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jj2hawks
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Opinions Welcome

Postby jj2hawks » Mon Feb 16, 2015 7:49 pm

Hi all! I am writing because I would love to hear everyone's opinions on what possible options i might have moving forward.
3.75 GPA
Taking LSAT in June. (Expecting ~165) Also not sure if I am being modest or the LSAT is as hard as some on this site make it out to be.
21 Year Old African American Male
Division 1 Football Player
Will be graduating my undergrad school a semester early.
Interested in healthcare law
Price is a huge factor, but would be willing to accrue an acceptable amount of debt at the right school.
NJ born and raised
Originally felt really strongly about Boston University (always wanted to live the city life but NYC has always seemed too hectic).
What would be the best way to go about deciding and applying? Would love the security of the Boston University early decision full scholarship if at all possible!

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Mon Feb 16, 2015 7:59 pm

Don't ED BU

Also get your pt average to 170+

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Dipper
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Dipper » Mon Feb 16, 2015 8:04 pm

If you can get 167+, you're golden. Do not ED anywhere. T20 will throw $$$ at you, and you can get a full ride easy.

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cc78
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby cc78 » Mon Feb 16, 2015 8:10 pm

Dipper wrote:If you can get 167165+, you're golden. Do not ED anywhere. T20 will throw $$$ at you, and you can get a full ride easy.


And the LSAT is definitely hard. It's not just hype.

Just to back it up:

Image

MattM
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby MattM » Tue Feb 17, 2015 3:23 am

I assume based off OP's thread he has not studied much for the LSAT.

I wouldn't "expect" a certain score until you have taken several practice tests and know what general range you are in.

Without even an estimate of the LSAT range you may fall into , it is virtually impossible to predict

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Clearly
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Clearly » Tue Feb 17, 2015 3:34 am

Have you taken a full timed prep test, or do you assume you're smarter than 91% of law students?

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romothesavior
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby romothesavior » Tue Feb 17, 2015 9:32 am

The LSAT isn't that hard. It is pretty learnable. That said, dont bank on anything. If you are in fact practice testing at 165 now, you could be looking at Harvard on down if you can live up to your potential in June.

Get your hands on the Powerscore Bibles and do as many practice tests as possible. Study your ass off. Every point could translate to tens of thousands of dollars in scholarship money, and you'll have a lot of options if you kill it.

iguazu
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby iguazu » Tue Feb 17, 2015 9:38 am

Study and take until you're high 160's and wait for T20 schools to fight over you. Agree with others...don't ED.

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jj2hawks
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby jj2hawks » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:09 pm

Sorry for disappearing ! But thanks for the input. I definitely didn't do a good job of explaining my LSAT estimate but I practice tested my first time at a 162 going in cold with no studying done previously. Between now and June I expect that to increase nicely. After more research I definitely feel as if I should shoot higher, with my eyes being currently on a school like UPenn (wonderful city & and close to my home of NJ).

js1663
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby js1663 » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:15 pm

If your diagnostic was a 162 you most definitely should not accept anything less than a 170+. At this point you should be shooting for HYS where you'd get that Boston life you desire, or CCN down with a fullnride only. Anything else would be a waste of your incredble stats/circumstances.

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ballcaps
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby ballcaps » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:21 pm

jj2hawks wrote:3.75 GPA

jj2hawks wrote:African American Male

jj2hawks wrote:I practice tested my first time at a 162


you will do very, very well. study really hard.

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Pneumonia
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Pneumonia » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:24 pm

162 is 99th percentile of timed practice tests for a first time taker. You did better than 90% of people who take the thing after studying, some of those for a really long time.

Anything less than 174 on the real thing and you're just admitting that you don't want to put in the work.

Take the advice here, study till you're comfortable at the 175 level, then come to Harvard or go to CCN for free.

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Hand
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Hand » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:27 pm

ballcaps wrote:
jj2hawks wrote:3.75 GPA

jj2hawks wrote:African American Male

jj2hawks wrote:I practice tested my first time at a 162


you will do very, very well. study really hard.


yes. (1) keep up that GPA (2) study hard (3) the world is your oyster

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eriedoctrine
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby eriedoctrine » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:33 pm

Score in the high 160s and hf at Harvard.

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Hikikomorist
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Hikikomorist » Fri Feb 20, 2015 11:28 pm

Pneumonia wrote:162 is 99th percentile of timed practice tests for a first time taker. You did better than 90% of people who take the thing after studying, some of those for a really long time.

Anything less than 174 on the real thing and you're just admitting that you don't want to put in the work.

Take the advice here, study till you're comfortable at the 175 level, then come to Harvard or go to CCN for free.


Source? That seems rather incredible.

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Big Red
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Postby Big Red » Fri Feb 20, 2015 11:51 pm

Take the LSAT seriously, and things are going to fall into place for you. BU is a good school, but it wouldn't hurt to dream a little bigger once you get that score. Maybe also try to find work if there's going to be an 8 month gap before you start law school?

But seriously, does Chicago just not exist to people?

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Pneumonia
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Pneumonia » Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:21 am

Hikkomorist wrote:
Pneumonia wrote:162 is 99th percentile of timed practice tests for a first time taker. You did better than 90% of people who take the thing after studying, some of those for a really long time.

Anything less than 174 on the real thing and you're just admitting that you don't want to put in the work.

Take the advice here, study till you're comfortable at the 175 level, then come to Harvard or go to CCN for free.


Source? That seems rather incredible.


No source, but I stand by it- I've taught several hundred students (I know, self selection), and the highest first time PT I ever saw was 159. That guy was to 175 literally three weeks later, after he was shown how to diagram games. 162 is incredible. I mean, most people miss at least 10-12 on LG alone their first time- that doesn't leave very many misses for the other 3 sections.

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Clearly
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Clearly » Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:37 am

Pneumonia wrote:
Hikkomorist wrote:
Pneumonia wrote:162 is 99th percentile of timed practice tests for a first time taker. You did better than 90% of people who take the thing after studying, some of those for a really long time.

Anything less than 174 on the real thing and you're just admitting that you don't want to put in the work.

Take the advice here, study till you're comfortable at the 175 level, then come to Harvard or go to CCN for free.


Source? That seems rather incredible.


No source, but I stand by it- I've taught several hundred students (I know, self selection), and the highest first time PT I ever saw was 159. That guy was to 175 literally three weeks later, after he was shown how to diagram games. 162 is incredible. I mean, most people miss at least 10-12 on LG alone their first time- that doesn't leave very many misses for the other 3 sections.


Agreed. When I first came across this post the specificity made me wonder if you had a source for that, but as an instructor myself I'd estimate roughly the same, maybe a bit worse. It's gotta be pretty rare for a new first diagnostic to end up around there. Although I don't doubt that those that do start off so strong aren't to be found in an lsat prep course.

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TheProdigal
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby TheProdigal » Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:51 am

jj2hawks wrote:Sorry for disappearing ! But thanks for the input. I definitely didn't do a good job of explaining my LSAT estimate but I practice tested my first time at a 162 going in cold with no studying done previously. Between now and June I expect that to increase nicely. After more research I definitely feel as if I should shoot higher, with my eyes being currently on a school like UPenn (wonderful city & and close to my home of NJ).


To somewhat counter the cheering section here: several years ago I pulled a 165 on a cold, proctored, PT. A big chunk of this was due to already being familiar with logic game-style puzzles. Several years later, four weeks of intensive self-study got me a 167 on the real thing. I'm waiting on February's scores and hoping to equal my highest PT at 170. The biggest challenge I've had studying is that I'm subconsciously going "don't worry about it, you know you already know this."

Don't let yourself cocky about a cold PT score and what it means for your future real scores.

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby PeanutsNJam » Sat Feb 21, 2015 4:02 am

You're black with a 3.75, and are a D1 football player (pretty strong soft). Just get 167+ and go to Yale/Harvard/Stanford, or Columbia/Chicago/NYU for free.

Hell, if you get lucky, some of the admissions faculty will be a fan of your team. That's like insta-admit.

Just sayin', even if you don't get 165, and get like a 163, apply to HYS anyway. Might get in.

iVi
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby iVi » Sat Feb 21, 2015 6:24 am

PeanutsNJam wrote:You're black with a 3.75, and are a D1 football player (pretty strong soft). Just get 167+ and go to Yale/Harvard/Stanford, or Columbia/Chicago/NYU for free.

Hell, if you get lucky, some of the admissions faculty will be a fan of your team. That's like insta-admit.

Just sayin', even if you don't get 165, and get like a 163, apply to HYS anyway. Might get in.


This. You're in a great spot.

Good luck!

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cc78
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby cc78 » Sat Feb 21, 2015 7:07 pm

PeanutsNJam wrote:You're black with a 3.75, and are a D1 football player (pretty strong soft). Just get 167+ and go to Yale/Harvard/Stanford, or Columbia/Chicago/NYU for free.

Hell, if you get lucky, some of the admissions faculty will be a fan of your team. That's like insta-admit.

Just sayin', even if you don't get 165, and get like a 163, apply to HYS anyway. Might get in.


Just to disaggregate a little:

163-164: Chance at Harvard.

165-166: In at Harvard, no full CCN ride, but you will get some cash.

167+: You rule the world.

Y/S: Who the hell knows, but S has been friendly to AAs with usual Harvard numbers this cycle.

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emkay625
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby emkay625 » Tue Feb 24, 2015 4:15 am

Pneumonia wrote:
Hikkomorist wrote:
Pneumonia wrote:162 is 99th percentile of timed practice tests for a first time taker. You did better than 90% of people who take the thing after studying, some of those for a really long time.

Anything less than 174 on the real thing and you're just admitting that you don't want to put in the work.

Take the advice here, study till you're comfortable at the 175 level, then come to Harvard or go to CCN for free.


Source? That seems rather incredible.


No source, but I stand by it- I've taught several hundred students (I know, self selection), and the highest first time PT I ever saw was 159. That guy was to 175 literally three weeks later, after he was shown how to diagram games. 162 is incredible. I mean, most people miss at least 10-12 on LG alone their first time- that doesn't leave very many misses for the other 3 sections.


This has to be BS. My diagnostic was a 165.

I taught only one class (13 students) and had 3 with diagnostics above 162.

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elterrible78
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby elterrible78 » Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:53 am

emkay625 wrote:
Pneumonia wrote:
Hikkomorist wrote:
Pneumonia wrote:162 is 99th percentile of timed practice tests for a first time taker. You did better than 90% of people who take the thing after studying, some of those for a really long time.

Anything less than 174 on the real thing and you're just admitting that you don't want to put in the work.

Take the advice here, study till you're comfortable at the 175 level, then come to Harvard or go to CCN for free.


Source? That seems rather incredible.


No source, but I stand by it- I've taught several hundred students (I know, self selection), and the highest first time PT I ever saw was 159. That guy was to 175 literally three weeks later, after he was shown how to diagram games. 162 is incredible. I mean, most people miss at least 10-12 on LG alone their first time- that doesn't leave very many misses for the other 3 sections.


This has to be BS. My diagnostic was a 165.

I taught only one class (13 students) and had 3 with diagnostics above 162.


I've taught a total of about 200 people, highest cold diagnostic I saw among my students was a 161 (though my own was a 166). Are you sure the three 162+ diagnostics you had were cold, no-prep scores?

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Pneumonia
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Re: Opinions Welcome

Postby Pneumonia » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:12 am

elterrible78 wrote: I've taught a total of about 200 people, highest cold diagnostic I saw among my students was a 161 (though my own was a 166). Are you sure the three 162+ diagnostics you had were cold, no-prep scores?


Yeah 3/13 at 162+ exceeds the expected distribution among actual test takers.

Whatever the real 99th diagnostic is (I'm happy to keep discussing it), 162 is really really high and OP should be going for a 180.




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