[Splitter] ED chances to Columbia / NYU / Penn / Michigan Forum

[NZT]

Hi, application time is coming up and I was hoping I could get some insight regarding my chances.
Because of my splitter status, I was hoping to ED to Columbia, NYU, Penn, or Michigan (which is my order of preference)
Stats:
UG: T30ish social science major
GPA: 3.2 (current) highest it will be is a low 3.3 at the end of the semester.
LSAT: 174 (should i retake?)
Softs: not a URM, straight out of UG, couple summer internships, active in 1 club (co-founder/leadership position)

So yeah.. very avg softs, below avg gpa, and decent lsat

What would my chances be with (3.2, 174) and a (3.3, 178)? current stats and best possible stats..
Where should I ED amongst the 4 to maximize my chances? I realllly want Columbia, would be happy at NYU, Penn would be great, and Michigan..is Michigan (awesome school but I'd rather be in a city + it seems way too cold).

Oh.. am I aiming too high? my 'safeties' are Cornell, GTown, and UCLA. Not really safeties stat-wise but its just that I'd rather not go to law schools ranked lower.. especially in this economy..

[09042014]

I'd ED to NYU. Apply to CCN, MVPCG

You have no safeties in the t14. Georgetown is a target. But you'll probably get at least one of the others.

Do not retake. It won't help.

[paulinaporizkova]

i don't think NYU or columbia will happen, but ED at will to the rest of the t14 if you like

ETA: really DF?

[bk1]

i don't think NYU or columbia will happen, but ED at will to the rest of the t14 if you like

ETA: really DF?

172 is possible for ED at NYU.

I agree with DF but might consider ED'ing lower (like MVP) since there is a risk of getting shut out at MVP and not getting NYU ED.

[09042014]

i don't think NYU or columbia will happen, but ED at will to the rest of the t14 if you like

ETA: really DF?

NYU is a long shot, but it's moves him up a tier. 3.3/3.2 is bad but it's not bad enough to require and ED unless there is a reason you want one school.

ED is a huge commitment that TLS likes to think is some trump card you must play. It's not.

BK says it's risky and it sort of is, but he can always late ed to UVA, which he probably gets. Or absolute worst case is having to reapply the next year.

[bk1]

BK says it's risky and it sort of is, but he can always late ed to UVA, which he probably gets. Or absolute worst case is having to reapply the next year.

Forgot about late ED to UVa.

[NZT]

yea haha i realize that i don't have safeties stat-wise
k i know this is stupid but i don't really want to apply to...
-chicago (NYU seems easier to get into and for me NYU > chicago)
-uva (hate the location. would rather go to michigan or penn, which seems like they are of similar difficulty)
-northwestern (would rather go to cornell, gt, and even ucla)
and i know i'm out of HYSB and prolly duke

so i'm planning on only applying to columbia, nyu, penn, michigan, cornell, gt, ucla.
is this stupid?

oh also i have a really really sharp upward trend. approx gpa from memory
freshmen yr: 3.3 (yay! college!) / 1.6 (was working full-time, 2 hour commute)
sopho: 3.3 (working part-time, same place) / 4.0
junior year: 3.7
basically i had to pay my tuition b/c my parents both lost their jobs.
plus an additional F from a college course in high school...which i enrolled in decided to not take it, but forgot to drop it.

[paulinaporizkova]

BK says it's risky and it sort of is, but he can always late ed to UVA, which he probably gets. Or absolute worst case is having to reapply the next year.

Forgot about late ED to UVa.

i was gonna say this. i've seen at least a handful of people with these #s on LSN/TLS rejected ED to UVA around december-januaryish

[bk1]

Upward trend won't matter.

You should value where the schools place after graduation as opposed to the 3 years you will spend during school. Sure, if you get both Michigan and Virginia then take Michigan but what if you only got Virginia and no other T14's? Or what if you got into Duke but not Cornell/GULC/UCLA? As well, it is worth it on the off chance you get scholarship money so you can try to negotiate between schools.

You're out at NU too (no work experience). Duke is unlikely (low GPA). And if you're applying to UCLA you should apply to USC as well. You should also at least have some safeties (unless you would rather reapply/not go than go to a regional school as a safety).

I would apply to the T14 (except HYS), USC/UCLA, Vandy (if you want to work in NYC), UT (if you want to work in TX), and whatever regional school you'd prefer (GW/BU/BC/Fordham/etc).

[NZT]

argh..yea i guess i'll scatter shot T14 minus HYS,B, ND and plus UCLA, USC.
but regarding ED.. is columbia out of the picture even if i retake the lsat and score 178ish?

also, what is the minimum school you guys think i will get into?
can i chanced in the format of...
CCN: 0-1 acceptances
MVP: 0-1 acceptances
Cornell, GT: 0-1 acceptances
ucla, usc: 1-2 acceptances

thanks in advance!

[09042014]

argh..yea i guess i'll scatter shot T14 minus HYS,B, ND and plus UCLA, USC.
but regarding ED.. i'm getting mixed answers.. should i ED NYU, michigan, or penn?
is columbia out of the picture even if i retake the lsat and score 178ish?

also, what is the minimum school you guys think i will get into?
can i chanced in the format of...
CCN: 0-1 acceptances
MVP: 0-1 acceptances
Cornell, GT: 0-1 acceptances
ucla, usc: 1-2 acceptances

thanks in advance!

Do you prefer any of the schools? NYU is the biggest long shot but has the biggest upside. I think with ED you've got a 60% shot at Penn or Mich. Probably more like 20% if you don't ED. More like 85% at UVA if you ED in Sept, 10% if you don't ED. 25% chance at Cornell. 60% at Georgetown, probably 85% if you ED. 10% at UCLA or USC. I don't know how ED effects those schools.

The more I think about it the more you might need to apply ED. If you prefer PEnn or Mich to UVA, then ED at one of the two schools. If you don't care, ED to NYU. Then when you get dinged, apply late ED to UVA.

If you get dinged there, ride WL's and prepare to do it again.

WUSTL and Ilinois will probably give you 1/2-2/3 full rides if you want em.

[mst]

You almost certainly won't get into CLS/NYU even with ED. I'd ED'd to one of them and I did my research so you shouldn't feel awful trusting me on that. Bumping up LSAT will do little to help. Sorry. They just don't go below 3.4. Penn's a most likely with ED. A guy with similar numbers as you got into Michigan ED. So do either if you think you'd like it there.

[NZT]

Yes my preference is
1.columbia
2.nyu
3.penn
4.michigan

Does undergrad legacy help any? (Penn)

[mst]

Yes my preference is
1.columbia
2.nyu
3.penn
4.michigan

Does undergrad legacy help any? (Penn)

From what I've gathered UG legacy does little at all to help. You should be solid with an ED to Penn though. Safest bet is ED to Michigan. But definitely don't bother with NYU or CLS with those numbers. Sorry.

[09042014]

Yes my preference is
1.columbia
2.nyu
3.penn
4.michigan

Does undergrad legacy help any? (Penn)

From what I've gathered UG legacy does little at all to help. You should be solid with an ED to Penn though. Safest bet is ED to Michigan. But definitely don't bother with NYU or CLS with those numbers. Sorry.

Yea I might be a little to optimistic about NYU ED. Penn ED is prob the correct choice.

[NZT]

I calculated my gpa and if i pull near a 4.0 this semester and take summer courses I can raise my GPA to like a 3.37ish
how bout 3.37 / 177?

i know this is hypothetical, but i'm wondering what my scores should be for a 60%+ shot for CLS..

Thanks so much - the replies are really helpful at giving me realistic view..i thot i had a decent shot at CLS/NYU ED before this lolll

[Kabuo]

OP, I don't want to rain on your parade, but I applied in November with a 3.2/172, bad softs, and an average PS. ED to Mich ended up a waitlist. Late ED to UVA ended up in a ding. On "reserve" at Cornell, but I didn't get that app out until around Christmas. Ding at GULC, also applied around Christmas. WL at UCLA, Ding at Vandy, and still waiting on Columbia (late fee waiver and bad numbers = <1% chance imo), ND, and Alabama. Only acceptance was WUSTL with 84k. I retook in Feb and got a 176, so I'm considering reapplying next year to pretty much the same schools you are, but you are by no means a lock for the T14 with those numbers and nothing outstanding about your app.

[mst]

I calculated my gpa and if i pull near a 4.0 this semester and take summer courses I can raise my GPA to like a 3.37ish
how bout 3.37 / 177?

i know this is hypothetical, but i'm wondering what my scores should be for a 60%+ shot for CLS..

Thanks so much - the replies are really helpful at giving me realistic view..i thot i had a decent shot at CLS/NYU ED before this lolll

This guy: http://lawschoolnumbers.com/piccolittle/jd , got in ED with a 175/3.3. But he was foreign so there might be other factors. Only guy to get in with those kind of numbers in years btw. Nobody has gotten into NYU with those kind of numbers, at least with LSN, in a few years.

Honestly, if you can bump up to a 175/176 and ED to CLS you might have a shot of like 50%. But seriously, is retaking, risking a lower score, and going for a 50% or less at CLS while giving up your lock-in to Penn or Michigan worth it? Probably not.

Also, you might want to consider ED'ing to Chicago if you have any interest in that school. A few people got in ED with your number combo there last year.

[mst]

OP, I don't want to rain on your parade, but I applied in November with a 3.2/172, bad softs, and an average PS. ED to Mich ended up a waitlist. Late ED to UVA ended up in a ding. On "reserve" at Cornell, but I didn't get that app out until around Christmas. Ding at GULC, also applied around Christmas. WL at UCLA, Ding at Vandy, and still waiting on Columbia (late fee waiver and bad numbers = <1% chance imo), ND, and Alabama. Only acceptance was WUSTL with 84k. I retook in Feb and got a 176, so I'm considering reapplying next year to pretty much the same schools you are, but you are by no means a lock for the T14 with those numbers and nothing outstanding about your app.

No offense to you with this, but there's a big difference application wise between a 3.35~3.4/174 and a 3.2/172. Not even comparable in the sense of things...

[subtle]

They're going to tell you that hypothetical doesn't help. Hell, I'm telling you that. You could retake and get the 177 (great). You could retake and get a 170. *shrugs* Also, a lot can happen to cause you not to get a 4.0.

Also, OP, you could write an addendum about having to pay your own tuition because your parents lost their jobs. If you do, however, be careful that it comes across as positive--highlight what you learned and how this will contribute to making you a better lawyer--rather than as an excuse for your GPA.

Finally, take the time and put together really strong essays. There's not much you can do about your softs right now, short of taking time off. A well thought out, well-written ap can cause you to out-perform (or under-perform, if it's hastily put together) your numbers.

[Kabuo]

OP, I don't want to rain on your parade, but I applied in November with a 3.2/172, bad softs, and an average PS. ED to Mich ended up a waitlist. Late ED to UVA ended up in a ding. On "reserve" at Cornell, but I didn't get that app out until around Christmas. Ding at GULC, also applied around Christmas. WL at UCLA, Ding at Vandy, and still waiting on Columbia (late fee waiver and bad numbers = <1% chance imo), ND, and Alabama. Only acceptance was WUSTL with 84k. I retook in Feb and got a 176, so I'm considering reapplying next year to pretty much the same schools you are, but you are by no means a lock for the T14 with those numbers and nothing outstanding about your app.

No offense to you with this, but there's a big difference application wise between a 3.35~3.4/174 and a 3.2/172. Not even comparable in the sense of things...

No offense taken, but fwiw my LSAT was a 176 by the time they rendered most of those decisions.

[dissonance1848]

Look OP, if you want to ED NYU, you need at least a 3.3 + 179-180, seriously. NYU this cycle had a floor of around 3.4, 3.34 180 was the lowest I've seen, and remember that apps will probably be up next year. You have a lock on MVP if you ED, if not, I see WL, since your GPA is low.

[sanetruth]

Yes my preference is
1.columbia
2.nyu
3.penn
4.michigan

Does undergrad legacy help any? (Penn)

From what I've gathered UG legacy does little at all to help. You should be solid with an ED to Penn though. Safest bet is ED to Michigan. But definitely don't bother with NYU or CLS with those numbers. Sorry.

I don't know if safest bet is michigan. Michigan has really been living up to its reputation as being more 'holistic' than its peers in recent cycles, and i think without any softs or work experience you might be in bad shape. Penn, on the other hand, looks like it could happen.

[NZT]

mmk i'll come back round august with solid numbers!
but with my current numbers Penn ED is a good choice right?

thanks again!

[YourCaptain]

Do not retake. It won't help.

WORDS HERETOFORE UNHEARD BEFORE ARE SPOKEN