Is HLS a pipe dream?

Not sure where your numbers will get you? Dying to know where you stand? Come have your palms read by your fellow posters!
User avatar
Chad
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:31 am

Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Chad » Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:58 pm

I'm interested in teaching law (mostly interested in health, bioethics and technology law) and Harvard's JD/LLM program with Cambridge is a particularly attractive path towards that goal. I got a 173 on my LSAT, a 3.3 GPA from undergrad and a 4.0 GPA from Johns Hopkins neuroscience Ph.D program (left after receiving my M.A. in neuroscience) and have published peer-reviewed papers in that field.

I realize my undergrad GPA is quite low and my LSAT is just average for Harvard, but I'm hoping my M.A. at Hopkins in neuroscience and publishing experience will help me out since I'm interested in relevant areas of law teaching. Do I stand a chance or should I not bother applying?

User avatar
bk1
Posts: 18424
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:06 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby bk1 » Thu Oct 20, 2011 2:26 pm


User avatar
Samara
Posts: 3245
Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 4:26 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Samara » Thu Oct 20, 2011 2:32 pm

TBF, there's a couple waitlists in there and you have some good softs. I mean, it's pretty unlikely, but I think it's worth the app. It's a comparatively small amount of money.

User avatar
DoubleChecks
Posts: 2333
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 4:35 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby DoubleChecks » Thu Oct 20, 2011 2:39 pm

Apply, but I say pipe dream. Sorry.

User avatar
neimanmarxist
Posts: 418
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:41 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby neimanmarxist » Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:09 pm

With slightly better stats (but still not a HLS gpa) and a completed dissertation at an equally prestigious institution, I didn't get HLS. I also wanted academia. Good luck though!

kaiser
Posts: 2940
Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 11:34 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby kaiser » Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:13 pm

You should be focused on CCN-range schools. All are possibilities given your stats. But that GPA just isn't going to cut it for HYS.

User avatar
thelawyler
Posts: 902
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:00 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby thelawyler » Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:20 pm

My softs are not nearly as strong as yours, but I did not submit an app to Harvard. I have very similar numbers.

User avatar
Chad
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:31 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Chad » Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:26 am

So if I'm understanding LSAC's GPA conversion policies correctly, they don't factor in grad school grades at all? Seems rather absurd that some basic req I took when 18 that was totally irrelevant to my major can count against me but the phd-level courses I took most recently and that bear a direct relation to my future goals are ignored.

I suppose my current work experience doesn't matter either? I work for the DoD managing clinical trials aimed at treating PTSD, depression and suicide in the military.

User avatar
Veyron
Posts: 3598
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:50 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Veyron » Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:49 am

Chad wrote:So if I'm understanding LSAC's GPA conversion policies correctly, they don't factor in grad school grades at all? Seems rather absurd that some basic req I took when 18 that was totally irrelevant to my major can count against me but the phd-level courses I took most recently and that bear a direct relation to my future goals are ignored.

I suppose my current work experience doesn't matter either? I work for the DoD managing clinical trials aimed at treating PTSD, depression and suicide in the military.


It all matters, just not very much compared to UGPA/LSAT. If you can't get used to accepting absurd rules, how are you going to cut it in law?

User avatar
ColtsFan88
Posts: 1432
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:05 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby ColtsFan88 » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:05 am

I would absolutely apply. Sure, the odds are way stacked against you. But your chances are not zero. Isn't the 70 dollars or whatever worth the peace of mind you get knowing you at least tried.

I have a 3.1, with very average softs. However, if I score at the top of my LSAT PT range 173-178, I'm gonna apply because knowing I tried and didn't get in is worth more to me than the money.

MumofCad
Posts: 974
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 8:46 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby MumofCad » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:08 am

Its a pipe dream, but it isn't impossible so I would throw an app if its your perfect fit. You only have one shot of getting in though IMO and that's developing a relationship with a relevant HLS faculty member. I know someone who was non-URM with strong softs including a very prestigious award who got HLS with a 164 on the LSAT. That's an auto-reject LSAT like your auto-reject GPA. However, she wrote about a passion for a certain genre of the law, had shown a commitment through her work both in academia and in the workforce to that genre, and happened through that to have developed a relationship at a conference with the main HLS academic in that genre (and impressed her/him). She was held then WL'd, but when the prof found out about the WL, she said she'd make some calls and my friend was admitted a week later. She told me it was 100% that the faculty member wanted her there. I am sure she'll be working on some joint projects with that academic and that was the point. So if you know Harvard is the place for you, get cracking on developing a relationship with the scholar's work that makes it the right fit for you. Figure out what you can bring to the table, perhaps a shared passion but a technical weakness of theirs that you can fulfill. Otherwise, you can find similar programs at other schools that are more realistic for your numbers anyhow.

User avatar
FeelTheHeat
Posts: 5203
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:32 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby FeelTheHeat » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:17 am

Veyron wrote:
Chad wrote:So if I'm understanding LSAC's GPA conversion policies correctly, they don't factor in grad school grades at all? Seems rather absurd that some basic req I took when 18 that was totally irrelevant to my major can count against me but the phd-level courses I took most recently and that bear a direct relation to my future goals are ignored.

I suppose my current work experience doesn't matter either? I work for the DoD managing clinical trials aimed at treating PTSD, depression and suicide in the military.


It all matters, just not very much compared to UGPA/LSAT. If you can't get used to accepting absurd rules, how are you going to cut it in law?


Because being irritated by a pretty stupid policy = unable to accept absurd rules. Got it.

TheFriendlyBarber
Posts: 258
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:13 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby TheFriendlyBarber » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:26 am

You should definitely apply. Ironically enough, though, I think the fact that you didn't complete your PhD will give you a harder time than your pedestrian undergraduate GPA.

HeavenWood
Posts: 2915
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 6:42 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:15 pm

Enjoy MVPDN. NYU is worth an app as well.

bdubs
Posts: 3729
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 2:23 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby bdubs » Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:46 pm

How did you get in to your PhD program with a 3.3? Were you top ranked in your undergrad program?

TheFriendlyBarber wrote:I think the fact that you didn't complete your PhD will give you a harder time than your pedestrian undergraduate GPA.

+1

User avatar
Chad
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:31 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Chad » Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:57 pm

bdubs wrote:How did you get in to your PhD program with a 3.3? Were you top ranked in your undergrad program?


My in-major GPA was 3.8, I graduated with honors and completed an independent research thesis which I won some grant funding for, my GRE was fairly high and I consider myself a pretty persuasive writer on those personal statements. A glowing letter of rec from my thesis adviser (who was also chair of the dept) didn't hurt either.

bdubs
Posts: 3729
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 2:23 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby bdubs » Fri Oct 21, 2011 2:05 pm

Chad wrote:
bdubs wrote:How did you get in to your PhD program with a 3.3? Were you top ranked in your undergrad program?


My in-major GPA was 3.8, I graduated with honors and completed an independent research thesis which I won some grant funding for, my GRE was fairly high and I consider myself a pretty persuasive writer on those personal statements. A glowing letter of rec from my thesis adviser (who was also chair of the dept) didn't hurt either.


Yeah, it would probably be different if 3.3 was in the top 5 or 10 percent of the class, but doing poorly in areas outside of bio/neuroscience will probably not be particularly convincing to a law school admissions committee.

User avatar
Chad
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:31 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Chad » Fri Oct 21, 2011 2:11 pm

bdubs wrote:
Chad wrote:
bdubs wrote:How did you get in to your PhD program with a 3.3? Were you top ranked in your undergrad program?


My in-major GPA was 3.8, I graduated with honors and completed an independent research thesis which I won some grant funding for, my GRE was fairly high and I consider myself a pretty persuasive writer on those personal statements. A glowing letter of rec from my thesis adviser (who was also chair of the dept) didn't hurt either.


Yeah, it would probably be different if 3.3 was in the top 5 or 10 percent of the class, but doing poorly in areas outside of bio/neuroscience will probably not be particularly convincing to a law school admissions committee.


Actually my in-major GPA comes from my dual B.A. in psych and philosophy. It was finite math and chem that screwed my GPA with a couple C's. I've never been great at those subjects and my family went through some financial hard times my first year.

Kochel
Posts: 182
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 2:36 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Kochel » Fri Oct 21, 2011 2:36 pm

OP: Out of curiosity, how do you know you want to teach law? I understand why you might want teach about health policy, etc., but teaching those subjects at a law school is quite different than doing so in a college setting. Besides, the thought of having to earn a living teaching 1L courses gives me shivers.

TheFriendlyBarber
Posts: 258
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:13 am

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby TheFriendlyBarber » Fri Oct 21, 2011 2:57 pm

Kochel wrote:OP: Out of curiosity, how do you know you want to teach law? I understand why you might want teach about health policy, etc., but teaching those subjects at a law school is quite different than doing so in a college setting. Besides, the thought of having to earn a living teaching 1L courses gives me shivers.


Sometimes you just know.

CanadianWolf
Posts: 10439
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 4:54 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby CanadianWolf » Fri Oct 21, 2011 4:13 pm

lawschoolpredictor.com shows that you would need a LSAT score of 184--yes, 184--to be admitted to Harvard Law School with a 3.3 GPA. Yale requires a 187.

HeavenWood
Posts: 2915
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 6:42 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Oct 21, 2011 4:20 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:lawschoolpredictor.com shows that you would need a LSAT score of 184--yes, 184--to be admitted to Harvard Law School with a 3.3 GPA. Yale requires a 187.

:lol:

User avatar
Bildungsroman
Posts: 5548
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:42 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Bildungsroman » Fri Oct 21, 2011 4:21 pm

Yes it is. Next question.

HeavenWood
Posts: 2915
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 6:42 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:07 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:Yes it is. Next question.

What kind of bleach should I use to make my whites extra white?

User avatar
Bildungsroman
Posts: 5548
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 2:42 pm

Re: Is HLS a pipe dream?

Postby Bildungsroman » Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:08 pm

HeavenWood wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:Yes it is. Next question.

What kind of bleach should I use to make my whites extra white?

Throw them out and buy new clothes, we've got an economy to save.




Return to “What are my chances?”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests