4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

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Rahviveh
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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:35 pm

delarge3 wrote:2.5 months (started mid sept. 2012)


That's pretty good. You realize a few more points puts you in play for a Hamilton? Ask yourself if 150k is worth a couple more months of studying. I think you can definitely do better. I plateaued at around the same place and it took some time to break through, but it does happen.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby delarge3 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:37 pm

francesfarmer wrote:I think its still crazy to only take 7 PTs. You will underperform if you aren't used to taking an entire 5 section test (and at 8 in the morning to boot).


so 7 PTs are not enough to get comfy with the length? I was maintainig stamina, most of my mistakes usually came early (1st section). This was also true on test day (7 wrong on first section, 8 wrong rest of the test).

That's pretty good. You realize a few more points puts you in play for a Hamilton? Ask yourself if 150k is worth a couple more months of studying. I think you can definitely do better. I plateaued at around the same place and it took some time to break through, but it does happen.


how much longer? I just don't see the point if employment prospects from low-T14 with good $$ are good for me

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:41 pm

delarge3 wrote:
francesfarmer wrote:I think its still crazy to only take 7 PTs. You will underperform if you aren't used to taking an entire 5 section test (and at 8 in the morning to boot).


so 7 PTs are not enough to get comfy with the length? I was maintainig stamina, most of my mistakes usually came early (1st section). This was also true on test day (7 wrong on first section, 8 wrong rest of the test).

That's pretty good. You realize a few more points puts you in play for a Hamilton? Ask yourself if 150k is worth a couple more months of studying. I think you can definitely do better. I plateaued at around the same place and it took some time to break through, but it does happen.


how much longer? I just don't see the point if employment prospects from low-T14 with good $$ are good for me


Because you started a thread with "Stanford/CLS" in the title. You're not getting into Stanford and CLS will probably be at sticker or near sticker.

Also, even at a lower T14 a 170+ score could double the $$ you're getting

*shrug* Up to you dude. Even a few more months of studying seems worth it to lock down tens of thousands of dollars.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby delarge3 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:55 pm

ChampagnePapi wrote:
delarge3 wrote:
francesfarmer wrote:I think its still crazy to only take 7 PTs. You will underperform if you aren't used to taking an entire 5 section test (and at 8 in the morning to boot).


so 7 PTs are not enough to get comfy with the length? I was maintainig stamina, most of my mistakes usually came early (1st section). This was also true on test day (7 wrong on first section, 8 wrong rest of the test).

That's pretty good. You realize a few more points puts you in play for a Hamilton? Ask yourself if 150k is worth a couple more months of studying. I think you can definitely do better. I plateaued at around the same place and it took some time to break through, but it does happen.


how much longer? I just don't see the point if employment prospects from low-T14 with good $$ are good for me


Because you started a thread with "Stanford/CLS" in the title. You're not getting into Stanford and CLS will probably be at sticker or near sticker.

Also, even at a lower T14 a 170+ score could double the $$ you're getting

*shrug* Up to you dude. Even a few more months of studying seems worth it to lock down tens of thousands of dollars.


I wanted to see if I should even send apps... but I get what you're saying

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Rahviveh
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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:56 pm

delarge3 wrote:
ChampagnePapi wrote:
delarge3 wrote:
francesfarmer wrote:I think its still crazy to only take 7 PTs. You will underperform if you aren't used to taking an entire 5 section test (and at 8 in the morning to boot).


so 7 PTs are not enough to get comfy with the length? I was maintainig stamina, most of my mistakes usually came early (1st section). This was also true on test day (7 wrong on first section, 8 wrong rest of the test).

That's pretty good. You realize a few more points puts you in play for a Hamilton? Ask yourself if 150k is worth a couple more months of studying. I think you can definitely do better. I plateaued at around the same place and it took some time to break through, but it does happen.


how much longer? I just don't see the point if employment prospects from low-T14 with good $$ are good for me


Because you started a thread with "Stanford/CLS" in the title. You're not getting into Stanford and CLS will probably be at sticker or near sticker.

Also, even at a lower T14 a 170+ score could double the $$ you're getting

*shrug* Up to you dude. Even a few more months of studying seems worth it to lock down tens of thousands of dollars.


I wanted to see if I should even send apps... but I get what you're saying


You should still send apps regardless because you never know.

Maybe try applying and studying for June, take it again, and then re-evaluate at that point?

Either way, you still got great numbers, so good luck!

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby delarge3 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:00 pm

Maybe try applying and studying for June, take it again, and then re-evaluate at that point?


Ha that's not the worst idea. But don't law schools want a yes/no before the end of June?

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:13 pm

delarge3 wrote:
Maybe try applying and studying for June, take it again, and then re-evaluate at that point?


Ha that's not the worst idea. But don't law schools want a yes/no before the end of June?


Yeah, but let's say you deposit at Michigan or whatever. You got $500-800 down, which is a lot of money, to go to Michigan with a $45,000 scholly (What someone with close to your numbers got last year http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com/luxxe )

Then you get your score back a couple weeks later and its a 173.

I can tell you right now you aint going to Michigan anymore... :lol:

Its worth a try, and if you wait till June you can spread out your studying more so its not so stressful. Plus, the fact that you're already in a good position takes a LOT of stress and anxiety away from the test, which is the main reason people underperform.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby delarge3 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:22 pm

Its worth a try, and if you wait till June you can spread out your studying more so its not so stressful. Plus, the fact that you're already in a good position takes a LOT of stress and anxiety away from the test, which is the main reason people underperform.


This seems like excellent advice. Thanks!

has anyone done this before? Will the retake matter if I score lower (but have already put a deposit down and practically started at a Michigan or a Georgetown)? Is it a totally dick move?

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:24 pm

delarge3 wrote:
Its worth a try, and if you wait till June you can spread out your studying more so its not so stressful. Plus, the fact that you're already in a good position takes a LOT of stress and anxiety away from the test, which is the main reason people underperform.


This seems like excellent advice. Thanks!

has anyone done this before? Will the retake matter if I score lower (but have already put a deposit down and practically started at a Michigan or a Georgetown)? Is it a totally dick move?


No, because only your highest score counts against their median.

If you get a higher score and try to withdraw they could even throw you more money. That's happened before as well

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Jcastro1 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:31 pm

OP,

I have friends who got into Yale and Harvard without 170s (closer to high 160s) but had great GPAs and softs. If you don't want to retake, don't. But write a killer application.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:34 pm

Jcastro1 wrote:OP,

I have friends who got into Yale and Harvard without 170s (closer to high 160s) but had great GPAs and softs. If you don't want to retake, don't. But write a killer application.


*FACEPALM*

I just spent the past 20 minutes convincing this guy to retake and you undid it all with your shitty anecdote.

He CAN get into H and S with his current stats, its just very unlikely whereas a few more points make it a lock (or as close to a lock as you can be when it comes to H and S). Killer essays, while important, never impact your app as much as a higher LSAT

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby delarge3 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:42 pm

ChampagnePapi wrote:
Jcastro1 wrote:OP,

I have friends who got into Yale and Harvard without 170s (closer to high 160s) but had great GPAs and softs. If you don't want to retake, don't. But write a killer application.


*FACEPALM*

I just spent the past 20 minutes convincing this guy to retake and you undid it all with your shitty anecdote.

He CAN get into H and S with his current stats, its just very unlikely whereas a few more points make it a lock (or as close to a lock as you can be when it comes to H and S). Killer essays, while important, never impact your app as much as a higher LSAT


This is hilarious.

I think it's kind of a joke that we're talking about retakes for people already in the top 5%, but I get that it's a game and you have to play it. Papi gave me a good enough reason to retake in June which I haven't thought about. Right now it's more about the money than about getting in for me

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Ti Malice » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:53 pm

Jcastro1 wrote:OP,

I have friends who got into Yale and Harvard without 170s (closer to high 160s) but had great GPAs and softs. If you don't want to retake, don't. But write a killer application.


Take a lap, dude. Awful post.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby NoodleyOne » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:56 pm

delarge3 wrote:
ChampagnePapi wrote:
Jcastro1 wrote:OP,

I have friends who got into Yale and Harvard without 170s (closer to high 160s) but had great GPAs and softs. If you don't want to retake, don't. But write a killer application.


*FACEPALM*

I just spent the past 20 minutes convincing this guy to retake and you undid it all with your shitty anecdote.

He CAN get into H and S with his current stats, its just very unlikely whereas a few more points make it a lock (or as close to a lock as you can be when it comes to H and S). Killer essays, while important, never impact your app as much as a higher LSAT


This is hilarious.

I think it's kind of a joke that we're talking about retakes for people already in the top 5%, but I get that it's a game and you have to play it. Papi gave me a good enough reason to retake in June which I haven't thought about. Right now it's more about the money than about getting in for me


I retook a 96%tile

I don't regret it. Put in the work, dude. The LSAT is learnable and it bumped me from an accept at a school to a huge scholly at that school with options for higher ranked schools. A few hundred dollars could net you over $100,000.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby TripTrip » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:02 pm

Whoa, whoa whoa, HOLD IT. OP, you did SEVEN prep tests? That's it?! 168 is NOT a good representation of your potential. Actually, we're more twins than I thought. Seven is about how many PTs I did to get a 168. Truly studying for the LSAT means working through 30-40 preptests. I worked through over 4000 LSAT questions studying for that 175. Here's a picture of my study materials:
Image
Is it a lot of work? Yes. It sucks. However, think about it like this: now I can get a full-ride scholarship, saving me ~$200,000. I studying for about two months for that $200,000. Think about that for a second. I made $100,000 per month of studying. Do you make $100,000/month? Will you ever be given the opportunity to make $100,000/month again? Not likely. (Unless you make partner after going to a top-notch law school!)

Also, a 175 is not as hard to get as it seems. It takes a lot of work, but there's still wiggle room. I bombed an entire logic game and went -6 on LG... and still got a 175. (The wait for scores SUCKED.) If law school is what you want to do, you owe it to yourself to retake.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Verity » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:20 pm

What is wrong with people?! I keep seeing OPs like this one passing up literally hundreds of thousands of dollars just to make a hasty decision. You can't reason with these people. They don't listen to those who actually know what they're talking about.

OP, live up to your LSAT and beyond by taking our advice, studying a bit more, retaking, getting a higher score, and saving yourself MASSIVE debt while opening more doors of opportunity. Have some foresight - or at least, take ours.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:24 pm

Verity wrote:What is wrong with people?! I keep seeing OPs like this one passing up literally hundreds of thousands of dollars just to make a hasty decision. You can't reason with these people. They don't listen to those who actually know what they're talking about.

OP, live up to your LSAT and beyond by taking our advice, studying a bit more, retaking, getting a higher score, and saving yourself MASSIVE debt while opening more doors of opportunity. Have some foresight - or at least, take ours.

This is unreasonable. The OP is listening.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby suralin » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:35 pm

ChampagnePapi wrote:
Verity wrote:What is wrong with people?! I keep seeing OPs like this one passing up literally hundreds of thousands of dollars just to make a hasty decision. You can't reason with these people. They don't listen to those who actually know what they're talking about.

OP, live up to your LSAT and beyond by taking our advice, studying a bit more, retaking, getting a higher score, and saving yourself MASSIVE debt while opening more doors of opportunity. Have some foresight - or at least, take ours.

This is unreasonable. The OP is listening.


Agreed. OP is being reasonable, I have faith in him making the right decision.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby delarge3 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:46 pm

Thank you Suralin and Papi for having my back.

Now I'm in a bit of a dilemma: Feb or June? Naturally, I'd rather retake in June, but do people think it's too late for extra money (assuming I already get in to my top choices, which do not include HYS)

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Rahviveh
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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:25 pm

delarge3 wrote:Thank you Suralin and Papi for having my back.

Now I'm in a bit of a dilemma: Feb or June? Naturally, I'd rather retake in June, but do people think it's too late for extra money (assuming I already get in to my top choices, which do not include HYS)

Not to late. If you have the numbers it doesn't matter. People were getting money off the wait list in August last year

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby timbs4339 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:17 pm

OP: It took me about 12-15 tests before I saw much improvement. I took 25 in total- went from a 168/169 to a 175 and got CLS with 1/2 $ and this was back in 2008.

I know friends who are paying essentially 80% of their 160K income to the government (over 200K loans+fed/state/city taxes) and burning 80 hour weeks for the privilege. It's hard to describe unless you talk to those people. I thank god every day I started studying a month or two earlier and burned through all my preptests, getting me the score I need for a significant scholly. Now, I don't have to live like a student for 5-6 years after LS before that debt is paid off.

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby delarge3 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 7:22 pm

timbs4339 wrote:OP: It took me about 12-15 tests before I saw much improvement. I took 25 in total- went from a 168/169 to a 175 and got CLS with 1/2 $ and this was back in 2008.

I know friends who are paying essentially 80% of their 160K income to the government (over 200K loans+fed/state/city taxes) and burning 80 hour weeks for the privilege. It's hard to describe unless you talk to those people. I thank god every day I started studying a month or two earlier and burned through all my preptests, getting me the score I need for a significant scholly. Now, I don't have to live like a student for 5-6 years after LS before that debt is paid off.


Thanks for the encouragement... still kind of bummed about opening the LSAT prep books again though. Figured I can take a few more weeks off if I'm going for June right?

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Re: 4.07 LSAC GPA, 168 LSAT-- Stanford/CLS??

Postby Ti Malice » Fri Jan 04, 2013 7:52 pm

delarge3 wrote:
timbs4339 wrote:OP: It took me about 12-15 tests before I saw much improvement. I took 25 in total- went from a 168/169 to a 175 and got CLS with 1/2 $ and this was back in 2008.

I know friends who are paying essentially 80% of their 160K income to the government (over 200K loans+fed/state/city taxes) and burning 80 hour weeks for the privilege. It's hard to describe unless you talk to those people. I thank god every day I started studying a month or two earlier and burned through all my preptests, getting me the score I need for a significant scholly. Now, I don't have to live like a student for 5-6 years after LS before that debt is paid off.


Thanks for the encouragement... still kind of bummed about opening the LSAT prep books again though. Figured I can take a few more weeks off if I'm going for June right?


Yes, you should take a few weeks off. Avoiding burnout is essential.




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