3.7/174 - Dec. App - Money at T-14?

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chapmaco
Posts: 40
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:35 pm

3.7/174 - Dec. App - Money at T-14?

Postby chapmaco » Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:38 pm

Stats are in Topic.

My problem is I am submitting my apps in the next few days (Dec. 4-8th ish). I am wondering how this will affect my chances at $$ and acceptances at the upper tier (or YP at bottom tier)
Last edited by chapmaco on Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

chasgoose
Posts: 715
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:18 pm

Re: 3.7/174 - Dec. App - Money at T-14?

Postby chasgoose » Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:20 pm

chapmaco wrote:Stats are in Topic. I also have a Fulbright Grant.

My problem is I am submitting my apps in the next few days (Dec. 4-8th ish). I am wondering how this will affect my chances at $$ and acceptances at the upper tier (or YP at bottom tier)


You are early enough that most schools will still have money to give. Also, law schools don't really YP (or at least not nearly as much as colleges do), it's kind of a TLS myth. Yield simply isn't as big of a rankings factor for most of these schools for them to waste a lot of time gaming the system like that. What most people see as YP usually happens to splitters with way higher LSATs than a school's 75% but lower GPA than the 25%. Once your score is above the 75%, the extra points have diminishing returns for the school's numbers (for example: at a school with a 75% of 172, a 178 isn't going to dramatically change their numbers any more than a 174 would). Thus, the school is less likely to risk your GPA hurting their stats on the other side. Also factored into that calculation is the idea that there are schools that DO need the higher LSAT score and are more willing to take the GPA hit in order to get it...The closest the T-14 comes to YP is rejecting/WL those who don't take the time to write a Why X school statement when one is suggested (Penn, Mich, and Duke all come to mind here). Again, however, that isn't necessarily YP as simply a method they use to distinguish between otherwise identical candidates. They have decided that they want people who at least go through the motions and take the extra effort to write such an essay and they penalize those that don't.

TL;DR answer: You are early enough that your application date won't hurt you on either of those counts.

chapmaco
Posts: 40
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:35 pm

Re: 3.7/174 - Dec. App - Money at T-14?

Postby chapmaco » Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:13 am

chasgoose wrote:
chapmaco wrote:Stats are in Topic. I also have a Fulbright Grant.

My problem is I am submitting my apps in the next few days (Dec. 4-8th ish). I am wondering how this will affect my chances at $$ and acceptances at the upper tier (or YP at bottom tier)


You are early enough that most schools will still have money to give. Also, law schools don't really YP (or at least not nearly as much as colleges do), it's kind of a TLS myth. Yield simply isn't as big of a rankings factor for most of these schools for them to waste a lot of time gaming the system like that. What most people see as YP usually happens to splitters with way higher LSATs than a school's 75% but lower GPA than the 25%. Once your score is above the 75%, the extra points have diminishing returns for the school's numbers (for example: at a school with a 75% of 172, a 178 isn't going to dramatically change their numbers any more than a 174 would). Thus, the school is less likely to risk your GPA hurting their stats on the other side. Also factored into that calculation is the idea that there are schools that DO need the higher LSAT score and are more willing to take the GPA hit in order to get it...The closest the T-14 comes to YP is rejecting/WL those who don't take the time to write a Why X school statement when one is suggested (Penn, Mich, and Duke all come to mind here). Again, however, that isn't necessarily YP as simply a method they use to distinguish between otherwise identical candidates. They have decided that they want people who at least go through the motions and take the extra effort to write such an essay and they penalize those that don't.

TL;DR answer: You are early enough that your application date won't hurt you on either of those counts.


Okay I understand your point about YP not being a major concern but what about general admit chances at CCN-caliber schools / $$? I would think since I have missed the first 'round' of admissions at most of the top-tier they will be a bit stingier on both accounts.

chasgoose
Posts: 715
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:18 pm

Re: 3.7/174 - Dec. App - Money at T-14?

Postby chasgoose » Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:24 am

chapmaco wrote:
chasgoose wrote:
chapmaco wrote:Stats are in Topic. I also have a Fulbright Grant.

My problem is I am submitting my apps in the next few days (Dec. 4-8th ish). I am wondering how this will affect my chances at $$ and acceptances at the upper tier (or YP at bottom tier)


You are early enough that most schools will still have money to give. Also, law schools don't really YP (or at least not nearly as much as colleges do), it's kind of a TLS myth. Yield simply isn't as big of a rankings factor for most of these schools for them to waste a lot of time gaming the system like that. What most people see as YP usually happens to splitters with way higher LSATs than a school's 75% but lower GPA than the 25%. Once your score is above the 75%, the extra points have diminishing returns for the school's numbers (for example: at a school with a 75% of 172, a 178 isn't going to dramatically change their numbers any more than a 174 would). Thus, the school is less likely to risk your GPA hurting their stats on the other side. Also factored into that calculation is the idea that there are schools that DO need the higher LSAT score and are more willing to take the GPA hit in order to get it...The closest the T-14 comes to YP is rejecting/WL those who don't take the time to write a Why X school statement when one is suggested (Penn, Mich, and Duke all come to mind here). Again, however, that isn't necessarily YP as simply a method they use to distinguish between otherwise identical candidates. They have decided that they want people who at least go through the motions and take the extra effort to write such an essay and they penalize those that don't.

TL;DR answer: You are early enough that your application date won't hurt you on either of those counts.


Okay I understand your point about YP not being a major concern but what about general admit chances at CCN-caliber schools / $$? I would think since I have missed the first 'round' of admissions at most of the top-tier they will be a bit stingier on both accounts.


This is all easy to find through research (see the charts), but December 4th-8th isn't late for any school. Columbia doesn't even start looking at RD applicants until after the holiday (I applied in early January and I was accepted during the first wave). NYU does start, but they are big enough that they aren't going to have plenty of spaces open. Chicago can get problematic, but so long as you are in before Christmas you are fine. Last year pretty much everyone who applied after Christmas got WL/R. Also, Columbia/NYU do their $$ at the end of the process after almost everyone has been accepted. You are at no disadvantage for $ at those two places by applying late.




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