2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

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bananasplit17
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2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby bananasplit17 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 1:30 pm

To summarize my situation into a series of steps:

1). Have taken the LSAT once. Scored 178. Have heard of others retesting when scoring that high but I don't believe a point or two higher would yield much of a difference. Besides, the retest could always be lower.
2). Have been a non-traditional student. Have had a series of health-problems. All my work experience has been before and within undergrad. I will graduate this December.
3). When figuring my absolute gpa with every transcript grade it comes to 2.79 because of a semester of all F's earlier on when I was ill. Applied for retroactive withdrawal at my university and was denied. Have a seven term trend of all A's toward the end.
4). Have seen individuals with a 3.0/178 receive acceptances at Georgetown, Cornell, and UVA, but cant find any statistics on LSN for anyone with near a 2.8. There isn't much difference in my mind between a 2.79 and a 3.0
5). I don't want to put law school off for a year or two longer since I am already in my late 20s.

So with a 2.79/178 and a rock hard addendum and upward trend towards the end. Do I have any hope for Georgetown, Cornell, UVA, Michigan?

If I blanket all of the T14, what would you guess the chances are of snagging just one?

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UVA2B
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby UVA2B » Sun Apr 02, 2017 1:35 pm

Your numbers put you at extreme splitter status, which are the most difficult to predict. No one can reliably give you chances because the sample set of available data is so small. Just apply broadly, and be ready for sticker shock if you do grab one.

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studyingeveryday
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby studyingeveryday » Sun Apr 02, 2017 7:04 pm

Something for OP to consider: would waiting a few years after graduating and distancing themselves from that GPA help them as opposed to applying straight through?

I don't really know, but if anyone else has any insight that could be good for OP to think about.

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laqueredup
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby laqueredup » Sun Apr 02, 2017 7:15 pm

I think when you get in this range, softs matter. 2.7/173 and in at uva, penn, northwestern and GULC. I think that my masters with a higher gpa and WE that is unique for a law student is what helped. I PTed at about 177 but figured that it would not be the lsat holding me back, if I wind up waitlisted at nyu I might try again in june.

etramak
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby etramak » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:21 pm

I don't know what I'm talking about but is this a case where EDing at Northwestern would be a good idea?

Edit: Just checked out the Northwestern ED graph on LSN. I had to go way back in time to 2007 but there are candidates with your stats getting accepted.

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HennessyVSOP
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby HennessyVSOP » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:34 am

etramak wrote:I don't know what I'm talking about but is this a case where EDing at Northwestern would be a good idea?

Edit: Just checked out the Northwestern ED graph on LSN. I had to go way back in time to 2007 but there are candidates with your stats getting accepted.


EDing NW would definitely be the best shot at a T14 here, as they are probably the most splitter-friendly, and would give the full dolla$ up.

However, outside of ED-NW, OP might benefit actually taking a lower ranked school, especially one which prioritizes high LSATs.

MyLSN has ≤ OPs numbers getting nearly 2/3 $ from WUSTL.
http://mylsn.info/8q6k0u/

As you get closer to OPs numbers, it looks more like a full ride.
http://mylsn.info/eqljoz/

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OneHandedEconomist
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby OneHandedEconomist » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:40 am

OP, coat the t20 (minus HYS) and try to negotiate with the huge amount of money WUSTL is gonna offer you.

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dbalkaran
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby dbalkaran » Fri Apr 07, 2017 2:26 pm

I'd be suprised if Vandy or WUSTL didn't throw $$$ at you especially if you have a good addendum explaining your health situation. Things happen.

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HennessyVSOP
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby HennessyVSOP » Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:49 pm

dbalkaran wrote:I'd be suprised if Vandy or WUSTL didn't throw $$$ at you especially if you have a good addendum explaining your health situation. Things happen.


i'd take vandy with 90k over Duke, NW, Cornell, or GULC at sticker

but reasonably anyone getting 90k at vandy should be able to ED NW for full ride

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Jack_Kelly
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby Jack_Kelly » Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:08 pm

Friend of a friend got into UVA with almost exactly that

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UVA2B
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:14 pm

Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.

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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby Hi-So - ArshavinFan » Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:35 pm

UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14

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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby jjcorvino » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:30 pm

Hi-So - ArshavinFan wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14


Just to throw a data point out there. I was denied ED NU this year with a 3.4/177 and 3 years of WE. Still got in to NU with a scholarship, but I did not get the $150k.

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UVA2B
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby UVA2B » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:35 pm

jjcorvino wrote:
Hi-So - ArshavinFan wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14


Just to throw a data point out there. I was denied ED NU this year with a 3.4/177 and 3 years of WE. Still got in to NU with a scholarship, but I did not get the $150k.


Thanks JJ. Everyone ITT was recommending the power of the NU ED and I was a bit incredulous because they seemed to conflate the general power of an ED with the specific power of an NU ED. Very edifying.

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jjcorvino
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby jjcorvino » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:40 pm

UVA2B wrote:
jjcorvino wrote:
Hi-So - ArshavinFan wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14


Just to throw a data point out there. I was denied ED NU this year with a 3.4/177 and 3 years of WE. Still got in to NU with a scholarship, but I did not get the $150k.


Thanks JJ. Everyone ITT was recommending the power of the NU ED and I was a bit incredulous because they seemed to conflate the general power of an ED with the specific power of an NU ED. Very edifying.


Yeah, I think I fell for that before this cycle too. I was contemplating not applying ED, because I was so sure that those numbers would get me it and I was unsure of if I would regret not seeing if I could get into Harvard or other top schools. I think ED at NU is way harder than their regular application. It is definitely a way to poach great numbers from the T6.

StetsonU
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby StetsonU » Thu Apr 13, 2017 2:53 am

I'm a bit confused. I was under the impression ED usually meant you receive no Aid, as they already have you committed? Can someone elaborate?

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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby AJordan » Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:24 am

StetsonU wrote:I'm a bit confused. I was under the impression ED usually meant you receive no Aid, as they already have you committed? Can someone elaborate?


NWestern's ED is unique in that it's a full ride ED. Like a previous poster said, a way to guarantee some high numbers poached from T6

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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby anyperson » Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:51 am

bananasplit17 wrote:4). Have seen individuals with a 3.0/178 receive acceptances at Georgetown, Cornell, and UVA, but cant find any statistics on LSN for anyone with near a 2.8. There isn't much difference in my mind between a 2.79 and a 3.0
...
So with a 2.79/178 and a rock hard addendum and upward trend towards the end. Do I have any hope for Georgetown, Cornell, UVA, Michigan?


I can't speak as someone who was admitted to any of these, but I hope this proves helpful nonetheless. I applied for fall 2015 with a 2.87/168. I was waitlisted at Michigan (and had some good conversations with admissions, but decided to opt off before summer). I at least received an interview invitation from GULC. From what I could tell, such interviews are generally promising and are for YP or borderline candidates. I imagine I was the latter. I was out of the country and couldn't shift things around to make the interview. I was rejected pretty quickly thereafter (they did not take kindly to my inquiry about an alternate interview date).

I was flat out rejected by Penn and UChicago. Didn't apply to Northwestern.

So, considering my substantially lower LSAT score, slightly higher, but still sub-3.0, GPA, and my "brushes" with success, I think you should have a good shot at at least one from your list.

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twiix
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby twiix » Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:27 am

UVA2B wrote:
jjcorvino wrote:
Hi-So - ArshavinFan wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14


Just to throw a data point out there. I was denied ED NU this year with a 3.4/177 and 3 years of WE. Still got in to NU with a scholarship, but I did not get the $150k.


Thanks JJ. Everyone ITT was recommending the power of the NU ED and I was a bit incredulous because they seemed to conflate the general power of an ED with the specific power of an NU ED. Very edifying.


I think applying ED is more to show them that you are seriously committed in their program, but just to increase your chance of acceptance, not so much gunning for the full ride. Unlike UVA, on the 1 in a million chance of them actually accepting you, you get serious scholarship money out of it. But more than likely you get moved to a regular applicant with an asterisk next to your name or whatever, showing you were committed to NU above everyone else. (that's my understanding of it at least)

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UVA2B
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby UVA2B » Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:35 am

TWiiX wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
jjcorvino wrote:
Hi-So - ArshavinFan wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14


Just to throw a data point out there. I was denied ED NU this year with a 3.4/177 and 3 years of WE. Still got in to NU with a scholarship, but I did not get the $150k.


Thanks JJ. Everyone ITT was recommending the power of the NU ED and I was a bit incredulous because they seemed to conflate the general power of an ED with the specific power of an NU ED. Very edifying.


I think applying ED is more to show them that you are seriously committed in their program, but just to increase your chance of acceptance, not so much gunning for the full ride. Unlike UVA, on the 1 in a million chance of them actually accepting you, you get serious scholarship money out of it. But more than likely you get moved to a regular applicant with an asterisk next to your name or whatever, showing you were committed to NU above everyone else. (that's my understanding of it at least)


Again, that's generally true of an ED, but not at NU. NU is looking to grab people with highly competitive numbers in both GPA/LSAT by offering free tuition out of the gate. No fuss, no muss, here's your free T13 education.

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twiix
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby twiix » Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:37 am

UVA2B wrote:
TWiiX wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
jjcorvino wrote:
Hi-So - ArshavinFan wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14


Just to throw a data point out there. I was denied ED NU this year with a 3.4/177 and 3 years of WE. Still got in to NU with a scholarship, but I did not get the $150k.


Thanks JJ. Everyone ITT was recommending the power of the NU ED and I was a bit incredulous because they seemed to conflate the general power of an ED with the specific power of an NU ED. Very edifying.


I think applying ED is more to show them that you are seriously committed in their program, but just to increase your chance of acceptance, not so much gunning for the full ride. Unlike UVA, on the 1 in a million chance of them actually accepting you, you get serious scholarship money out of it. But more than likely you get moved to a regular applicant with an asterisk next to your name or whatever, showing you were committed to NU above everyone else. (that's my understanding of it at least)


Again, that's generally true of an ED, but not at NU. NU is looking to grab people with highly competitive numbers in both GPA/LSAT by offering free tuition out of the gate. No fuss, no muss, here's your free T13 education.


Correct. That's why no splitters ever end up getting accepted as ED. They all get moved to normal applications, but at least they have a leg above the other splitters in the pool who didn't apply ED, because it shows that they are more committed to NU.

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UVA2B
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby UVA2B » Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:34 am

TWiiX wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
TWiiX wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
jjcorvino wrote:
Hi-So - ArshavinFan wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Did I miss some shift from NU where they started buying high LSATs with horrible GPAs via ED? The graph above, plus everything I've ever seen about super splitters at NU shows otherwise. My traditional understanding of NU ED was it was a full ride to poach students qualified for T6 and the like. That would mean like 3.8/172 applicants, not 2.8/176+. I don't know enough about the ED, but that's been my entire understanding about it during my time in the law school admissions game.


I mean it would make sense.
If top LSAT scores are down - its a way for them to grab high scorers w/o committing scholarship money so they work to solidify their LSAT medians while bringing up their GPA medians.

Lets face it - A T6 candidate in this climate might not be so inclined to go to NU Everything is changing it seems to me. It seems like this year GPA really overtook LSAT scores for the lower half of the T-14


Just to throw a data point out there. I was denied ED NU this year with a 3.4/177 and 3 years of WE. Still got in to NU with a scholarship, but I did not get the $150k.


Thanks JJ. Everyone ITT was recommending the power of the NU ED and I was a bit incredulous because they seemed to conflate the general power of an ED with the specific power of an NU ED. Very edifying.


I think applying ED is more to show them that you are seriously committed in their program, but just to increase your chance of acceptance, not so much gunning for the full ride. Unlike UVA, on the 1 in a million chance of them actually accepting you, you get serious scholarship money out of it. But more than likely you get moved to a regular applicant with an asterisk next to your name or whatever, showing you were committed to NU above everyone else. (that's my understanding of it at least)


Again, that's generally true of an ED, but not at NU. NU is looking to grab people with highly competitive numbers in both GPA/LSAT by offering free tuition out of the gate. No fuss, no muss, here's your free T13 education.


Correct. That's why no splitters ever end up getting accepted as ED. They all get moved to normal applications, but at least they have a leg above the other splitters in the pool who didn't apply ED, because it shows that they are more committed to NU.


Got it, you meant it more as an application strategy, not actually hoping to get the ED. I have no idea if that works or even helps, but there is some internal logic to signaling there. I'm a bit suspect that you even need to signal to NU (or anywhere) when you're a splitter of this magnitude, but no data refutes that strategy.

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twiix
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby twiix » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:06 am

UVA2B wrote:
Got it, you meant it more as an application strategy, not actually hoping to get the ED. I have no idea if that works or even helps, but there is some internal logic to signaling there. I'm a bit suspect that you even need to signal to NU (or anywhere) when you're a splitter of this magnitude, but no data refutes that strategy.


Yeah that sums it up nicely. I (as a super splitter from STEM) have no shot at ED. I think over the few months I've been lurking here I've seen maybe Spivey and some other splitters who posted their success stories outline the steps to help your chances as much as possible. That was one strategy that has stuck with me. I think Why X's, LOCI's work in similar fashion... just blanket everyone with as much fluff as you can to show them why you want to go to their school and hope they see something worth while in your application. The more effort you put in, the better.

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chargers21
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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby chargers21 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:56 pm

I applied ED to NU this cycle and did not get in at all, but was accepted to Chicago with a scholarship. Weird things happen

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Re: 2.79 GPA/178 LSAT any hope for T14?

Postby theventriloquist » Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:13 am

was if the OP was a black or hispanic? then what are his chances?




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