Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

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Br3v
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Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby Br3v » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:25 pm

Lets say you are a typical non URM lawl school applicant with a shinny 180.

At what GPA would you be for lack of better words ineligible to get into each T14?

My guess is below the 25% GPA mark but interested in what TLS has to say.

071816
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby 071816 » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:26 pm

retake

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Br3v
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby Br3v » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:28 pm

chimp wrote:retake


I was gonna add that in the original post haha. No I have not taken LSAT yet (june), but this is really just me asking because I am curious. I know nothing matters until the score is on paper.

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T00L
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby T00L » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:29 pm

If you have a 180 and a 4.0 then you are a space alien.

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Br3v
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby Br3v » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:30 pm

T00L wrote:If you have a 180 and a 4.0 then you are a space alien.

Was my comment useful?


should have known this is where the thread would go lol

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bk1
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby bk1 » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:31 pm


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Br3v
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby Br3v » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:34 pm

bk1 wrote:http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=162680

/thread


thanks bk, i've actually checked out the thread before and it is pretty useful.

I intended this to be directed towards 180's directly, to kind of test what point does the novelty of it wear off

So would your short answer be the GPA floor in that red/yellow/green table?


edit:pronoun usage

Alan
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby Alan » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:39 pm

Br3v wrote:Lets say you are a typical non URM lawl school applicant with a shinny 180.

At what GPA would you be for lack of better words ineligible to get into each T14?

My guess is below the 25% GPA mark but interested in what TLS has to say.


I would guess if you had a 3.0 (much lower than 25% at all the schools), you could still get in somewhere in the t-14

A non urm got into Berkeley and NYU with a 3.2/178
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/LSNAnalyst/jd

172/2.6 non urm in at gtown with ED
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/benito/jd

176/2.8 gtown and NW
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/whimsical/jd

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bk1
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby bk1 » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:40 pm

Br3v wrote:So would your short answer be the GPA floor in that red/yellow/green table?


Yes.

rad lulz
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby rad lulz » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:42 pm

Br3v wrote:shinny

lool

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Br3v
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby Br3v » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:44 pm

rad lulz wrote:
Br3v wrote:shinny

lool


I definitely was going for the informal ice hockey reference.

This thread is a fail....lock?

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Geetar Man
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby Geetar Man » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:47 pm

Other than LSN, is there data on the applicants numbers? Or is that all held as confidential?

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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby 09042014 » Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:57 pm

Guessing:

3.8 -YS
3.75- H
3.6 - Boalt
3.4 - Chi/Col
3.2- NYU
3.2 Duke
3.0 Michigan/Cornell/UVA/Penn
Sub 3.0 but still kinda close - Gtown
Just have a BA/BS- Northwestern

t14fanboy
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby t14fanboy » Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:00 pm

Do you have a shit GPA?

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echamberlin8
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby echamberlin8 » Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:44 pm

You guys really don't think you could get into Stanford or Yale with a 3.7 and a perfect LSAT? That's crazy to me.

I have a 3.73...so basically there's no chance for me at anything above Columbia. Well, I guess that makes sense. There seems to be a pretty big drop from Columbia on down, however. I'm hoping if I get a 172+ maybe I have a shot at Columbia or at least NYU.

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soj
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby soj » Fri Mar 16, 2012 12:10 am

For many schools, 25th percentiles should give you an approximate non-URM soft floor. From what I can see on TLS and LSN, the soft floor is even lower at some schools (e.g. MVPNG).

Image

Some of these 25th percentiles are lower than I expected.

sfreuden
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby sfreuden » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:03 pm

echamberlin8 wrote:You guys really don't think you could get into Stanford or Yale with a 3.7 and a perfect LSAT? That's crazy to me.

I have a 3.73...so basically there's no chance for me at anything above Columbia. Well, I guess that makes sense. There seems to be a pretty big drop from Columbia on down, however. I'm hoping if I get a 172+ maybe I have a shot at Columbia or at least NYU.


My numbers are 3.71/180 (no WE), so maybe you will benefit from info on my cycle.

Yale - applied December, still waiting to hear back, but expecting Waitlist/Rejection
Harvard - Held in January, expecting Waitlist
Columbia - Accepted
NYU - Accepted (with $)
UVa - Accepted (with $$$)
UPenn - Waitlisted, withdrew
Michigan - Waitlisted, withdrew
Duke - Accepted, withdrew
Cornell - Accepted, withdrew

I don't think it made much of a difference for my cycle, but I am HYP undergrad. There are conflicting opinions on whether undergrad "prestige" matters, but generally I really don't think it has much of an effect.

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echamberlin8
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby echamberlin8 » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:08 pm

sfreuden wrote:
echamberlin8 wrote:You guys really don't think you could get into Stanford or Yale with a 3.7 and a perfect LSAT? That's crazy to me.

I have a 3.73...so basically there's no chance for me at anything above Columbia. Well, I guess that makes sense. There seems to be a pretty big drop from Columbia on down, however. I'm hoping if I get a 172+ maybe I have a shot at Columbia or at least NYU.


My numbers are 3.71/180 (no WE), so maybe you will benefit from info on my cycle.

Yale - applied December, still waiting to hear back, but expecting Waitlist/Rejection
Harvard - Held in January, expecting Waitlist
Columbia - Accepted
NYU - Accepted (with $)
UVa - Accepted (with $$$)
UPenn - Waitlisted, withdrew
Michigan - Waitlisted, withdrew
Duke - Accepted, withdrew
Cornell - Accepted, withdrew

I don't think it made much of a difference for my cycle, but I am HYP undergrad. There are conflicting opinions on whether undergrad "prestige" matters, but generally I really don't think it has much of an effect.


Why the hell would Penn and Michigan waitlist someone with a 180 LSAT and a 3.71 GPA? I truly do not understand that.... That makes me a bit scared, considering I have a 3.73 GPA and am definitely considering Penn as a school I want to go to. NYU and Columbia are my ultimate goals....

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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby breadbucket » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:12 pm

Br3v wrote:
T00L wrote:If you have a 180 and a 4.0 then you are a space alien.

Was my comment useful?


should have known this is where the thread would go lol


Classic TLS

igo2northwestern
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby igo2northwestern » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:33 pm

Knew someone who was 3.7/180. She was rejected by S & Y. Held at H --> Accepted later.

She was also accepted by most other schools, except a couple that probably yield-protected.

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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby aekea » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:50 pm

echamberlin8 wrote:
sfreuden wrote:
echamberlin8 wrote:You guys really don't think you could get into Stanford or Yale with a 3.7 and a perfect LSAT? That's crazy to me.

I have a 3.73...so basically there's no chance for me at anything above Columbia. Well, I guess that makes sense. There seems to be a pretty big drop from Columbia on down, however. I'm hoping if I get a 172+ maybe I have a shot at Columbia or at least NYU.


My numbers are 3.71/180 (no WE), so maybe you will benefit from info on my cycle.

Yale - applied December, still waiting to hear back, but expecting Waitlist/Rejection
Harvard - Held in January, expecting Waitlist
Columbia - Accepted
NYU - Accepted (with $)
UVa - Accepted (with $$$)
UPenn - Waitlisted, withdrew
Michigan - Waitlisted, withdrew
Duke - Accepted, withdrew
Cornell - Accepted, withdrew

I don't think it made much of a difference for my cycle, but I am HYP undergrad. There are conflicting opinions on whether undergrad "prestige" matters, but generally I really don't think it has much of an effect.


Why the hell would Penn and Michigan waitlist someone with a 180 LSAT and a 3.71 GPA? I truly do not understand that.... That makes me a bit scared, considering I have a 3.73 GPA and am definitely considering Penn as a school I want to go to. NYU and Columbia are my ultimate goals....


You have a chance at getting into HYS, if you end up with a nice LSAT score. If you don't have amazing softs though, Y and S are going to be an uphill battle. If you get 175+ LSAT, you have a pretty solid shot at Harvard with your GPA.

As to why Penn and Michigan would wait-list someone with a 3.71 and a 180, those schools, along with UVA are well known for wait-listing a lot of people with super competitive stats, especially people with LSATs well above their 75th percentiles. It's basically a form of yield protection. Schools like NYU and Columbia do not do this. They love high LSAT scores. So, if you're aiming for the NYC schools, don't worry about YP. However, none of this matters since you don't have an LSAT score.

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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby sfreuden » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:15 pm

aekea wrote:
echamberlin8 wrote:You have a chance at getting into HYS, if you end up with a nice LSAT score. If you don't have amazing softs though, Y and S are going to be an uphill battle. If you get 175+ LSAT, you have a pretty solid shot at Harvard with your GPA.

As to why Penn and Michigan would wait-list someone with a 3.71 and a 180, those schools, along with UVA are well known for wait-listing a lot of people with super competitive stats, especially people with LSATs well above their 75th percentiles. It's basically a form of yield protection. Schools like NYU and Columbia do not do this. They love high LSAT scores. So, if you're aiming for the NYC schools, don't worry about YP. However, none of this matters since you don't have an LSAT score.


+1

Even with a 3.8+, 175+ you still need amazing softs for Y and S. H seems a bit more numbers-based, likely due to its larger class size. MVP seem to either waitlist or throw large scholarships at those with numbers competitive for CCN+, likely assuming that without a large financial incentive the applicant will be attending a T6.

Good luck on your LSAT.

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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby echamberlin8 » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:56 am

Thanks for the support, guys! Yeah, I've kinda given up on YS. Honestly, getting into Columbia would be my biggest goal, although Harvard would be amazing. I'm not sure what they look for exactly in softs, but I have been out of college since '09. I worked at a government contracting office, and now I work as a paralegal at a V25 firm in DC. So that's something I suppose. I also plan to volunteer a lot, because A) I can do it through my firm and B) it looks good on my resume.

Yeah, I know I need to focus on my LSAT. I took my first timed practice LSAT this weekend. I got only a 155, which kinda scared me. I'm not sure whether I should take the test in June and maybe do it a little unprepared, so that I have a score to apply early to a school like NYU or Chicago (I heard EDing to Columbia won't help much). Or should I just wait until October, when I'm more fully prepared, although this will give me less chances in the future to re-take if I don't do well?

Also, what is this yield protection thing you guys are talking about. Is that calculating the number of people who were accepted but chose to go to another school?

Is there anything else I should do other than bust ass studying for the LSAT in preparation for applying? Anything I should try to add to my list of softs?

Thanks, guys!

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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby sfreuden » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:57 pm

echamberlin8 wrote:Thanks for the support, guys! Yeah, I've kinda given up on YS. Honestly, getting into Columbia would be my biggest goal, although Harvard would be amazing. I'm not sure what they look for exactly in softs, but I have been out of college since '09. I worked at a government contracting office, and now I work as a paralegal at a V25 firm in DC. So that's something I suppose. I also plan to volunteer a lot, because A) I can do it through my firm and B) it looks good on my resume.

Yeah, I know I need to focus on my LSAT. I took my first timed practice LSAT this weekend. I got only a 155, which kinda scared me. I'm not sure whether I should take the test in June and maybe do it a little unprepared, so that I have a score to apply early to a school like NYU or Chicago (I heard EDing to Columbia won't help much). Or should I just wait until October, when I'm more fully prepared, although this will give me less chances in the future to re-take if I don't do well?

Also, what is this yield protection thing you guys are talking about. Is that calculating the number of people who were accepted but chose to go to another school?

Is there anything else I should do other than bust ass studying for the LSAT in preparation for applying? Anything I should try to add to my list of softs?

Thanks, guys!


WE is a great soft. 3 years work experience, at 2 different places, should be fine for Harvard and Columbia if you can get your LSAT up. Furthermore, it is one thing if you want to volunteer and would find it a truly enjoyable experience - but don't do it just to put it on your resume. At this point focusing on the LSAT would be the best use of your time.

When is the June registration deadline for the LSAT? I wouldn't register unless you were scoring at least an average of 170 on your practice tests. Though there are always exceptions, it seems like a lot of people score below their practice test average due to testing day conditions. You might want to wait until October if you can dedicate the time to prepare well.

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echamberlin8
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Re: Hypothetical, If 180, at what GPA are you not in

Postby echamberlin8 » Tue Mar 27, 2012 4:17 pm

sfreuden wrote:
echamberlin8 wrote:Thanks for the support, guys! Yeah, I've kinda given up on YS. Honestly, getting into Columbia would be my biggest goal, although Harvard would be amazing. I'm not sure what they look for exactly in softs, but I have been out of college since '09. I worked at a government contracting office, and now I work as a paralegal at a V25 firm in DC. So that's something I suppose. I also plan to volunteer a lot, because A) I can do it through my firm and B) it looks good on my resume.

Yeah, I know I need to focus on my LSAT. I took my first timed practice LSAT this weekend. I got only a 155, which kinda scared me. I'm not sure whether I should take the test in June and maybe do it a little unprepared, so that I have a score to apply early to a school like NYU or Chicago (I heard EDing to Columbia won't help much). Or should I just wait until October, when I'm more fully prepared, although this will give me less chances in the future to re-take if I don't do well?

Also, what is this yield protection thing you guys are talking about. Is that calculating the number of people who were accepted but chose to go to another school?

Is there anything else I should do other than bust ass studying for the LSAT in preparation for applying? Anything I should try to add to my list of softs?

Thanks, guys!


WE is a great soft. 3 years work experience, at 2 different places, should be fine for Harvard and Columbia if you can get your LSAT up. Furthermore, it is one thing if you want to volunteer and would find it a truly enjoyable experience - but don't do it just to put it on your resume. At this point focusing on the LSAT would be the best use of your time.

When is the June registration deadline for the LSAT? I wouldn't register unless you were scoring at least an average of 170 on your practice tests. Though there are always exceptions, it seems like a lot of people score below their practice test average due to testing day conditions. You might want to wait until October if you can dedicate the time to prepare well.


It's sometime right at the beginning of May. So I might wait until October to take it.

And yeah, I do want to volunteer, but I also have time constraints, so maybe I'll wait to do that for after the LSAT.

I'm glad that work actually helps. I should (assuming I don't get myself in trouble) have stayed at each place for about 1.5 years each by the time I go to law school.

Thank you for the reassurance. So what are these great softs that Yale and Stanford demand?




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