169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

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KatyMarie
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169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby KatyMarie » Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:58 am

Hello! First Post.

I'm applying for Fall of 2014 and would really like to get an idea about my chances at getting in/getting $$ at the law schools I want to apply to.

LSAC GPA: 4.0 (from GSU, a good but not very prestigious undergrad degree- a little worried about this aspect)
LSAT (first attempt): 169
Work Experience: At the start of law school, I'll have two years experience as a Litigation case clerk with a large law firm.
PS: About my work experience at the firm, I think, still in the drafting stage.

I'm applying to GSU as my safety. But I'm also applying to the schools listed below, and wanted to get an idea of my chances at getting in/possibly receiving scholarship $$. Money IS an issue.

Columbia
Duke
Emory
The University of Alabama
University of Georgia
University of Virginia
Yale (Shot in the dark to apply to HYS I know)

I'd really like to know my chances for 2014, and also if anyone would recommend continuing to work and retake the LSAT to try for something closer to 173.

Thanks!

nebula666
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby nebula666 » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:05 am

retake and go to YSH or other T14 for free is the only answer. You are only a couple points away.

Right now, you are pretty much a lock for NYU and below. Don't apply to anywhere outside the Top 14 except Vanderbilt given your southern ties.

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MT Cicero
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby MT Cicero » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:05 am

KatyMarie wrote:Hello! First Post.

I'm applying for Fall of 2014 and would really like to get an idea about my chances at getting in/getting $$ at the law schools I want to apply to.

LSAC GPA: 4.0 (from GSU, a good but not very prestigious undergrad degree- a little worried about this aspect)
LSAT (first attempt): 169
Work Experience: At the start of law school, I'll have two years experience as a Litigation case clerk with a large law firm.
PS: About my work experience at the firm, I think, still in the drafting stage.

I'm applying to GSU as my safety. But I'm also applying to the schools listed below, and wanted to get an idea of my chances at getting in/possibly receiving scholarship $$. Money IS an issue.

Columbia
Duke
Emory
The University of Alabama
University of Georgia
University of Virginia
Yale (Shot in the dark to apply to HYS I know)

I'd really like to know my chances for 2014, and also if anyone would recommend continuing to work and retake the LSAT to try for something closer to 173.

Thanks!

Others on here will absolutely recommend a retake, especially if $$ is an issue. I will agree with every single one of them. You've got months to knock the October test dead and apply plenty early.

I mainly replied because I'm originally from the 'Boro (Brooklet, actually) and most of my family went to GSU. I meandered north to Athens for undergrad though!

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KatyMarie
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby KatyMarie » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:27 am

Thanks for all the help with this! Sorry if this is a newbie question, but is there any sort of good way to figure out my chances of improving my score? I self-studied for a couple of months and took an 8 week course that ended right before the LSAT last time. I would be more than willing to invest that kind of time again before the Oct LSAT if it could significantly increase my chances at scholarship $$ to a T14 school. I'm just slightly terrified of getting a worse LSAT score the second time around...

jarofsoup
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby jarofsoup » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:44 am

I disagree with the retake mantra. You need to get your applications in at the way beginning of the cycle. So if you retake do not delay submitting your applications to law school because of it.

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KatyMarie
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby KatyMarie » Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:04 pm

I'll make sure to get everything in early either way. Anyone have any insight on my undergrad school? Does it hurt my chances at a prestigious law school that my undergrad choice was not as prestigious (I went on a Presidential Scholarship, they covered tuition/housing/computer etc..). Does my work experience help in any kind of significant way?

Thank you! :D

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Lavitz
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby Lavitz » Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:07 pm

Getting a slightly lower score shouldn't matter since for all intents and purposes, schools will look at the highest score.

I don't know what your chances would be since I don't know what your self-study methods were or what course you took, but I would imagine it's certainly possible to at least tack on an extra couple of points. If you haven't already, check out the LSAT prep subforum. Specifically, I'm thinking this thread might be helpful for you.

Even just a few points will definitely increase your chances for $$. This is you with a 169:

Image

This is with a 170:

Image

And that's just one point. This is a 173:

Image

You'll notice the odds actually went down for UVA with the 173, but that's because they yield-protect if your numbers are too high. As you can see, those who do get in get significant money, so you just have to convince them you're serious about attending, and being from the South, that shouldn't be too difficult for you.

Also, you should be applying to more schools, if only to use their offers in negotiations. I'm not sure why you would apply to Columbia but not NYU, and Yale but not Harvard.

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Samara
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby Samara » Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:09 pm

jarofsoup wrote:I disagree with the retake mantra. You need to get your applications in at the way beginning of the cycle. So if you retake do not delay submitting your applications to law school because of it.

Applying before the October results come back confers no advantage. Retake.

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Lavitz
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby Lavitz » Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:18 pm

Samara wrote:
jarofsoup wrote:I disagree with the retake mantra. You need to get your applications in at the way beginning of the cycle. So if you retake do not delay submitting your applications to law school because of it.

Applying before the October results come back confers no advantage. Retake.

+1 It's still early in the cycle when October scores come out.

KatyMarie wrote:I'll make sure to get everything in early either way. Anyone have any insight on my undergrad school? Does it hurt my chances at a prestigious law school that my undergrad choice was not as prestigious (I went on a Presidential Scholarship, they covered tuition/housing/computer etc..). Does my work experience help in any kind of significant way?

Thank you! :D

Not really an issue. I know quite a few people from large public schools got into HYS this cycle. State flagships are generally fine. Obscure community colleges might be a slight problem at T6, but that's about it.

You work experience is probably average for this site. Won't give a special boost, but definitely better to have it than not.

Ti Malice
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby Ti Malice » Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:55 pm

jarofsoup wrote:I disagree with the retake mantra. You need to get your applications in at the way beginning of the cycle. So if you retake do not delay submitting your applications to law school because of it.


How can someone who has been posting here for five years give such crappy advice?

arklaw13
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby arklaw13 » Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:13 pm

I applied this cycle with identical numbers from a non-prestigious southern undergrad. My results were pretty good, but I was wait listed at a lot of schools and never followed up because I wasn't interested at that point. I was admitted with Duke's non-binding early decision almost right away (never filed for financial aid, so no idea what kind of $$ I would have received), got $67k at Michigan that was raised to $120k after I send my withdrawal email. I was waisted at Stanford, Columbia, NYU, Penn, Virginia, and NU (didn't do an interview). In the end, I ended up choosing Vanderbilt. I was initially given $110k. Near the end of the cycle I was awarded a name-endowed full tuition scholarship with a stipend. If you hustle hard you may get similar results at Vandy if you send them a PS that includes something strong about why you want to go there. I'm happy with my decision. I probably could've gotten off the wait list at V and P, maybe NYU if I hustled, but the extra debt would not be worth it. In all honesty, I probably would have turned down Stanford if I had been admitted off the WL. I don't want $200k of debt when I might want to come back to a smaller firm in my local market. I also LOVED Vandy when I visited. Feel free to pm if you have any questions.

CupOfTea
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby CupOfTea » Sat Jun 22, 2013 2:07 pm

I applied this cycle as a retaker: low 160s to 174. Southern State School. 3 years work experience. In everywhere except Yale and WL at Stanford. Offered Ruby at Chicago. Will be attending Harvard. All that said,you absolutely should retake. The school won't hurt you, the retake won't hurt you, and if you consider the money that could come your way is worth a nice apartment paid in full - the time invested in just a few points of improvement is definitely worthwhile.

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MyNameIsFlynn!
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby MyNameIsFlynn! » Sat Jun 22, 2013 6:33 pm

1) RETAKE. As the myLSN graphs above show, 1 more point makes you competitive for H, 2 makes you a good shot, and 3 makes you a lock for H. Breaking 170 also makes you more competitive for S (who loves high GPAs like yours). As someone attending H this year with a 170/4, I beg you to retake your 169! There's no downside, and with a single point higher retaking could be the best decision you ever made.

2) Don't bother applying to GSU or Emory. You'll get far more $ at T14s (like UVA). On that note, write a good Why UVA to avoid YP and to get $. They love Southerners with high GPAs. If you really want at least one true safety, apply to UGA.

3) it's worth your while - just for negotiating purposes - to apply to the entire T14. Never know who's willing to pay the most for an awesome GPA and good LSAT.

4) you can skip Vandy. They cap scholarships other than the full ride at 110k, and the full ride requires a separate application with a bunch of bs-y questions

edit: after seeing dylanj's post, Vandy might be worth an app.
Last edited by MyNameIsFlynn! on Sat Jun 22, 2013 6:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dissonance1848
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby dissonance1848 » Sat Jun 22, 2013 6:52 pm

You have only one option here; RETAKE. Get a 173+, go to either YHS with need based aid (Yale/Stanford are worth more than Harvard), or a full ride at Chicago, Columbia if possible, or Michigan, Duke, Penn, Northwestern, UVA or Cornell for full ride.

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jselson
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby jselson » Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:33 pm

CupOfTea wrote:I applied this cycle as a retaker: low 160s to 174. Southern State School. 3 years work experience. In everywhere except Yale and WL at Stanford. Offered Ruby at Chicago. Will be attending Harvard. All that said,you absolutely should retake. The school won't hurt you, the retake won't hurt you, and if you consider the money that could come your way is worth a nice apartment paid in full - the time invested in just a few points of improvement is definitely worthwhile.


OP, please read this post over and over again.

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KatyMarie
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby KatyMarie » Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:53 am

Thank you so much for all the help! I had no idea about that website either, so that's nice to know :) Glad I posted when I did, because I definitely have some rethinking to do. I've emailed a couple of LSAT tutors to figure out the best plan of action for taking the October LSAT since it's only 3 months away now. Eek. I guess I was just too scared of getting lower than a 169 to try to improve it any. Guess I'm onto the LSAT Prep forums now!

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twenty
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby twenty » Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:21 pm

I'd certainly consider ED to Northwestern with a 170 if money's that big of an issue for you. With a 170/4.0, there's a good chance you get a lot of money somewhere else, but NU is a solid enough school to mitigate that.

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jbagelboy
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Re: 169/4.0/Legal Work Experience

Postby jbagelboy » Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:23 pm

There were several 169/4.0+ in at Harvard this cycle. Not a common occurence, though. A few more points and you can lock it up.




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