Top Law Schools

I'm curious what the long-term prospects are for the T14, especially the T5 or so.

Is the current line-up basically perennial or do we have reason to think one school may go up or down as time continues? I have no idea how Yale will fare... or any other law giant. I have no clue about their endowments or how they attract and retain the best profs.

Absolutely no one will be able to answer this with any authority.

The T14 is made up of schools that have all been T5/10 at some point (or something like that). Obviously, these 14 schools are not all in the T5/10 now. Rankings change. Who knows how much in 15 years.

2025 is not that far away --- 15 years from now. For an idea, take a look at the rankings form 1995:

1) Yale
2) Harvard, Stanford
4) Chicago
5) Columbia
6) NYU
7) UVA
9) Michigan, Berkeley, Duke
11) Penn, Northwestern
13) Georgetown
14) Cornell

Heck, check the rankings from 1970 --- 40 years ago:

Brian Leiter wrote:In 1970, the top five law schools were Harvard, Yale, and Michigan, with Columbia, Stanford, and Chicago fighting it out for the remaining two spots. Penn was just on the cusp of the "top five," Virginia was clearly top ten, and then some mix of Duke, Northwestern, Texas, and Berkeley fought it out for the remaining top ten spots. Cornell was surely top 15, NYU might have been top 15, Vanderbilt was surely top 20, and Georgetown might have been top 20."

So yeah, in 2025 the rankings will be pretty much the same as they are now...

I feel like UCLA may jump in the mix sometime soon though...

No1ustad wrote:I feel like UCLA may jump in the mix sometime soon though...

Lawl no

The current tiers are:
HYS
CCN
MVPB
DNCG

I think Berkeley has the potential to drop down a tier due to steep tuition increases, especially if CA's economy suffers a prolonged decline.

Among DNCG, Duke and Northwestern are the most likely to move up a tier due to their small size and relatively strong biglaw placement.

Ray has the right idea in looking at historical rankings as a potential guide to future rankings. Although we can't really know how the rankings will change over the next 15 years, it's unlikely that there will be any major shake-ups in the top tiers (of course, I might well be mistaken).

There was a thread recently discussing historical rankings trends that might be helpful: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 5&t=103262

I might be wrong about this, but I'm pretty sure UCLA was in the top 14 the very first year, and then never made it back in. I'm gonna look and see if I can find out where I saw that.

Edit: Here's where I saw it http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... ?f=1&t=213
UCLA was #14 in 1987 . . . I'm sure it could sneak back in at some point

im_blue wrote:The current tiers are:
HYS
CCN
MVPB
DNCG

I think Berkeley has the potential to drop down a tier due to steep tuition increases, especially if CA's economy suffers a prolonged decline.

Among DNCG, Duke and Northwestern are the most likely to move up a tier due to their small size and relatively strong biglaw placement.

Well Berkeley is currently increasing its faculty by 40%, which should be a huge boost in expenditures per student (15% of USNWR formula).

jimmyd11011 wrote:

im_blue wrote:The current tiers are:
HYS
CCN
MVPB
DNCG

I think Berkeley has the potential to drop down a tier due to steep tuition increases, especially if CA's economy suffers a prolonged decline.

Among DNCG, Duke and Northwestern are the most likely to move up a tier due to their small size and relatively strong biglaw placement.

Well Berkeley is currently increasing its faculty by 40%, which should be a huge boost in expenditures per student (15% of USNWR formula).

That's fine as long as they can keep their numbers high and acceptance rate low, despite the steep tuition increases. I suppose they could always relax the holistic review and numbers-whore a lot more to achieve that.

Pearalegal wrote:Absolutely no one will be able to answer this with any authority.

The T14 is made up of schools that have all been T5/10 at some point (or something like that). Obviously, these 14 schools are not all in the T5/10 now. Rankings change. Who knows how much in 15 years.

I know how much, because I have recently invented a time-tunneling device colloquially known as a "time-machine." As a result, I already know how you are going to respond to this post.

Pearalegal wrote:Absolutely no one will be able to answer this with any authority.

I can.

The law school rankings will be irrelevant because the economy is going to go through a massive contraction primarily driven by the end of the cheap-oil era, and there will be more focus on independent subsistence farming and community economies rather than the bottom lines of multinational corporations like Wal-Mart. Prosperity will come to be seen as the abundance of food rather than the abundance of paper money. All cities, and especially the mega-cities will cease to exist as we know them, as they are unsustainable without cheap oil. No one will care how well you can draft a memo, but how well you can grow crops, build things, and attain clean drinking water. We are entering an era of less regulation, less centralized bureaucracy, and less lawyers bickering over building code violations. I'm glad I'm getting in on this law scam before it's too late.

--ImageRemoved--

ughOSU wrote:

Pearalegal wrote:Absolutely no one will be able to answer this with any authority.

I can.

The law school rankings will be irrelevant because the economy is going to go through a massive contraction primarily driven by the end of the cheap-oil era, and there will be more focus on independent subsistence farming and community economies rather than the bottom lines of multinational corporations like Wal-Mart. Prosperity will come to be seen as the abundance of food rather than the abundance of paper money. All cities, and especially the mega-cities will cease to exist as we know them, as they are unsustainable without cheap oil. No one will care how well you can draft a memo, but how well you can grow crops, build things, and attain clean drinking water. We are entering an era of less regulation, less centralized bureaucracy, and less lawyers bickering over building code violations. I'm glad I'm getting in on this law scam before it's too late.

ok.......

I'm thinking the T14 will grow more into a T17, with the T6 remaining the same, but with BMVPND being noticeably better than Cornell, GTown, UT, UCLA, Vandy.

Illinois will surpass Minn, WUSTL and ND. Iowa will decline to a lower T1. UC Irvine will be ranked in the 30's.

TL;DR- Cornell and Gtown become more like UCLA, UT and Vandy. Nothing else major happens.

I'm just trying to make enough money before everything goes to hell to build myself a bunker.


Apologies for attempting to de-rail this thread, but it is a really stupid thread.

I'm just trying to make enough money before everything goes to hell to build myself a bunker.

You should buy this instead of trying to build from scratch:
http://www.silohome.com/

nealric wrote:

I'm just trying to make enough money before everything goes to hell to build myself a bunker.

You should buy this instead of trying to build from scratch:
http://www.silohome.com/

that is awesome

No one wants to take a stab at this? Here's mine:

1. Yale
2. Harvard
3. Columbia
4. Stanford
5. NYU
6. Chicago
7. Penn
8. Virginia
9. Berkeley
10. Duke
11. Michigan
12.Northwestern
13. Texas
14. Cornell

bubba wrote:No one wants to take a stab at this? Here's mine:

1. Yale
2. Harvard
3. Columbia
4. Stanford
5. NYU
6. Chicago
7. Penn
8. Virginia
9. Berkeley
10. Duke
11. Michigan
12.Northwestern
13. Texas
14. Cornell

Prepare to duck from georgetown people haha. I foresee UVA moving up much like Berkley did in the past but being more stable. The dean is hungry for it. T6. NYU out of T6

YHSCCV ftw

1. Yale
2. Harvard
3. Columbia
4. Stanford
5. NYU
6. Chicago
7. Penn
8. Virginia
9. Berkeley
10. Duke
11. Michigan
12.Northwestern
13. Texas
14. Cornell

Egregious Texas trolling.

Prepare to duck from georgetown people haha

The list should be the following:

1. Georgetown
2. Georgetown
3. Georgetown (Special HYS replacement category)
4. Florida Coastal (Turns out for-profit schools produce excellent lawyers)
5. Harvard (living on in it's past glory)
6. Michigan (ditto)
7. The Thomas M. Cooley School of Law (Is now ranking authority after USNEWS went out of business)
8. University of Iowa (The midwest really is a great place after all)
9. New York Law School/NYU (they merge in 2020 for fear of name confusion)
10. UPenn/Penn State (Similar merger after people kept mistakenly driving west after landing in Philly)
11. People's College of Law (Socialism FTW)
12. Detroit Mercy (Detroit is back after Chevy Volt introduced)
13. Stanford (Hanging on by a thread after being bought out by Google)
14. Yale (As part of the takeover agreement with GULC, it was agreed that Yale would be allowed to remain in the T14)

Cooley will = #1

California will likely fall into the ocean by 2025 so Stanford, Berkeley, and UCLA are out. California online law schools will survive and flourish.

ogman05 wrote:

bubba wrote:No one wants to take a stab at this? Here's mine:

1. Yale
2. Harvard
3. Columbia
4. Stanford
5. NYU
6. Chicago
7. Penn
8. Virginia
9. Berkeley
10. Duke
11. Michigan
12.Northwestern
13. Texas
14. Cornell

Prepare to duck from georgetown people haha. I foresee UVA moving up much like Berkley did in the past but being more stable. The dean is hungry for it. T6. NYU out of T6

YHSCCV ftw

I'm with you on seeing Virginia on the up and up, but I think NYU will be able to remain T6 due to the location.

As for Texas trolling, I think someone will replace GULC and it will likely be UT assuming California continues to have money issues.

As for Texas trolling, I think someone will replace GULC and it will likely be UT assuming California continues to have money issues.

Nah, the Cali schools will do fine after charging 60k+ in tuition.

GULC could easily fix any rankings fall by adjusting the PT section.