3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

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Neil_Gorsuch
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3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Neil_Gorsuch » Wed Mar 01, 2017 10:56 pm

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Last edited by Neil_Gorsuch on Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:09 pm, edited 3 times in total.

curry1
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby curry1 » Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:02 pm

Neil_Gorsuch wrote:I'm 167, 3.95. I just hit my third take - first was in September 2014 so I could still retake a fourth time - bu I'm wary about taking again even though in the days before the exam I was averaging 173 or so. I have great softs and work experience - domestic and international - along with a position as a fellow at a national security think-tank in D.C. in addition to my main job as a management consultant. I also did a pretty extensive undergrad thesis on Islamic Law in the Ottoman Empire as an additional academic cred.

What schools do I have a reasonable change at? I have thought about retaking and am confident I could improve my score to 170+ , but am nervous as to how a fourth take would be perceived. Any advice?


you would have good odds at the lower t14, but out at T6 except maybe chicago. If you truly were PTing at 173, you would be doing a huge disservice to yourself not to retake (you can still apply and go with your 167 if the retake doesn't pan out). Even a 170 would have you in at CCN and very good chance at H. If you hit a 173 the sky is the limit with your gpa.

http://mylsn.info/2713kt/

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Neil_Gorsuch
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Neil_Gorsuch » Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:13 pm

Please delete.
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curry1
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby curry1 » Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:16 pm

Neil_Gorsuch wrote:
curry1 wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:I'm 167, 3.95. I just hit my third take - first was in September 2014 so I could still retake a fourth time - bu I'm wary about taking again even though in the days before the exam I was averaging 173 or so. I have great softs and work experience - domestic and international - along with a position as a fellow at a national security think-tank in D.C. in addition to my main job as a management consultant. I also did a pretty extensive undergrad thesis on Islamic Law in the Ottoman Empire as an additional academic cred.

What schools do I have a reasonable change at? I have thought about retaking and am confident I could improve my score to 170+ , but am nervous as to how a fourth take would be perceived. Any advice?


you would have good odds at the lower t14, but out at T6 except maybe chicago. If you truly were PTing at 173, you would be doing a huge disservice to yourself not to retake (you can still apply and go with your 167 if the retake doesn't pan out). Even a 170 would have you in at CCN and very good chance at H. If you hit a 173 the sky is the limit with your gpa.

http://mylsn.info/2713kt/


Thanks! Just checking, but if I got 170 on fourth take, would it still be considered a proper 170 during apps time? Intellectually I understand this to be the case, but the spectre of fourth take has me a little spooked.


Yeah, with the possible exception of HYS, regardless of what schools say officially. But you really wouldn't be competitive for HYS without a retake. So there's really no downside.

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chargers21
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby chargers21 » Thu Mar 02, 2017 1:14 am

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Mikey
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Mikey » Thu Mar 02, 2017 12:17 pm

Basically what everyone else has said based on LSN. Okay shot at some of the mid T14's, and pretty good shots at the lower T14's.

If you were PTing around 173 though, you really should retake it if you think you can perform better on test day than a 167.

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Neil_Gorsuch
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Neil_Gorsuch » Thu Mar 02, 2017 3:45 pm

Please delete.
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LawTweet
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby LawTweet » Thu Mar 02, 2017 3:48 pm

Neil_Gorsuch wrote:I'm 167, 3.95. I just hit my third take - first was in September 2014 so I could still retake a fourth time - bu I'm wary about taking again even though in the days before the exam I was averaging 173 or so. I have great softs and work experience - domestic and international (worked with President, Minister of Defense in a Baltic country in addition to some other work on Middle East) - along with a position as a fellow at a national security think-tank in D.C. in addition to my main job as a management consultant. I also did a pretty extensive undergrad thesis on Islamic Law in the Ottoman Empire as an additional academic cred.

What schools do I have a reasonable change at? I have thought about retaking and am confident I could improve my score to 170+ , but am nervous as to how a fourth take would be perceived. Any advice?


My friend with similar stats and great softs got into Yale. Not URM.

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BruiseWillis
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby BruiseWillis » Thu Mar 02, 2017 4:13 pm

I had your your exact stats (probably a bit worse softs), decided to ED NU after my third take (for my second application cycle) and couldn't be happier. Currently I'd put you at pretty good odds for Chi/NYU at sticker, and money at lower T14s. That said, if you can retake before the next cycle it will do you zero harm and obviously the upside could be enormous.

baseballfan660
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby baseballfan660 » Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:15 am

curry1 wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:I'm 167, 3.95. I just hit my third take - first was in September 2014 so I could still retake a fourth time - bu I'm wary about taking again even though in the days before the exam I was averaging 173 or so. I have great softs and work experience - domestic and international - along with a position as a fellow at a national security think-tank in D.C. in addition to my main job as a management consultant. I also did a pretty extensive undergrad thesis on Islamic Law in the Ottoman Empire as an additional academic cred.

What schools do I have a reasonable change at? I have thought about retaking and am confident I could improve my score to 170+ , but am nervous as to how a fourth take would be perceived. Any advice?


you would have good odds at the lower t14, but out at T6 except maybe chicago. If you truly were PTing at 173, you would be doing a huge disservice to yourself not to retake (you can still apply and go with your 167 if the retake doesn't pan out). Even a 170 would have you in at CCN and very good chance at H. If you hit a 173 the sky is the limit with your gpa.

http://mylsn.info/2713kt/

he could get in at NYU also, someone with his exact stats, non-urm did get in there this cycle, and they were KJD

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Rigo
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Rigo » Sat Mar 04, 2017 8:55 pm

I could see you getting everything except HYS+Columbia. Money won't be that good until lower T14 and T20's like USC though.

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chargers21
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby chargers21 » Sun Mar 05, 2017 2:11 am

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Neil_Gorsuch
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Neil_Gorsuch » Thu Mar 09, 2017 3:52 pm

Before Harvard's recent announcement, I had been preparing to retake LSAT in June of this year. Does the announcement affect how I should be studying / my plan for applications later this year?

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Rigo
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Rigo » Thu Mar 09, 2017 3:55 pm

Neil_Gorsuch wrote:Before Harvard's recent announcement, I had been preparing to retake LSAT in June of this year. Does the announcement affect how I should be studying / my plan for applications later this year?

It shouldn't.

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Neil_Gorsuch
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Neil_Gorsuch » Thu Mar 09, 2017 3:57 pm

Rigo wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:Before Harvard's recent announcement, I had been preparing to retake LSAT in June of this year. Does the announcement affect how I should be studying / my plan for applications later this year?

It shouldn't.


Yeah, I think that's right. I'm just afraid the T-14 that they will follow Harvard's lead in the coming weeks / months.

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Rigo
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Rigo » Thu Mar 09, 2017 3:57 pm

Neil_Gorsuch wrote:
Rigo wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:Before Harvard's recent announcement, I had been preparing to retake LSAT in June of this year. Does the announcement affect how I should be studying / my plan for applications later this year?

It shouldn't.

Yeah, I think that's right. I'm just afraid the T-14 that they will follow Harvard's lead in the coming weeks / months.

The problem is that if you have a reportable LSAT score you'll likely be judged by that metric.
Hard to say since the policy change hadn't been implemented but I think that's the most reasonable prediction.

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Neil_Gorsuch
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Neil_Gorsuch » Thu Mar 09, 2017 3:58 pm

Rigo wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:
Rigo wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:Before Harvard's recent announcement, I had been preparing to retake LSAT in June of this year. Does the announcement affect how I should be studying / my plan for applications later this year?

It shouldn't.

Yeah, I think that's right. I'm just afraid the T-14 that they will follow Harvard's lead in the coming weeks / months.

The problem is that if you have a reportable LSAT score you'll likely be judged by that metric.
Hard to say since the policy hadn't been enacted but I think that's the most reasonable prediction.


Right, that makes sense.

Joined4Knowledge
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Joined4Knowledge » Sat Mar 11, 2017 2:56 pm

Aren't you about to be on the Supreme Court? :) Why are you worried about this?

SUPERCHEF
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby SUPERCHEF » Tue Apr 04, 2017 4:42 pm

Joined4Knowledge wrote:Aren't you about to be on the Supreme Court? :) Why are you worried about this?


+180

etramak
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby etramak » Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:09 am

Neil_Gorsuch wrote:I'm 167, 3.95. I just hit my third take - first was in September 2014 so I could still retake a fourth time - bu I'm wary about taking again even though in the days before the exam I was averaging 173 or so. I have great softs and work experience - domestic and international (worked with President, Minister of Defense in a Baltic country in addition to some other work on Middle East) - along with a position as a fellow at a national security think-tank in D.C. in addition to my main job as a management consultant. I also did a pretty extensive undergrad thesis on Islamic Law in the Ottoman Empire as an additional academic cred.

What schools do I have a reasonable change at? I have thought about retaking and am confident I could improve my score to 170+ , but am nervous as to how a fourth take would be perceived. Any advice?


You do you Mr Gorsuch but with your GPA and experience not only would I consider taking time off to retake a fourth time,I'd also throw an application to the one year MPP programs at Oxbridge

Alexandros
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Alexandros » Thu Apr 06, 2017 3:01 am

etramak wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:I'm 167, 3.95. I just hit my third take - first was in September 2014 so I could still retake a fourth time - bu I'm wary about taking again even though in the days before the exam I was averaging 173 or so. I have great softs and work experience - domestic and international (worked with President, Minister of Defense in a Baltic country in addition to some other work on Middle East) - along with a position as a fellow at a national security think-tank in D.C. in addition to my main job as a management consultant. I also did a pretty extensive undergrad thesis on Islamic Law in the Ottoman Empire as an additional academic cred.

What schools do I have a reasonable change at? I have thought about retaking and am confident I could improve my score to 170+ , but am nervous as to how a fourth take would be perceived. Any advice?


You do you Mr Gorsuch but with your GPA and experience not only would I consider taking time off to retake a fourth time,I'd also throw an application to the one year MPP programs at Oxbridge

+1

170+ would give you much better outcomes. You have an excellent GPA and killer softs. I think you owe it to yourself. The benefit of a higher LSAT greatly outweighs whatever negative four takes would have.

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Neil_Gorsuch
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby Neil_Gorsuch » Mon Apr 10, 2017 6:41 pm

Alexandros wrote:
etramak wrote:
Neil_Gorsuch wrote:I'm 167, 3.95. I just hit my third take - first was in September 2014 so I could still retake a fourth time - bu I'm wary about taking again even though in the days before the exam I was averaging 173 or so. I have great softs and work experience - domestic and international (worked with President, Minister of Defense in a Baltic country in addition to some other work on Middle East) - along with a position as a fellow at a national security think-tank in D.C. in addition to my main job as a management consultant. I also did a pretty extensive undergrad thesis on Islamic Law in the Ottoman Empire as an additional academic cred.

What schools do I have a reasonable change at? I have thought about retaking and am confident I could improve my score to 170+ , but am nervous as to how a fourth take would be perceived. Any advice?


You do you Mr Gorsuch but with your GPA and experience not only would I consider taking time off to retake a fourth time,I'd also throw an application to the one year MPP programs at Oxbridge

+1

170+ would give you much better outcomes. You have an excellent GPA and killer softs. I think you owe it to yourself. The benefit of a higher LSAT greatly outweighs whatever negative four takes would have.


Thanks everyone. I have indeed already begun studying for more than half a month to retake. Making a lot of good gains!

katthegreat11
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby katthegreat11 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 1:26 pm

Just saying, I had very slightly better stats (168/3.99) and got into every T14 except Yale (didn't apply). I think what helped me was my background in science and "application story". So your super interesting softs, as long as you tie them into a cohesive story of why you want to be a lawyer (along with your PS, rec letters, Why X essays, etc.), should help you outperform your numbers. Still great that you're retaking since you were PT-ing higher, just don't give up hope if your new score isn't as high as you'd like it to be.

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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 1:31 pm

katthegreat11 wrote:Just saying, I had very slightly better stats (168/3.99) and got into every T14 except Yale (didn't apply). I think what helped me was my background in science and "application story". So your super interesting softs, as long as you tie them into a cohesive story of why you want to be a lawyer (along with your PS, rec letters, Why X essays, etc.), should help you outperform your numbers. Still great that you're retaking since you were PT-ing higher, just don't give up hope if your new score isn't as high as you'd like it to be.


Did you have any other factors going for you (URM status, etc.)? Because those results are great, but they're also really out of the ordinary.

katthegreat11
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Re: 3.95 / 167 / Good - Great Softs

Postby katthegreat11 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 1:36 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:
katthegreat11 wrote:Just saying, I had very slightly better stats (168/3.99) and got into every T14 except Yale (didn't apply). I think what helped me was my background in science and "application story". So your super interesting softs, as long as you tie them into a cohesive story of why you want to be a lawyer (along with your PS, rec letters, Why X essays, etc.), should help you outperform your numbers. Still great that you're retaking since you were PT-ing higher, just don't give up hope if your new score isn't as high as you'd like it to be.


Did you have any other factors going for you (URM status, etc.)? Because those results are great, but they're also really out of the ordinary.


Nope, white girl. I recognize that my results are out of the ordinary, but I think OP's work/life experiences are also pretty out of the ordinary, and are things that T14 schools would especially value. Again not saying it's 100% gonna happen for him/her, and definitely think if they're willing to re-take they should (especially with their PT scores), but I think softs get undervalued on TLS and just wanted to throw in my 2 cents that I think my softs really made the difference.




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