the numbers, given the salary of typical PI jobs I will likely end up paying the exact same amount over 10 years no matter which of those amounts I borrow, and the rest will be forgiven.

Essentially, what it boils down to is: I'll be much happier as a lawyer if I can get a job doing what I want, where I want, and I can leverage the value of the degree here and the alumni connections and networking I have here to do that. Is the debt manageable enough to manage that? My answer is yes.

There are risks (maybe I won't be able to find the job I want in a place I want anyway when I graduate, maybe IBR will go away and I'll be left shouldering a large amount of debt) but I have decided in my case I'm willing to accept those risks. That combined with other factors (BC would've had an unusually high COL, other schools that gave me full rides were in regions I really wasn't excited to live) influenced me to choose to come here.

+180

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I've lived in Seattle my whole life, and I would reccomend UW/Seattle U to anyone

but life is too short to spend it all in one place, especially when you have an opportunity like law school where you can spend 3 years in a city on a whim

I would prob turn down a good size schollie from Seattle U to pay more to go to school in cali/chicago (the other main places im considering)

Turning down a full ride from Baylor with a smile on my face

turning down a full ride at st johns even if it means i have to pay sticker for dozo

Halibut6 wrote:Not this guy. Free ride for me.

+1

Edit: Turning down full rides for a full ride.

Probably not, I will likely accept my T2 full ride.

No full rides, but I got about 2/3 ride to GW. I am not ruling it out but I am inclined to go to a T14 school since I am in at 4 so far. But GW's offer sure is tempting and it's going to be hard to turn down.

Sauer Grapes wrote:I'll probably be turning down a full ride from Baylor. I'm not 100% sure I will yet, but about 95%. I am going to withdrawal the day I know for sure.

+1 except im more like 99% but im holding out incase of something insane happens in my life and i need to go for the money.

I want to turn down a full ride to a new school thats a tier 3 in the region I grew up. Instead I would attend a top 50 for just under half tuition. However, my parents are strongly opposed to that idea. They feel that a free education is invaluable and they dont get caught up in the rankings. I feel like theirs some truth to that.

All the lawyers Ive meet went to tier 2 or tier 4 schools and have had succesful careers. They also dont work in their regions.

Despite this I just feel like I will be happier at the higher ranked school, living in a new world. Anyone

eberl032 wrote:I want to turn down a full ride to a new school thats a tier 3 in the region I grew up. Instead I would attend a top 50 for just under half tuition. However, my parents are strongly opposed to that idea. They feel that a free education is invaluable and they dont get caught up in the rankings. I feel like theirs some truth to that.

All the lawyers Ive meet went to tier 2 or tier 4 schools and have had succesful careers. They also dont work in their regions.

Despite this I just feel like I will be happier at the higher ranked school, living in a new world. Anyone

My folks are the opposite. They're on my case to take HLS over the Hamilton/Columbia. (Immigrant parents that are aggressive in pushing their semi-ignorant views FTW.)

I'm probably going to turn down a full ride, but I'll probably still have a scholarship wherever I go.

I just finished a financial analysis on Harvard vs the Hamilton at Columbia, taking into account LIPP and CLS' LRAP. Based on my own situation, the difference would be marginal if I made anything under $80,000 per year, which is the plan (PI or government). If I'm making anything over $100,000, I'm not going to be too concerned about paying off my debt.

That's just me though. I have no great desire to be wealthy and I'm comfortable living frugally.

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