Am I overreaching too much?

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gin
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Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gin » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:08 pm

LSAT: 154, GPA: 3.07, URM
Before anything, retaking is not an option for several reasons
So far I have only applied to schools that have sent me fee waivers:
Boston U
Penn State
Pitt
Chicago Kent (can't remember if they sent me a fee waiver or their app is just free)

Also, since W&L has officially become the most pushy school as of this morning (pushier than those annoying for-profit schools), and their application is free

Disclaimer: Maine is my safety school, which I'm confident I can get in to (they are amongst the least divers schools in the nation and I'm within their percetilles

Am I applying to too many reach schools?

TheOcho
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby TheOcho » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:16 pm

Maine is not a safety for you and you should retake or not go to law school.

gambelda
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gambelda » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:17 pm

Out of Curiosity, why is retaking not an option? Everyone always says its "not an option" but forget that our lives average 70+ years and there's no reason to rush when you can work 1 year, save money up to pay of debt, and possibly get into a much better school down the road - probably resulting in much better pay down the road.

IMO. Retake. You waste your URM status by accepting a 154 as your best work. Study hard, score mid-160's. Go to Harvard.

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gin
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gin » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:24 pm

TheOcho wrote:Maine is not a safety for you and you should retake or not go to law school.

thanks for the awefully helpfull response. If you had read what I wrote, retaking is not an opion and considering Maine's 25th percentilles are 154 and 3.06, they are fairly homogenious I would say I can consider it as one of my safety schools.
This does remind me though, I posted this to actually get a feel of what I was doing, so if there are more responses like this, they will be met with a good dose of sarcasm

gambelda wrote:Out of Curiosity, why is retaking not an option? Everyone always says its "not an option" but forget that our lives average 70+ years and there's no reason to rush when you can work 1 year, save money up to pay of debt, and possibly get into a much better school down the road - probably resulting in much better pay down the road.

IMO. Retake. You waste your URM status by accepting a 154 as your best work. Study hard, score mid-160's. Go to Harvard.

I've already taken the LSAT three times: first time I didn't prepare myself; second time I took it while I was sick; third time I improved by over 10pts. Also, I already took a year off to save some money and I cannot stand staying where I'm at for another year.

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gin
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gin » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:26 pm

I forgot to mention, I also have a GPA addendum that my advisor recomended I submit

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glitter178
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby glitter178 » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:27 pm

gin wrote:I forgot to mention, I also have a GPA addendum that my advisor recomended I submit


means nothing.
enjoy maine.

/thread

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SilverE2
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby SilverE2 » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:32 pm

gin wrote:
TheOcho wrote:Maine is not a safety for you and you should retake or not go to law school.

thanks for the awefully helpfull response. If you had read what I wrote, retaking is not an opion and considering Maine's 25th percentilles are 154 and 3.06, they are fairly homogenious I would say I can consider it as one of my safety schools.
This does remind me though, I posted this to actually get a feel of what I was doing, so if there are more responses like this, they will be met with a good dose of sarcasm

gambelda wrote:Out of Curiosity, why is retaking not an option? Everyone always says its "not an option" but forget that our lives average 70+ years and there's no reason to rush when you can work 1 year, save money up to pay of debt, and possibly get into a much better school down the road - probably resulting in much better pay down the road.

IMO. Retake. You waste your URM status by accepting a 154 as your best work. Study hard, score mid-160's. Go to Harvard.

I've already taken the LSAT three times: first time I didn't prepare myself; second time I took it while I was sick; third time I improved by over 10pts. Also, I already took a year off to save some money and I cannot stand staying where I'm at for another year.


Every single person who says that "retaking is not an option" has as the reason "I can't be bothered to study and take it again." Do you think you've done as well as you possibly can do on the lsat? If so, you should strongly reconsider whether or not you should go to law school. If you think you have it in you, EVEN TO GET JUST 2-3 MORE POINTS HIGHER, then you really should retake, especially as a URM. Imagine how absolutely pissed you will be at yourself if in 3 years you're sitting around with no job, and hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt, and you had an opportunity to decrease your chances of being in that situation, but you didn't do it because you didn't feel like it. You're gonna feel like a real idiot.

What URM are you by the way?

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gin
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gin » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:40 pm

SilverE2 wrote:Every single person who says that "retaking is not an option" has as the reason "I can't be bothered to study and take it again." Do you think you've done as well as you possibly can do on the lsat? If so, you should strongly reconsider whether or not you should go to law school. If you think you have it in you, EVEN TO GET JUST 2-3 MORE POINTS HIGHER, then you really should retake, especially as a URM. Imagine how absolutely pissed you will be at yourself if in 3 years you're sitting around with no job, and hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt, and you had an opportunity to decrease your chances of being in that situation, but you didn't do it because you didn't feel like it. You're gonna feel like a real idiot.

What URM are you by the way?


You can only take the LSAT 3x every 2 years and I don't feel like putting my life on hold for another 2 years. I'm in Texas but I'm only applying to schools in the NE and NW which kind of shows how bad I want to get out of where I'm at right now. As of debt and employment prospects, that is probably the second thing I look at when looking at schools, so even if I don't make so much $$$ at some TTT schools, I'm making sure my chances of amassing a huge debt will be reduced as well (it's not secret I'm not expecting to get any $$$ from any school)
As for the URM, I'm hispanic. I was also born abroad (I'm not sure if that will count for anything)

jarofsoup
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby jarofsoup » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:43 pm

Get it up to a 157 and you will be in much better shape.

gambelda
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gambelda » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:45 pm

SilverE2 wrote:
gin wrote:
TheOcho wrote:Maine is not a safety for you and you should retake or not go to law school.

thanks for the awefully helpfull response. If you had read what I wrote, retaking is not an opion and considering Maine's 25th percentilles are 154 and 3.06, they are fairly homogenious I would say I can consider it as one of my safety schools.
This does remind me though, I posted this to actually get a feel of what I was doing, so if there are more responses like this, they will be met with a good dose of sarcasm

gambelda wrote:Out of Curiosity, why is retaking not an option? Everyone always says its "not an option" but forget that our lives average 70+ years and there's no reason to rush when you can work 1 year, save money up to pay of debt, and possibly get into a much better school down the road - probably resulting in much better pay down the road.

IMO. Retake. You waste your URM status by accepting a 154 as your best work. Study hard, score mid-160's. Go to Harvard.

I've already taken the LSAT three times: first time I didn't prepare myself; second time I took it while I was sick; third time I improved by over 10pts. Also, I already took a year off to save some money and I cannot stand staying where I'm at for another year.


Every single person who says that "retaking is not an option" has as the reason "I can't be bothered to study and take it again." Do you think you've done as well as you possibly can do on the lsat? If so, you should strongly reconsider whether or not you should go to law school. If you think you have it in you, EVEN TO GET JUST 2-3 MORE POINTS HIGHER, then you really should retake, especially as a URM. Imagine how absolutely pissed you will be at yourself if in 3 years you're sitting around with no job, and hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt, and you had an opportunity to decrease your chances of being in that situation, but you didn't do it because you didn't feel like it. You're gonna feel like a real idiot.

What URM are you by the way?


You typed almost my exact same post I was about to type and then I said ....eh, this person has already made up his/her mind.....but yes...you are a URM. Don't waste it with a 154. If you hate where you are at, then find a new job, move, work 2 years, retake LSAT, apply to a T14 and get out of the everyday shit most people trudge through.

PEOPLE SHOULD NOT BE GOING TO LAW SCHOOL BECAUSE THEY ARE UNHAPPY ABOUT WHERE THEY ARE NOW. THIS IS THE STUPIDEST MOVE YOU CAN EVER MAKE AND SHOULD BE DISCOURAGED. (looks at all the idiots who think getting a law school degree in a bad economy will only improve their chances later)

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SilverE2
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby SilverE2 » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:48 pm

gin wrote:
SilverE2 wrote:Every single person who says that "retaking is not an option" has as the reason "I can't be bothered to study and take it again." Do you think you've done as well as you possibly can do on the lsat? If so, you should strongly reconsider whether or not you should go to law school. If you think you have it in you, EVEN TO GET JUST 2-3 MORE POINTS HIGHER, then you really should retake, especially as a URM. Imagine how absolutely pissed you will be at yourself if in 3 years you're sitting around with no job, and hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt, and you had an opportunity to decrease your chances of being in that situation, but you didn't do it because you didn't feel like it. You're gonna feel like a real idiot.

What URM are you by the way?


You can only take the LSAT 3x every 2 years and I don't feel like putting my life on hold for another 2 years. I'm in Texas but I'm only applying to schools in the NE and NW which kind of shows how bad I want to get out of where I'm at right now. As of debt and employment prospects, that is probably the second thing I look at when looking at schools, so even if I don't make so much $$$ at some TTT schools, I'm making sure my chances of amassing a huge debt will be reduced as well (it's not secret I'm not expecting to get any $$$ from any school)
As for the URM, I'm hispanic. I was also born abroad (I'm not sure if that will count for anything)


You're Mexican/Puerto Rican?

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gin
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gin » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:57 pm

gambelda wrote:You typed almost my exact same post I was about to type and then I said ....eh, this person has already made up his/her mind.....but yes...you are a URM. Don't waste it with a 154. If you hate where you are at, then find a new job, move, work 2 years, retake LSAT, apply to a T14 and get out of the everyday shit most people trudge through.

PEOPLE SHOULD NOT BE GOING TO LAW SCHOOL BECAUSE THEY ARE UNHAPPY ABOUT WHERE THEY ARE NOW. THIS IS THE STUPIDEST MOVE YOU CAN EVER MAKE AND SHOULD BE DISCOURAGED. (looks at all the idiots who think getting a law school degree in a bad economy will only improve their chances later)


I'm actually very happy with the schools I have applied so far. This might be a dumb move but I'm not looking for BigLaw in a major market area. I'm looking more for settling down around the area I end up going to school to and I'm probably end up working on public interest. I'm not unhappy per say with were I'm at right now, it's just not what I want to do and moving somewhere else and doing the same thing would leave me in almost the exact same places, granted with a more plesant senario. If I don't get in to a school I would be happy going to I would take more time of or change my career or something, but I'm confident I can get in to one of the schools (this is were you guys come in: to make sure I'm not overconfident).
SilverE2 wrote:You're Mexican/Puerto Rican?

Mexican American

whymeohgodno
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby whymeohgodno » Mon Dec 06, 2010 3:59 pm

You can take the test more than 3 times in 3 years. Just ask a school for some form and they let you take it again.

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gin
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gin » Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:03 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:You can take the test more than 3 times in 3 years. Just ask a school for some form and they let you take it again.

I actually hadn't thought of that. Do you know if schools allow people to do it freaquently or if it is only someone they are really interested in (for whatever reason)

gambelda
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gambelda » Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:09 pm

I think it is pretty frequent actually. Call a school and say you're interested in applying but would like to take the LSAT again, There were 2 extenuating circumstances in your firt 2 go-arounds and the 3rd LSAT was not indicative of your true capablities. Get a 4th attempt. Kill it. Get into better school.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby whymeohgodno » Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:12 pm

gin wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:You can take the test more than 3 times in 3 years. Just ask a school for some form and they let you take it again.

I actually hadn't thought of that. Do you know if schools allow people to do it freaquently or if it is only someone they are really interested in (for whatever reason)


They pretty much let anyone do it. It's really easy to get.

TheOcho
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby TheOcho » Mon Dec 06, 2010 8:38 pm

gin wrote:
TheOcho wrote:Maine is not a safety for you and you should retake or not go to law school.

thanks for the awefully helpfull response. If you had read what I wrote, retaking is not an opion and considering Maine's 25th percentilles are 154 and 3.06, they are fairly homogenious I would say I can consider it as one of my safety schools.
This does remind me though, I posted this to actually get a feel of what I was doing, so if there are more responses like this, they will be met with a good dose of sarcasm

gambelda wrote:Out of Curiosity, why is retaking not an option? Everyone always says its "not an option" but forget that our lives average 70+ years and there's no reason to rush when you can work 1 year, save money up to pay of debt, and possibly get into a much better school down the road - probably resulting in much better pay down the road.

IMO. Retake. You waste your URM status by accepting a 154 as your best work. Study hard, score mid-160's. Go to Harvard.

I've already taken the LSAT three times: first time I didn't prepare myself; second time I took it while I was sick; third time I improved by over 10pts. Also, I already took a year off to save some money and I cannot stand staying where I'm at for another year.


Retaking is an option and you should be looking at the schools medians, not the 25th percentile. HTH.

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Law Sauce
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby Law Sauce » Tue Dec 07, 2010 3:19 pm

Good luck whatever you decide.

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TommyK
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby TommyK » Tue Dec 07, 2010 3:23 pm

TheOcho wrote:Retaking is an option and you should be looking at the schools medians, not the 25th percentile. HTH.



He's a URM. While retaking is an option he should consider, I think it's completely fair for him to look at schools where he's at the 25th percentile on his stats.

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FunkyJD
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby FunkyJD » Tue Dec 07, 2010 3:38 pm

Fee waiver offers, of course, are no guarantee of acceptances. Even as a Mexican URM, I think OP is pushing his luck hard with a 154. I don't feel he'll be competitive at any of the schools he listed. Or, if he does get in, will it be at sticker? That can't be worth it.

Also, major +1 to the poster who said that law school is not a device to be used to effect a change of scenery. I also wonder if OP has any idea how competitive the PI market is. A Maine JD is not the optimal route to go for that.

I hate to tell people to rethink their plans, because everyone has a right to pursue their dreams, but damn OP ... this is not how you should go about it. Not at all.

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mez06
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby mez06 » Tue Dec 07, 2010 3:42 pm

With such a low score my friend, you really should include A LOT more schools on your list. Aim for solid Tier 3 schools. Michigan State is EXTREMELY kind to URMs and I believe you will get in as long as your softs and rec letters are good.

I'd also add Howard on there as well. I do believe you would get into Maine but Penn State and BU leave you with very slim chances.

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FunkyJD
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby FunkyJD » Tue Dec 07, 2010 3:50 pm

I didn't see BU. You have no shot at BU.

gambelda
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby gambelda » Tue Dec 07, 2010 3:55 pm

mez06 wrote:With such a low score my friend, you really should include A LOT more schools on your list. Aim for solid Tier 3 schools. Michigan State is EXTREMELY kind to URMs and I believe you will get in as long as your softs and rec letters are good.

I'd also add Howard on there as well. I do believe you would get into Maine but Penn State and BU leave you with very slim chances.


Michigan State Law is also a joke. You heard it here from an undergrad of the institution who has spoken with a number of it's faculty from the law department.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby CanadianWolf » Tue Dec 07, 2010 4:18 pm

You should apply to a few more match or safety law schools. Think about where you would be willing to live & work. Researching lawschoolnumbers.com may reveal some surprises for URMs with a 154 LSAT. No need to spend more time with the LSAT if you are willing to accept your current options. Three recent LSAT sittings should be enough.

P.S. You should be a strong candidate for admission to Maine. Consider Stetson & Nebraska.
Last edited by CanadianWolf on Tue Dec 07, 2010 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TheOcho
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Re: Am I overreaching too much?

Postby TheOcho » Tue Dec 07, 2010 4:32 pm

TommyK wrote:
TheOcho wrote:Retaking is an option and you should be looking at the schools medians, not the 25th percentile. HTH.



He's a URM. While retaking is an option he should consider, I think it's completely fair for him to look at schools where he's at the 25th percentile on his stats.


It's fair for him to look at those schools as possible admits, yes. I don't think they are by any means a safety, however.

Unless OP can get significant $ from one of his acceptances I think law school is an extremely poor investment in this case. I think the best advice is to prepare very well for a retake, score higher, and at a minimum receive significant $ from one of these schools.




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