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Grab Penn $$ and run or wait a year to ED Chicago?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:17 pm
by niederbomb
Sent out apps January 18. 170 (1st LSAT = 163), 3.89 (or thereabouts). Some decent softs but a negative soft also (not a criminal record but probably equivalent to a DUI).

V - Accepted - 77K
UT - Accepted (IS)
G - WL, Accepted
Duke - WL
UVA - WL
Michigan - Pending
Penn - Accepted - $58K
NYU - Rejected
Chicago - WL
Stanford - Pending

Based on this January pattern, what are my chances of Chicago ED next cycle? Also, in general, what chance does a January RD WL of Chicago have at a September ED the following year?

Also, if it means anything, I'm retaking the June LSAT for my 3rd and final time.

EDITED: Thread title to more reflect direction of discussion.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:25 pm
by bk1
niederbomb wrote:Also, if it means anything, I'm retaking the June LSAT for my 3rd and final time.


Come back with an actual 3rd LSAT score.

ETA 1: You didn't underperform.

ETA 2: I know what your negative soft is and considering your results, I don't think you should be worried about it hurting you.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:26 pm
by niederbomb
bk1 wrote:
niederbomb wrote:Also, if it means anything, I'm retaking the June LSAT for my 3rd and final time.


Come back with an actual 3rd LSAT score.


The chances are if I don't improve or not significantly.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:27 pm
by bk1
niederbomb wrote:The chances are if I don't improve or not significantly.


Then I don't think your results will change much if at all.

That being said, you're going to take it anyways and you are going to keep a deposit down so things are irrelevant until you have a new score.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:27 pm
by You Gotta Have Faith
niederbomb wrote: a negative soft also (not a criminal record but probably equivalent to a DUI).


Genuinely curious... if it's not a criminal record, is there even a reason that you have to report this negative soft?

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:31 pm
by FiveSermon
bk1 wrote:
niederbomb wrote:Also, if it means anything, I'm retaking the June LSAT for my 3rd and final time.


Come back with an actual 3rd LSAT score.

ETA 1: You didn't underperform.

ETA 2: I know what your negative soft is and considering your results, I don't think you should be worried about it hurting you.


+1

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:03 pm
by parsi
You Gotta Have Faith wrote:
niederbomb wrote: a negative soft also (not a criminal record but probably equivalent to a DUI).


Genuinely curious... if it's not a criminal record, is there even a reason that you have to report this negative soft?


Yeah, for school violations, suspensions, and whatnot

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:04 pm
by Patriot1208
Penn with 58k seems about right. I could also see an NYU ED happening before a chicago ED.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:09 pm
by niederbomb
Patriot1208 wrote:Penn with 58k seems about right. I could also see an NYU ED happening before a chicago ED.


Explain. I got rejected at NYU and WL at Chicago (and Chicago is by no means one of those schools who waitlists everyone) from a January application. I'm curious to know the reasons why you think NYU ED might have a better chance.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:10 pm
by bk1
Patriot1208 wrote:Penn with 58k seems about right. I could also see an NYU ED happening before a chicago ED.


Stats-wise I agree. However, NYU's admissions office may have been more unhappy about his negative than Chicago's and that wouldn't necessarily change next year.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:14 pm
by Patriot1208
bk1 wrote:
Patriot1208 wrote:Penn with 58k seems about right. I could also see an NYU ED happening before a chicago ED.


Stats-wise I agree. However, NYU's admissions office may have been more unhappy about his negative than Chicago's and that wouldn't necessarily change next year.

This could be true, i'm unsure.

niederbomb wrote:
Patriot1208 wrote:Penn with 58k seems about right. I could also see an NYU ED happening before a chicago ED.


Explain. I got rejected at NYU and WL at Chicago (and Chicago is by no means one of those schools who waitlists everyone) from a January application. I'm curious to know the reasons why you think NYU ED might have a better chance.


Just from looking at LSN NYU seems more likely to dip to a lower LSAT like a 170 to grab a higher GPA. Columbia and Chicago seem to do this far less and NYU is the only one of the three we see take 169's on a semi-regular basis. NYU also had a lower median before this year and it's feasible that there median will go back down this year or next as the applications get less numerous.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:27 pm
by trudat15
I think you're in ED to Chicago, though are you willing to wait an extra year to pay sticker at Chicago vs. going to VP with 58/77k?

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:00 pm
by sarahlawg
Patriot1208 wrote:Penn with 58k seems about right. I could also see an NYU ED happening before a chicago ED.


he is a retaker though... don't know what his first score was, don't know what his third score will be, but if it doesn't average over 170, NYU may not like him all that much.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:09 am
by niederbomb
trudat15 wrote:I think you're in ED to Chicago, though are you willing to wait an extra year to pay sticker at Chicago vs. going to VP with 58/77k?


I think having an extra year of WE post-negative incident, waiting for the economy to improve, and picking a school that has a higher NLJ 250 placement AND superior public interest options/LRAP is well worth the wait. I also want to work in Asia/Singapore, and school name is a huge deal when it comes to portability.

Good to hear that I have at least a chance as is. Obviously, the final verdict must wait on an actual 3rd LSAT score.

he is a retaker though... don't know what his first score was, don't know what his third score will be, but if it doesn't average over 170, NYU may not like him all that much.


Average 167 right now. Could that be the sole reason I got dinged by NYU?

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:27 am
by sarahlawg
niederbomb wrote:
Average 167 right now. Could that be the sole reason I got dinged by NYU?


I think we actually have the same numbers including gpa and retake. interesting. I think I'm headed for the WL at NYU, so I dunno. I also got chi/gtown/uva...so maybe your late app is what killed you.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 6:31 am
by niederbomb
sarahlawg wrote:
niederbomb wrote:
Average 167 right now. Could that be the sole reason I got dinged by NYU?


I think we actually have the same numbers including gpa and retake. interesting. I think I'm headed for the WL at NYU, so I dunno. I also got chi/gtown/uva...so maybe your late app is what killed you.


What I might do is seat deposit at Penn and retake anyway to get off the Chicago (and maybe Stanford) WL. I think a lot of the differences between Penn and Chicago (PI, nonprofit work) might be due to self-selection. I'm not sure I'll even get into Chicago next year.

I haven't decided anything yet. I still have 29 days till Penn's seat deposit deadline!

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 7:28 am
by bmore
I wish I could figure out how this works. 172 LSAT. Similar GPA. No negatives. In at NYU. Still waiting for $ from Penn. Not sure why you think you underperformed. But could you free up that Penn $ for me :lol:

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:19 am
by lastMinuteGuy
I tried pretty much the same thing this year. My results last year as a Jan applicant with a 3.9x and 167/170 were:

Accepted: NYU (0), Penn (20k/yr), Michigan (15k/yr), Northwestern (0)
Waitlisted: Stanford, Columbia, UVA, Duke, Georgetown
Rejected: Yale, Harvard, Berkeley

With a 174 June retake and applying in November with a better PS I'm currently at:
Pending: Harvard, Stanford, Columbia
Accepted: NYU (0)
Waitlisted: Chicago
Rejected: Berkeley

My school list was different this year for personal reasons, but unless one of the pending apps comes through I'm not sure I can really say it was worth the extra year to have pretty much the same decisions (though a late accept from H/S/C would change my mind on that).

Granted that your mileage may vary, but without a substantial LSAT increase or some other distinguishing new soft ED is probably a good shot a Chicago/NYU. Be prepared with backups though in case it doesn't work out the way you were hoping.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:32 am
by romothesavior
Nah, you didn't underperform.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:28 pm
by FlamingCow
FWIW I got into NYU ED with a 3.7, 165/170, so I'm not sure how strict the 170 average threshold is.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:31 pm
by Lawquacious
romothesavior wrote:Nah, you didn't underperform.


I agree. Congrats- you already have some good options to pick from!

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:31 am
by Law Sauce
Id go to penn in this case and never look back

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:41 am
by glewz
niederbomb wrote:I think having an extra year of WE post-negative incident, waiting for the economy to improve, and picking a school that has a higher NLJ 250 placement AND superior public interest options/LRAP is well worth the wait. I also want to work in Asia/Singapore, and school name is a huge deal when it comes to portability.


Regardless of your retake, I think it's totally worth it to weather the economic storm/get 1 more year WE (& possibly mitigate those negatives). You have a decent shot at U of C ED & would likely have results for other schools that are at least as good as the ones you have right now.

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:47 am
by niederbomb
glewz wrote:
niederbomb wrote:I think having an extra year of WE post-negative incident, waiting for the economy to improve, and picking a school that has a higher NLJ 250 placement AND superior public interest options/LRAP is well worth the wait. I also want to work in Asia/Singapore, and school name is a huge deal when it comes to portability.


Regardless of your retake, I think it's totally worth it to weather the economic storm/get 1 more year WE (& possibly mitigate those negatives). You have a decent shot at U of C ED & would likely have results for other schools that are at least as good as the ones you have right now.


Is Chicago at sticker worth more than Penn with 58K (+ unknown need-based)?

Re: Did I underperform my numbers? U of C ED?

Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:02 am
by dukey
niederbomb wrote:
glewz wrote:
niederbomb wrote:I think having an extra year of WE post-negative incident, waiting for the economy to improve, and picking a school that has a higher NLJ 250 placement AND superior public interest options/LRAP is well worth the wait. I also want to work in Asia/Singapore, and school name is a huge deal when it comes to portability.


Regardless of your retake, I think it's totally worth it to weather the economic storm/get 1 more year WE (& possibly mitigate those negatives). You have a decent shot at U of C ED & would likely have results for other schools that are at least as good as the ones you have right now.


Is Chicago at sticker worth more than Penn with 58K (+ unknown need-based)?


It's about the same - TBH, really depends on your personal preference. For me, yes, it would be worth more than 58k Penn. (Chicago environment vs. Philadelphia, Penn students don't have a shot at the markets U of C would open up, international recognition, etc.)