167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

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theycallmefoes
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167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theycallmefoes » Sat Jan 11, 2014 12:59 am

I've been able to find some information about the likelihood of receiving scholarships at different schools, but I don't have a very clear picture of the amounts I can expect. I'm trying to trim down the list of schools to which I'm applying, and knowing whether or not to expect a scholarship/having a general idea of how much to expect would really help me.

I'd really appreciate any and all scholarship information for any of the following schools:

Cardozo
WUSTL
UMich
U of I (Urbana)
OSU (Moritz)
George Washington
BU
SLU
U of MO (Columbia)
CUNY
Washington and Lee
William & Mary
Cornell
Vanderbilt
St. John's
Boston College
Berkeley

Also, if you have any ideas as to other T1 or T2 schools with good public interest programs for which I could receive potential scholarship money, I'd love suggestions.

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Nova
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby Nova » Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:15 am

Check lsn & mylsn

nebula666
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby nebula666 » Sat Jan 11, 2014 9:41 am

Where do you want to work? This school list is nonsensical.

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AlanShore
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby AlanShore » Sat Jan 11, 2014 10:25 am

theycallmefoes wrote:I've been able to find some information about the likelihood of receiving scholarships at different schools, but I don't have a very clear picture of the amounts I can expect. I'm trying to trim down the list of schools to which I'm applying, and knowing whether or not to expect a scholarship/having a general idea of how much to expect would really help me.

I'd really appreciate any and all scholarship information for any of the following schools:

Cardozo - full ride
WUSTL
UMich
U of I (Urbana)
OSU (Moritz)
George Washington - in with $ but not sure how much
BU - 20-30k
SLU
U of MO (Columbia)
CUNY - just no
Washington and Lee - in with $
William & Mary - in with $
Cornell - likely in
Vanderbilt
St. John's - full ride but dont apply
Boston College - 20-30k
Berkeley

Also, if you have any ideas as to other T1 or T2 schools with good public interest programs for which I could receive potential scholarship money, I'd love suggestions.

added $ amounts based on my #s from last cycle; yours are a little better but reevaluate your list because you have some terrible schools on here

theycallmefoes
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theycallmefoes » Sat Jan 11, 2014 12:03 pm

AlanShore wrote:added $ amounts based on my #s from last cycle; yours are a little better but reevaluate your list because you have some terrible schools on here

Thanks so much for this! Really helpful. I've been looking at LSN like Nova suggested, but I really prefer to hear directly from people, so I really appreciate this.

Which schools do you think are terrible? Clearly you don't think highly of CUNY or St. John's (if you could elaborate as to why, I'd really appreciate it), but are there any others on the list?

I should add that I'm planning on doing public interest law (honestly, no desire to do biglaw whatsoever). The public interest focus is what brought CUNY to my attention. Plus, there's a large part of me that wants to live in NY, which is also how I started looking in to St. John's. I know CUNY doesn't have the best ranking or employment stats, but I've also heard that public interest jobs depend largely on the actual leg work you do while in law school (i.e., internships, etc.).
Last edited by theycallmefoes on Sat Jan 11, 2014 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

theycallmefoes
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theycallmefoes » Sat Jan 11, 2014 12:22 pm

nebula666 wrote:Where do you want to work? This school list is nonsensical.

This is a bit of a complicated question for me. Where I want to work - eventually - is NYC. But where I go to law school will depend largely on where I'm accepted and the scholarships I'm offered.

I should also mention that my list wasn't in any particular order. But, specifically, the school list comes from the following: desire to be in NY (Cardozo, CUNY, St. John's, and, to a lesser extent, Cornell); current location (WUSTL, SLU); relatively close to home (U of I, U of MO); Boston schools are on the list simply because I like Boston, but they're not that high on the list for me; OSU because I simply like the school, and it's not terribly far away (at least, compared to schools in the northeast); UMich for the same reasons (and also ranking); George Washington because I'd welcome the chance to go to school in DC if NY doesn't work out, and there are a lot of public interest internship/job opportunities in the DC area; fee waivers (Washington and Lee and William & Mary - at the bottom of the list, though I do like some things about the schools); Berkeley and Vanderbilt primarily out of curiosity but also due to ranking (probably am not going to apply).

BigZuck
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby BigZuck » Sat Jan 11, 2014 12:38 pm

Going to Ohio State and not intending to try and find a job in Ohio makes no sense.

At most, you should pare down the list to:
1. Schools that place well into the market you want to end up in
2. Schools that give out large scholarships to people with your number that can be used as pawns in the negotiations game

Lots of people say they want PI, how big of a commitment to that field do you have?

theycallmefoes
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theycallmefoes » Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:04 pm

BigZuck wrote:Going to Ohio State and not intending to try and find a job in Ohio makes no sense.

Honestly, OSU isn't one of my top choices. The odds of me ending up there are pretty slim.
BigZuck wrote:At most, you should pare down the list to:
1. Schools that place well into the market you want to end up in
2. Schools that give out large scholarships to people with your number that can be used as pawns in the negotiations game

1. What resources could I use to find these stats? Most of what I see is just "we have grads in 38 states, including…", etc.
2. That's partially what I'm trying to do. I worry, though, that because I'm applying later in the cycle, my scholarship amounts will be lower than someone who applied with the same numbers in October, for example. Also, what's the likelihood that schools will still negotiate with me so late in the game?
BigZuck wrote:Lots of people say they want PI, how big of a commitment to that field do you have?

PI is it for me.

BigZuck
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby BigZuck » Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:10 pm

Ok, then how much of a demonstrated commitment do you have to PI?

As for where schools place- by and large and for our purposes, unless it is one of the top 14 schools as ranked by US News, schools only place into the state they are located in. Meaning going to William and Mary and wanting to get a job in NY is a non-starter. Especially for PI, you're going to have to hustle and do things like internships and externships and volunteer work in NY. That would be impossible to do while living in VA.

If William and Mary will give you a large scholarship, it might be worth applying to as a negotiation chip. But not as an actual school to attend.

theycallmefoes
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theycallmefoes » Sat Jan 11, 2014 2:15 pm

BigZuck wrote:Ok, then how much of a demonstrated commitment do you have to PI?

Ah, okay. Though it depends on what you mean by "demonstrated commitment." My relevant experience is mostly social justice volunteer work - I've done some pretty extensive work with immigrants (e.g., free ESL help, assistance with citizenship paperwork, job applications, etc.), as well as some other volunteer work like collecting/preparing food for local organizations, etc. I did a heavily social justice-themed senior project in philosophy and a more obliquely related one in political science (broadly, dealing with gender inequity in politics). But I don't have any significant long-term experience (like work/internships) with non-profits/NGOs. My work experience is limited to private tutoring, and I did a 2-year unpaid internship with a political campaign, neither of which are particularly relevant to PI.

BigZuck wrote:As for where schools place- by and large and for our purposes, unless it is one of the top 14 schools as ranked by US News, schools only place into the state they are located in. Meaning going to William and Mary and wanting to get a job in NY is a non-starter. Especially for PI, you're going to have to hustle and do things like internships and externships and volunteer work in NY. That would be impossible to do while living in VA.

Wow. Okay. I had figured that most T1 grads would be competitive - with the right grades and relevant work experience, of course - even outside the state. For example, if I ended up living at home and going to WUSTL. This just makes it all seem so much more daunting. But I'm glad to have this perspective.

BigZuck wrote:If William and Mary will give you a large scholarship, it might be worth applying to as a negotiation chip. But not as an actual school to attend.

Good to keep in mind. Thanks.

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zhenders
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby zhenders » Sat Jan 11, 2014 2:34 pm

PI for sure in New York, with a 3.8 GPA: retake and apply for NYU with money.

From lsn.info, using GPA: 3..75-3.85 and LSAT 170-175:

6. NYU 109 9 0 92% 39%/$70000 53% 96 >>>>

Edit: for clarity, there are loads of acceptances in the 3.75-3.8/170 range -- the money probably starts in the 171+ range, but I'll leave you to plug those numbers yourself.

theycallmefoes
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theycallmefoes » Sat Jan 11, 2014 2:41 pm

zhenders wrote:PI for sure in New York, with a 3.8 GPA: retake and apply for NYU with money.

From lsn.info, using GPA: 3..75-3.85 and LSAT 170-175:

6. NYU 109 9 0 92% 39%/$70000 53% 96 >>>>


NYU is my dream school. But I've already maxed out my LSAT attempts for now - 1st time, wasn't feeling all that well and also panicked quite a bit; 2nd time I had a bit of a sore throat the night before, but I thought it was just from running outside in the cold air - turns out I had strep throat. That was an awful experience (score actually went down); 3rd time, I have no clue what happened. I averaged 174 on my last 5 PTs (all fresh) going into the exam. Anyway, I already sat out last cycle. I've decided, this 167 is it for me - I'm applying now come hell or high water.

Honestly, I'd go to NYU at sticker if I could get in. But I can't with these numbers.

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zhenders
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby zhenders » Sat Jan 11, 2014 2:47 pm

theycallmefoes wrote:
zhenders wrote:PI for sure in New York, with a 3.8 GPA: retake and apply for NYU with money.

From lsn.info, using GPA: 3..75-3.85 and LSAT 170-175:

6. NYU 109 9 0 92% 39%/$70000 53% 96 >>>>


NYU is my dream school. But I've already maxed out my LSAT attempts for now - 1st time, wasn't feeling all that well and also panicked quite a bit; 2nd time I had a bit of a sore throat the night before, but I thought it was just from running outside in the cold air - turns out I had strep throat. That was an awful experience (score actually went down); 3rd time, I have no clue what happened. I averaged 174 on my last 5 PTs (all fresh) going into the exam. Anyway, I already sat out last cycle. I've decided, this 167 is it for me - I'm applying now come hell or high water.

Honestly, I'd go to NYU at sticker if I could get in. But I can't with these numbers.



Don't say that. Make SURE you apply -- even with your current stats. Last cycle and this cycle were the best buyer's market cycles we've seen yet -- and this next one is predicted to be the same.

You're above their reported median GPA, and you are AT their reported 25% LSAT. That means 25% of people who got in had your GPA or lower -- so don't lose heart. I think if your softs are decent, you're a good writer and have good references, you absolutely have a chance. And, at sticker, NYU is head-and-shoulders a better idea than pretty much any of the other schools on your list for the NY market, friend -- even with scholly (except perhaps for Cornell, which you have a better-than-average shot at, probably with a bit of cash).

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TheSpanishMain
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby TheSpanishMain » Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:37 pm

Check lawschooltransparency.com to find out what percentage of the class ended up in what state. Looking at the school's website and seeing "We have grads in 38 states..." doesn't really tell you much. Yeah, there might be the random one person who goes to, say, University of Florida and gets a job in Maryland, but that doesn't mean that going to UF and wanting to work in Maryland is a good idea.You need to look at trends, not anecdotes.

theycallmefoes
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theycallmefoes » Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:49 pm

TheSpanishMain wrote:Check lawschooltransparency.com to find out what percentage of the class ended up in what state. Looking at the school's website and seeing "We have grads in 38 states..." doesn't really tell you much. Yeah, there might be the random one person who goes to, say, University of Florida and gets a job in Maryland, but that doesn't mean that going to UF and wanting to work in Maryland is a good idea.You need to look at trends, not anecdotes.


That was actually my point - that statements like that don't actually tell you anything useful. Sorry if I wasn't clear about that. But thank you for that site! Really helpful.

BigZuck
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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby BigZuck » Sat Jan 11, 2014 6:10 pm

zhenders wrote:
theycallmefoes wrote:
zhenders wrote:PI for sure in New York, with a 3.8 GPA: retake and apply for NYU with money.

From lsn.info, using GPA: 3..75-3.85 and LSAT 170-175:

6. NYU 109 9 0 92% 39%/$70000 53% 96 >>>>


NYU is my dream school. But I've already maxed out my LSAT attempts for now - 1st time, wasn't feeling all that well and also panicked quite a bit; 2nd time I had a bit of a sore throat the night before, but I thought it was just from running outside in the cold air - turns out I had strep throat. That was an awful experience (score actually went down); 3rd time, I have no clue what happened. I averaged 174 on my last 5 PTs (all fresh) going into the exam. Anyway, I already sat out last cycle. I've decided, this 167 is it for me - I'm applying now come hell or high water.

Honestly, I'd go to NYU at sticker if I could get in. But I can't with these numbers.



Don't say that. Make SURE you apply -- even with your current stats. Last cycle and this cycle were the best buyer's market cycles we've seen yet -- and this next one is predicted to be the same.

You're above their reported median GPA, and you are AT their reported 25% LSAT. That means 25% of people who got in had your GPA or lower -- so don't lose heart. I think if your softs are decent, you're a good writer and have good references, you absolutely have a chance. And, at sticker, NYU is head-and-shoulders a better idea than pretty much any of the other schools on your list for the NY market, friend -- even with scholly (except perhaps for Cornell, which you have a better-than-average shot at, probably with a bit of cash).


Yeah, I mean, definitely apply to NYU for the what if factor. But it's almost certainly not happening. I also believe someone (el terrible? Lsatscores?) did an analysis that showed that NYU was one of the least forgiving of multiple LSAT takers, but there might be some sample size issues there.

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Re: 167/3.8 - Scholarship odds/amounts?

Postby theonyxhotel143 » Sat Jan 25, 2014 2:56 pm

If you want to practice in NYC, definitely go to a NY school (NYU, Columbia, or Cornell). You have a really great shot at Cornell, but not so much at the other schools. Since you cannot retake, I would suggest going to Cornell, at least for your 1L.

If you do well in your first year, you can transfer to NYU or Columbia for your 2L & 3L years. As far as I know and from what I've read, schools do not give scholarships for transfers--therefore, T14s are very happy to accept a bunch of transfers willing to pay sticker. So, if you're willing to pay sticker at NYU and don't want to wait to retake, Cornell & transfer is a viable option.

However, I must say you might just find that you absolutely love it at Cornell and might decide to stay the full three years. (Disclaimer: I'm a Cornell 1L & I shamelessly LOVE my school...).




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