Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Not sure where your numbers will get you? Dying to know where you stand? Come have your palms read by your fellow posters!
silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 3:54 pm

Ok I am wondering what to do here, I live in southern Ill, and I want to go to law school either here in IL, on Indiana, or Kentucky, and maybe Missouri. I did well as an undergrad (3.5 GPA), and I am registered to take the June LSAT. Problem is this is my third week of study, and I am consistently getting 148-149 on practice test, mainly because I am not finishing them and I don’t guess I only answer what I have time for. I can only get about 2 of the logic games done in the 35 minutes. I do ok on the analytical sections (usually about 15 to 18 right). And the reading section I usually get only about 13 but I think it’s because it’s been toward the end on most of my practice test and I am losing steam. Anyway, I feel like it would be stupid to back out of the LSAT, so I need any pointers to get me a better score before June 11, and I need to know where I could realistically get into in the states I want to go to given my current cores, (I’m going to assume I can bring it up atleast a point or two in the next 3 weeks). Thanks

User avatar
tmon
Posts: 1242
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 10:52 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby tmon » Tue May 22, 2012 3:58 pm

It would be stupid to back out if you had any chance at getting a decent score, but you don't. With your current scores you're almost certainly not going to get into a school worth going to at a price worth paying. You should check out the guides in the LSAT forum (specifically the one by Pithypike) and start planning for October. There should be a thread for people taking in October where you can post questions.

User avatar
Mr. Pancakes
Posts: 1234
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 1:11 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby Mr. Pancakes » Tue May 22, 2012 3:58 pm

bro, you're going to need to sit this test out.

User avatar
Nova
Posts: 9116
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 8:55 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby Nova » Tue May 22, 2012 4:03 pm

You spent about four years in undergrad and are only spending 6 weeks on the entrance exam that is more importaint than your GPA. That doesnt make any sense. Gear up for the October test.

You can get into some TTT at sticker with ~150/3.5, but its not worth it.

User avatar
Mr. Pancakes
Posts: 1234
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 1:11 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby Mr. Pancakes » Tue May 22, 2012 4:03 pm


User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 4:04 pm

tmon wrote:It would be stupid to back out if you had any chance at getting a decent score, but you don't.
Yep.

Study your ass off for October. Follow Pithypike's guide here, get a tutor, and/or take a course.

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 4:06 pm

I cant afford a tutor, or a course, how much can I realistic expect to improve with self study if I decide to put it off? Is there a penalty I will have to pay for putting it off at this point?

User avatar
tmon
Posts: 1242
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 10:52 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby tmon » Tue May 22, 2012 4:09 pm

silentbob wrote:I cant afford a tutor, or a course, how much can I realistic expect to improve with self study if I decide to put it off? Is there a penalty I will have to pay for putting it off at this point?

I improved from a 149 to 168 on the real thing, and was practicing in the 170s. With time and determination you could improve significantly. There's no guarantee, but you have the resources necessary on TLS to guide you through the process. The Pithypike guide we've been mentioning is a self studying guide which MANY have found to be a great method to improving significantly. If you can find a way to pay for law school you should find a way to buy the books you'll need to self study.

The only penalty you'll face is not applying extremely early, but applying in October/November is totally sufficient.

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 4:17 pm

according to my LSAC account, I have missed the date change deadline by a day, is there a way to contact them by phone and seeing if they could make an exception?

User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 4:18 pm

silentbob wrote:I cant afford a tutor, or a course, how much can I realistic expect to improve with self study if I decide to put it off? Is there a penalty I will have to pay for putting it off at this point?
You missed the deadline to change your LSAT date, so you're on the hook for the cost of the June test whether you take it, withdraw, no-show, or cancel your score.

So I guess you could take it just for the experience, but YOU WILL NOT GET INTO ANY SCHOOL WORTH ATTENDING if you score what you are predicting.

People who self-study can improve anywhere from 0 to 30+ points. There are people who have gone from 140s to 170s. There are also people who can't score a 150 to save their life. I have no way of telling where you fall on this spectrum.

This test is the SINGLE BIGGEST FACTOR in determining where you go to law school.
Where you go to law school is the SINGLE BIGGEST FACTOR in determining whether you end up a miserable failure wallowing in a quarter million dollars of debt you'll never pay back, or achieve financial stability.

Why in the name of everything holy would you literally gamble your financial future on this test without preparing as well as you possibly can and--if neccessary--trying more than once to get the best results possible?

User avatar
tmon
Posts: 1242
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 10:52 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby tmon » Tue May 22, 2012 4:20 pm

silentbob wrote:according to my LSAC account, I have missed the date change deadline by a day, is there a way to contact them by phone and seeing if they could make an exception?

Doubt it. You've made the mistake of waiting too long to prepare for a test that is a huge factor of law school admissions. It's on you at this point. I know it sucks, but take our advice: eat the cost of reregistering and at least buying prep materials, and take in October.

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 4:23 pm

Whats the penalty if I just take it for experience, and then say I dont want it graded? It says if I withdraw before taking it there will niot be an asterick next to my name on the report they send to schools, Im not really sure what that means, or how bad it will look if I withdraw either.

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 4:24 pm

I got a fee waiver through LSAC, so I was approved to take two free test, and I wouldnt be eating any cost, just a whole lot of pride!

User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 4:27 pm

silentbob wrote:Whats the penalty if I just take it for experience, and then say I dont want it graded? It says if I withdraw before taking it there will niot be an asterick next to my name on the report they send to schools, Im not really sure what that means, or how bad it will look if I withdraw either.
It will show up as a 'Cancel' on your LSAC report that schools see, and it uses one of your three chances to take it in 2 years. (I don't know if no-showing uses a chance. Withdrawing definitely does not use one.) You also won't have any idea how well you did, obviously.

A cancel might look (slightly) better than a shitty first score, but it's probably not huge either way. A withdraw is invisible, so your next (presumably less shitty) score would be the only thing schools see.

We just don't want you to take the June test, get a 152, and come back here all excited and demanding to know which utterly craptastic fourth-tier garbage school you should attend. If you really just want to take it for EXPERIENCE ONLY, then that's ok.

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 4:35 pm

So basicly, Ithink your saying if I cancel it looks bad, but if I withdraw and re-register for Oct. No one will ever know I planned to take it before then..Right? Also, How shitty is my score really, The LSAC site is putting me at a descent percent of being accepted into some schools if I plug in the 149 with my GPA. But, Im guessing those are the schools that are being refrenced as the ones that wouldnt be worth the money. From the way it sounds everyone thinks I am a dumbass with my PT scores, but like I said before its not so much getting the right answers for me as much as it is having the time to think it out.

User avatar
Mr. Pancakes
Posts: 1234
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 1:11 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby Mr. Pancakes » Tue May 22, 2012 4:40 pm

silentbob wrote:So basicly, Ithink your saying if I cancel it looks bad, but if I withdraw and re-register for Oct. No one will ever know I planned to take it before then..Right? Also, How shitty is my score really, The LSAC site is putting me at a descent percent of being accepted into some schools if I plug in the 149 with my GPA. But, Im guessing those are the schools that are being refrenced as the ones that wouldnt be worth the money. From the way it sounds everyone thinks I am a dumbass with my PT scores, but like I said before its not so much getting the right answers for me as much as it is having the time to think it out.

You don't get it. Did you look at the tuition, cost of living, or job prospects for the schools that you can get accepted to? I'm assuming not because if you had you wouldn't be asking us this retarded question.
Any of the schools that you can get accepted to aren't worth going to because of bad job prospects and huge debt.
You will most likely be making loan repayments of $1,700 a month while raking in $45,000 a year.
After loans are paid each month there's a real good chance that you will be lucky to be pulling in 20k-30k a year.
Do some research.

User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 4:41 pm

silentbob wrote:So basicly, Ithink your saying if I cancel it looks bad, but if I withdraw and re-register for Oct. No one will ever know I planned to take it before then..Right? Also, How shitty is my score really, The LSAC site is putting me at a descent percent of being accepted into some schools if I plug in the 149 with my GPA. But, Im guessing those are the schools that are being refrenced as the ones that wouldnt be worth the money. From the way it sounds everyone thinks I am a dumbass with my PT scores, but like I said before its not so much getting the right answers for me as much as it is having the time to think it out.
A 151 is technically 'average,' but it won't get you into any school worth paying for.

'Worth paying for' and 'worth attending' mean exactly one thing: you have a good chance of obtaining a job that pays enough for you to service the loans you had to take out to attend. The schools that will accept you with a 149 give you maybe a 5-10% chance at this (and for some schools, that's generous).

What is your GPA?
Where are you from and where would you like to work?
Is your background black, Mexican, Puerto Rican or Native American?
Are you intending to take out loans for the entire cost of attendance, or do you have other funds available?

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 4:49 pm

I am white, I have no other means of payment except loans unless I could get offered some money from wherever I get accepted. I also have a family to relocate. No work experience worth speaking of, my GPA is a 3.5. I live in southern Ill, and I would like to practice here. Am I correct in assuming that canceling would be completly untracable by anyone BTW?

User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 5:01 pm

silentbob wrote:I am white, I have no other means of payment except loans unless I could get offered some money from wherever I get accepted. I also have a family to relocate. No work experience worth speaking of, my GPA is a 3.5. I live in southern Ill, and I would like to practice here. Am I correct in assuming that canceling would be completly untracable by anyone BTW?

A cancel is when you take the test but cancel your score. It shows up as a cancel on your record.

A withdraw is untraceable, and done beforehand.

A 3.5 only shuts you out of the VERY top few schools. The limiting factor is your LSAT.

Most schools outside the top 50 or so aren't worth attending at all, or only worth attending with significant (like, full) scholarship. A 149 does not put you in good position for any scholarship money.

Increasing your score to a 160 gives you a shot at some halfway decent schools in markets not dominated by better schools. (Arizona State, North Carolina, Connecticut, etc.) The caveat with these schools is that a lot of those markets are very insular and want grads who have ties to the area, and they pretty much ONLY place in their home market. That's why I asked where you were from.

User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 5:10 pm

silentbob wrote:I am white, I have no other means of payment except loans unless I could get offered some money from wherever I get accepted. I also have a family to relocate. No work experience worth speaking of, my GPA is a 3.5. I live in southern Ill, and I would like to practice here. Am I correct in assuming that canceling would be completly untracable by anyone BTW?

For southern Il, I'm guessing that WUSTL might be a good aim. They give good scholarships to LSAT scores 169 and over.

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 5:11 pm

Well, Ithink I knew already that I probably needed to sit out and try for Oct., but I was hopeful that someone would tell me I could improve as much as I needed in 3 weeks. Having a family to relocate, I thought Southern Ill U. would be best for me because it is not terribly far from where I live know, so we wouldnt have to move far. But, firstly, is this school one of those exceptions to the rule that only tier 1 is worth attending? And second, would I even have a shot at it with my score, or would I still need to retake?

User avatar
99.9luft
Posts: 1244
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2010 4:32 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby 99.9luft » Tue May 22, 2012 5:14 pm

tmon wrote:It would be stupid to back out if you had any chance at getting a decent score, but you don't. With your current scores you're almost certainly not going to get into a school worth going to at a price worth paying. You should check out the guides in the LSAT forum (specifically the one by Pithypike) and start planning for October. There should be a thread for people taking in October where you can post questions.


OP, listen to tmon (what's up, buddy!)

silentbob
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:44 pm

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby silentbob » Tue May 22, 2012 5:15 pm

I almost forget the REALLY important question. I was arrested for a misdeamanor, which implies violent behavior, but not convicted, how bad will this hurt my application to school even with a higher LSAT?

User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 5:17 pm

silentbob wrote:Well, Ithink I knew already that I probably needed to sit out and try for Oct., but I was hopeful that someone would tell me I could improve as much as I needed in 3 weeks. Having a family to relocate, I thought Southern Ill U. would be best for me because it is not terribly far from where I live know, so we wouldnt have to move far. But, firstly, is this school one of those exceptions to the rule that only tier 1 is worth attending? And second, would I even have a shot at it with my score, or would I still need to retake?
SIU is...middling-to-shitty, I would say.

58.5% of graduates were known employed in full-time legal jobs. This figure includes an unknown number of temporary jobs and school-funded jobs.

Southern Illinois University, to our knowledge, has declined to report publicly about the salary distribution (i.e. both the 25th, 50th, and 75th percentiles and the number of graduates reporting salary for this category) of its employed graduates (2010).
2009 salary data: --LinkRemoved--

4 grads from the class of 2010 got jobs in firms over 100 lawyers (this is a rough metric for how many people got jobs that will pay off $120k in loans)
--LinkRemoved--

User avatar
rinkrat19
Posts: 13918
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:35 am

Re: Last minute LSAT advice and chances at schools in my area

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue May 22, 2012 5:18 pm

silentbob wrote:I almost forget the REALLY important question. I was arrested for a misdeamanor, which implies violent behavior, but not convicted, how bad will this hurt my application to school even with a higher LSAT?
A non-conviction for a misdemeanor? Hardly at all.

Tulane has a convicted murderer in the 1L class this year. Tons of law students have criminal records.




Return to “What are my chances?”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: maddawg2020, sodomojo and 2 guests