Retake to Negotiate $$

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jonillson
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Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:14 pm

Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby jonillson » Thu Apr 21, 2011 12:43 pm

166/167
3.25

Hi, I've taken the LSAT twice. In both cases I underperformed my timed, test-day condition PTs by about 6 points (I was averaging 172). I blame test-day anxiety and poor rest (on account of test-day anxiety). Despite my numbers, I was accepted to BU--a top choice, given my numbers--and offered a modest scholarship ($10k/year).

I have two questions:

Given my UGPA, how much leverage would an improved LSAT score (170+) provide me with to negotiate a scholarship increase at BU?

If I hit my PT average of 172, would my prospects change dramatically enough to justify sitting it out a year and reapplying next cycle? I've plugged in the numbers on LSP:

Penn: 32% at/below
Mich: 42% at/below
UVA: 41% at/below
Duke: 41% at/below

NU: 40% at/below
Cornell: 58% at/below
GULC: 45% at/below
UCLA: 52% at/below

UT: 54% at/below
Vandy: 47% at/below
USC 63% at/below


Schools I can't imagine attending even if admitted have been struck. So, with a 172/3.25, would one of Penn/Mich/NU/UT be a sure bet? Would an ED help?

I get the feeling that, even with a solid test-day performance, there's no overcoming my UGPA. But--perhaps I'm expressing sour grapes.

I apologize for the hypothetical--I know this board is very hypothetical-averse. Humor me?

splitmuch
Posts: 968
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby splitmuch » Thu Apr 21, 2011 1:59 pm

jonillson wrote:166/167
3.25

Hi, I've taken the LSAT twice. In both cases I underperformed my timed, test-day condition PTs by about 6 points (I was averaging 172). I blame test-day anxiety and poor rest (on account of test-day anxiety). Despite my numbers, I was accepted to BU--a top choice, given my numbers--and offered a modest scholarship ($10k/year).

I have two questions:

Given my UGPA, how much leverage would an improved LSAT score (170+) provide me with to negotiate a scholarship increase at BU?

If I hit my PT average of 172, would my prospects change dramatically enough to justify sitting it out a year and reapplying next cycle? I've plugged in the numbers on LSP:

Penn: 32% at/below
Mich: 42% at/below
UVA: 41% at/below
Duke: 41% at/below

NU: 40% at/below
Cornell: 58% at/below
GULC: 45% at/below
UCLA: 52% at/below

UT: 54% at/below
Vandy: 47% at/below
USC 63% at/below


Schools I can't imagine attending even if admitted have been struck. So, with a 172/3.25, would one of Penn/Mich/NU/UT be a sure bet? Would an ED help?

I get the feeling that, even with a solid test-day performance, there's no overcoming my UGPA. But--perhaps I'm expressing sour grapes.

I apologize for the hypothetical--I know this board is very hypothetical-averse. Humor me?


LSN sucks for 170+ 3.3- splitters, it doesn't take into account that lot of schools simply ahve GPA floors above that.

With an ED and WE you'd likely get NU. UT is out, softs could make or break you at UM and Penn is out.

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coldshoulder
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Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby coldshoulder » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:48 pm

How much of a rush are you to go to law school? Getting a 10k scholly from BU at your numbers is rather surprising, you may want to take it.

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jonillson
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Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:14 pm

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby jonillson » Thu Apr 21, 2011 3:37 pm

coldshoulder wrote:How much of a rush are you to go to law school? Getting a 10k scholly from BU at your numbers is rather surprising, you may want to take it.


I'm eager to get on with it. I'm just wondering how much better than BU @ $10k/year I can realistically hope to do with a 3.25 UGPA.

splitmuch
Posts: 968
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby splitmuch » Thu Apr 21, 2011 3:48 pm

jonillson wrote:
coldshoulder wrote:How much of a rush are you to go to law school? Getting a 10k scholly from BU at your numbers is rather surprising, you may want to take it.


I'm eager to get on with it. I'm just wondering how much better than BU @ $10k/year I can realistically hope to do with a 3.25 UGPA.



It depends how confident you are in your ability to actually raise your LSAT. Since you've taken it twice already and scored virtually the same I'd say that's probably where you will score under testing conditions so you should probably take the offer.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby JamMasterJ » Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:39 pm

With significant post-grad work experience, a 172 makes NU a definite option for you, same with UVA - though I know you don't want to go there. Michigan becomes an outside possibility, but none of these schools are going to be sure things.

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jonillson
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Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby jonillson » Sat Apr 23, 2011 9:34 am

jonillson wrote:Given my UGPA, how much leverage would an improved LSAT score (170+) provide me with to negotiate a scholarship increase at BU?


Can anyone speak to my first question?

mettasutta
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:25 am

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby mettasutta » Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:56 pm

jonillson wrote:
jonillson wrote:Given my UGPA, how much leverage would an improved LSAT score (170+) provide me with to negotiate a scholarship increase at BU?


Can anyone speak to my first question?


+1 This thread is relevant to my interests.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:56 pm

jonillson wrote:
jonillson wrote:Given my UGPA, how much leverage would an improved LSAT score (170+) provide me with to negotiate a scholarship increase at BU?


Can anyone speak to my first question?

It would definitely help a bit, but with a low gpa, I wouldn't expect BU to give you a ton of money b/c they will probably give it to someone who boosts both medians instead of just one.
Unless your scholarship has some stupid rule banning this, they won't take away your offer if you retake, so worst case scenario is probably 150 bucks and a big waste of time and best case is another 5-20K per year.
Also, if you break 170, you should reapply

mettasutta
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:25 am

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby mettasutta » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:11 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
jonillson wrote:
jonillson wrote:Given my UGPA, how much leverage would an improved LSAT score (170+) provide me with to negotiate a scholarship increase at BU?


Can anyone speak to my first question?

It would definitely help a bit, but with a low gpa, I wouldn't expect BU to give you a ton of money b/c they will probably give it to someone who boosts both medians instead of just one.
Unless your scholarship has some stupid rule banning this, they won't take away your offer if you retake, so worst case scenario is probably 150 bucks and a big waste of time and best case is another 5-20K per year.
Also, if you break 170, you should reapply


Sorry to hijack this thread, but if one has already negotiated a scholarship, would it seem too pushy/demanding to humbly ask them to up again it with an increased LSAT in June? My numbers are 3.82/164. I originally got sticker at BC, but was able to squeeze 45K total no stips out of them by leveraging offers from peer schools. If I get a 167+ I'd be helping both of their medians, as my GPA is already above their 75th %ile.

splitmuch
Posts: 968
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby splitmuch » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:16 pm

mettasutta wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:
jonillson wrote:
jonillson wrote:Given my UGPA, how much leverage would an improved LSAT score (170+) provide me with to negotiate a scholarship increase at BU?


Can anyone speak to my first question?

It would definitely help a bit, but with a low gpa, I wouldn't expect BU to give you a ton of money b/c they will probably give it to someone who boosts both medians instead of just one.
Unless your scholarship has some stupid rule banning this, they won't take away your offer if you retake, so worst case scenario is probably 150 bucks and a big waste of time and best case is another 5-20K per year.
Also, if you break 170, you should reapply


Sorry to hijack this thread, but if one has already negotiated a scholarship, would it seem too pushy/demanding to humbly ask them to up again it with an increased LSAT in June? My numbers are 3.82/164. I originally got sticker at BC, but was able to squeeze 45K total no stips out of them by leveraging offers from peer schools. If I get a 167+ I'd be helping both of their medians, as my GPA is already above their 75th %ile.


They're not going to take what you have away so worst case scenario is you annoy someone in admissions who you will never need to interact with again. No downside +potential upside=why the hell not?

mettasutta
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:25 am

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby mettasutta » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:20 pm

mettasutta wrote:Sorry to hijack this thread, but if one has already negotiated a scholarship, would it seem too pushy/demanding to humbly ask them to up again it with an increased LSAT in June? My numbers are 3.82/164. I originally got sticker at BC, but was able to squeeze 45K total no stips out of them by leveraging offers from peer schools. If I get a 167+ I'd be helping both of their medians, as my GPA is already above their 75th %ile.


splitmuch wrote:They're not going to take what you have away so worst case scenario is you annoy someone in admissions who you will never need to interact with again. No downside +potential upside=why the hell not?


Thank you. Given my GPA, at what point would it be worth it to just sit out another year and reapply? 168+? 169+? 170+?

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JamMasterJ
Posts: 6688
Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:17 pm

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Apr 25, 2011 9:54 pm

mettasutta wrote:
mettasutta wrote:Sorry to hijack this thread, but if one has already negotiated a scholarship, would it seem too pushy/demanding to humbly ask them to up again it with an increased LSAT in June? My numbers are 3.82/164. I originally got sticker at BC, but was able to squeeze 45K total no stips out of them by leveraging offers from peer schools. If I get a 167+ I'd be helping both of their medians, as my GPA is already above their 75th %ile.


splitmuch wrote:They're not going to take what you have away so worst case scenario is you annoy someone in admissions who you will never need to interact with again. No downside +potential upside=why the hell not?


Thank you. Given my GPA, at what point would it be worth it to just sit out another year and reapply? 168+? 169+? 170+?

If you get 168 and it doesn't get you more than about 2/3 tuition, I would reapply. I would reapply with 169+ no matter what (except maybe not with a full ride).
169/3.82 will give you a bit of money in the T14, so I think that waiting a year is TCR.

mettasutta
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:25 am

Re: Retake to Negotiate $$

Postby mettasutta » Mon Apr 25, 2011 11:04 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
mettasutta wrote:
mettasutta wrote:Sorry to hijack this thread, but if one has already negotiated a scholarship, would it seem too pushy/demanding to humbly ask them to up again it with an increased LSAT in June? My numbers are 3.82/164. I originally got sticker at BC, but was able to squeeze 45K total no stips out of them by leveraging offers from peer schools. If I get a 167+ I'd be helping both of their medians, as my GPA is already above their 75th %ile.


splitmuch wrote:They're not going to take what you have away so worst case scenario is you annoy someone in admissions who you will never need to interact with again. No downside +potential upside=why the hell not?


Thank you. Given my GPA, at what point would it be worth it to just sit out another year and reapply? 168+? 169+? 170+?

If you get 168 and it doesn't get you more than about 2/3 tuition, I would reapply. I would reapply with 169+ no matter what (except maybe not with a full ride).
169/3.82 will give you a bit of money in the T14, so I think that waiting a year is TCR.


+1 Thank you, this is very helpful.

Now back to the OP's needs.

/hijack :)




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