Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

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shouston180
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Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby shouston180 » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:12 pm

Hey all.
Applying with a 161 and 3.4 from University of Florida.
Understood that my score/GPA is on the low side, but I have very strong recommendations along with lots of job/internship experience.
Does anyone have an idea the extent to which that plays in to admissions for those schools? I've already gotten into a couple schools ranked between 30-60 but would love to attend one of my top schools.

iguazu
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby iguazu » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:20 pm

Doubt you will get in/get any money from these schools. Sorry...but everyone's going to tell you to retake and/or try to go to a strong regional coming out with little debt.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:25 pm

Historically, UCLA law prefers high GPAs in addition to higher LSAT scores. Wm & Mary is a reasonable target, while WashUStL is certainly possible.

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rondemarino
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby rondemarino » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:31 pm

shouston180 wrote:Understood that my score/GPA is on the low side, but I have very strong recommendations along with lots of job/internship experience.


These schools will not give a rat's ass about LORs/internships. Maybe at the end of the cycle when schools know they hit their target GPA and LSAT will they consider these things. You are a drag on the GPA and LSAT for both UCLA and WUSTL.

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romothesavior
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby romothesavior » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:33 pm

Even if you got in, none would be worth the price tag you'd face. Retake and reapply.

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Ron Don Volante
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby Ron Don Volante » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:39 pm

shouston180 wrote:Hey all.
Applying with a 161 and 3.4 from University of Florida.
Understood that my score/GPA is on the low side, but I have very strong recommendations along with lots of job/internship experience.
Does anyone have an idea the extent to which that plays in to admissions for those schools? I've already gotten into a couple schools ranked between 30-60 but would love to attend one of my top schools.

1. Go to law school where you want to practice. Seems like you're picking locations out of a hat: not a smart thing to do for professional school.

2. These stats are not good. If you want to have a manageable debt load and/or go to a good school, you will need to retake. Even if you get into any of these schools, attending would be a colossally bad idea: you're not going to get any scholarship, much less one that makes any of these schools worth attending.

3. Recommendations and internship experience are essentially valueless. You need to have done something truly exceptional to have "soft" factors overcome your subpar statistics. For normal people (like you and me), recommendations and work experience generally only affect an application if they are not present/are shitty.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:45 pm

Some internship experiences can help a law school applicant's chances if relevant to a particular practice area (e.g. meaningful innocence project work for one wishing to become a criminal defense attorney). Nevertheless, LSAT score remains most important, followed by GPA, then minority status, then relevant work experience.

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rondemarino
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby rondemarino » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:49 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:Some internship experiences can help a law school applicant's chances if relevant to a particular practice area (e.g. meaningful innocence project work for one wishing to become a criminal defense attorney). Nevertheless, LSAT score remains most important, followed by GPA, then minority status, then relevant work experience.


This is based on what exactly?

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Ron Don Volante
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby Ron Don Volante » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:51 pm

rondemarino wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:Some internship experiences can help a law school applicant's chances if relevant to a particular practice area (e.g. meaningful innocence project work for one wishing to become a criminal defense attorney). Nevertheless, LSAT score remains most important, followed by GPA, then minority status, then relevant work experience.


This is based on what exactly?

Nothing

CanadianWolf
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:53 pm

There are resources available that share this info. Try looking over some of the books on law school admissions written by former law school admissions deans.

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Ron Don Volante
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby Ron Don Volante » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:00 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:There are resources available that share this info. Try looking over some of the books on law school admissions written by former law school admissions deans.

Law school admissions deans, sans Spivey, always say this kind of shit. The wealth of data we have available does not corroborate it.

I guess LSN should add a category: "internships related to specific law practice mentioned in personal statement"

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ballcaps
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby ballcaps » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:14 pm

Ron Don Volante wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:There are resources available that share this info. Try looking over some of the books on law school admissions written by former law school admissions deans.

Law school admissions deans, sans Spivey, always say this kind of shit. The wealth of data we have available does not corroborate it.


this.

i love when people reference stuff deans say as evidence that admissions are "holistic." holism is romantic and sympathetic and attractive, especially to those who fancy themselves smart and qualified but lack the shiny numbers.

deans are the face of the admissions process, and the fact that the entire enterprise is, in fact, crushingly quantitative is/would be considered unsavory by most.

hence, lots of garbage about soft factors that is not at all supported by actual data.

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itskevin
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby itskevin » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:03 pm

I got into WUSTL with a 149, 3.88. Waiting on fin aid info coming this week hopefully.

I think you have a good shot!

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Rigo
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby Rigo » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:12 pm

itskevin wrote:I got into WUSTL with a 149, 3.88. Waiting on fin aid info coming this week hopefully.
I think you have a good shot!

They want your GPA. OP has nothing above median.
You need to retake though. Matriculating with a 149 coupled with that GPA is crazy.

Tomasz
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby Tomasz » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:27 pm

itskevin wrote:I got into WUSTL with a 149, 3.88. Waiting on fin aid info coming this week hopefully.

I think you have a good shot!


You screwed up.

No way you're getting anything from WUSTL with a 149. Maybe FA, MA, or PR minority boost, but even then... a 149 is very low.

Anyone who got a 3.88 can do better than 149. I'm guessing you didn't study very seriously? A single year off could be 300k equivalent over the next 20 years. Think in terms of that...

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ballcaps
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby ballcaps » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:34 pm

also this:

Image

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romothesavior
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby romothesavior » Thu Jan 29, 2015 11:26 pm

itskevin wrote:I got into WUSTL with a 149, 3.88. Waiting on fin aid info coming this week hopefully.

I think you have a good shot!

I'm a WUSTL grad who loves the school.

Even I think going there at sticker is a colossally stupid decision.

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Ron Don Volante
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Re: Chances for WUSTL, William & Mary, UCLA?

Postby Ron Don Volante » Fri Jan 30, 2015 3:26 pm

Put me in the "that is a colossally stupid, borderline suicidal decision" camp




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