3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Not sure where your numbers will get you? Dying to know where you stand? Come have your palms read by your fellow posters!
ewj
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:28 pm

3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby ewj » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:44 pm

Okay, so my LSAT score is pretty disappointing but it could be worse. I cancelled my first score because I was scared, got the 149 a month later and now I'm taking it again this December for Fall 2011 admission. I don't expect my score will improve because I haven't been able to dedicate much time to studying.

What are my chances of getting into a decent school? I don't need to go somewhere amazing, but I would like to avoid the lowest of the low. Also, I haven't done any research on the tiers of law schools - do they really matter that much when it comes to getting a job after passing the bar? I don't need to make six figures right off the bat but I'd like to get there eventually - its okay if it takes me 20 years. I've asked a few relatively successful lawyers how much the prestige of the school matters and they all said that it really just comes down to passing the bar. So, the bar passage rate of the school is important but is prestige really that essential?

Thank you for your help!

User avatar
northwood
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 7:29 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby northwood » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:49 pm

re take and see what you do. Stay away from tier 4.

best of luck

User avatar
Ginj
Posts: 531
Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2010 11:53 am

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby Ginj » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:51 pm

Prestige is not essential if you're wanting to work within a specific region AND you do extremely well. I know someone at Texas Tech who graduated #1 in her class and was offered a 6 figure salary right off the bat in Houston. However, chances of you doing that well are not in your favor, especially given your numbers (not exemplifying much work ethic, and, as you said, you haven't been willing to study much for the LSAT).

Everyone here will tell you to buckle down and retake. A better score will increase your chances of 1.) graduating with less debt and 2.) finding a decent job after graduation (which is where prestige plays a part). If you want to succeed in law school, you'll have to be willing to study. If you're not willing to study now, then you probably don't belong at a top tier school.

So. This is what you're in for.

kehoema2
Posts: 135
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:52 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby kehoema2 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:54 pm

The above. Applying with a 149 says you are not into doing hard work. I wouldn't apply till you have near or above a 160 with your situation. Why? Because I'd rather have scholarship so if I never land a big job at least the debt is down.

gambelda
Posts: 300
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:44 am

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby gambelda » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:56 pm

Retake, score 160+, get good scholly at a regional school, do well, Profit

User avatar
NYC_7911
Posts: 238
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:03 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby NYC_7911 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:59 pm

Really. If you have a 3.5 GPA, you can do better than a 149. If you really don't have time to put into studying for a retake now, put it off and apply next cycle.

User avatar
beachbum
Posts: 2766
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:35 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby beachbum » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:00 pm

Ginj wrote:Prestige is not essential if you're wanting to work within a specific region AND you do extremely well. I know someone at Texas Tech who graduated #1 in her class and was offered a 6 figure salary right off the bat in Houston. However, chances of you doing that well are not in your favor, especially given your numbers (not exemplifying much work ethic, and, as you said, you haven't been willing to study much for the LSAT).

Everyone here will tell you to buckle down and retake. A better score will increase your chances of 1.) graduating with less debt and 2.) finding a decent job after graduation (which is where prestige plays a part). If you want to succeed in law school, you'll have to be willing to study. If you're not willing to study now, then you probably don't belong at a top tier school.

So. This is what you're in for.


This. If you're serious about law school (and becoming an attorney), you need to buckle down and get a respectable LSAT score. If you can't do that, this is not the career for you.

User avatar
FuManChusco
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:56 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby FuManChusco » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:00 pm

School rank is extremely important. It does not just come down to passing the bar. ITE, it is foolish to take on heavy debt regardless of the school. That 149 is not going to get you in anywhere worth going and the debt you would have to take would be crippling. If you don't start at six figures, you may never get there. That is how salaries work in the legal field. I wouldn't retake in December if you aren't ready. You're best bet it to wait to apply until next cycle as it would be a shame to waste that GPA on a TTTT. Unless you improve drastically, you will be spending money on apps for schools that will not be worth. It will be your 3rd test so if you don't improve and have to retake again, you'll have to ask a school to submit a request allowing you to take it a 4th time. If you don't have the time or commitment to study hard and do well, then law school isn't for you anyway. Also, excuse the typos. I'm typing on a phone.

User avatar
People's Eyebrow
Posts: 17
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2009 5:20 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby People's Eyebrow » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:09 pm

ewj wrote:I haven't done any research on the tiers of law schools

That quote coupled with only one post = flame.

User avatar
FuManChusco
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:56 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby FuManChusco » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:11 pm

People's Eyebrow wrote:
ewj wrote:I haven't done any research on the tiers of law schools

That quote coupled with only one post = flame.


Possible. Worst flame ever though.

ewj
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:28 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby ewj » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:13 pm

I know a top tier school is out of my reach and I'm not concerned with that. All I want to do is avoid fourth tier schools since they are apparently quite limiting in their post-graduate career prospects.

If it turns out that I can only get into a fourth tier school and it turns out they really aren't worth graduating from, isn't it usually possible to transfer after the first year to a better school? I out-performed my SAT score (did well at a school I shouldn't have gotten into according to their admission statistics), so I'm quite confident I can out-perform my LSAT score by doing very well at a fourth tier school, making me eligible to transfer to a better school.

What do you guys think abou that?

User avatar
FuManChusco
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:56 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby FuManChusco » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:17 pm

ewj wrote:I know a top tier school is out of my reach and I'm not concerned with that. All I want to do is avoid fourth tier schools since they are apparently quite limiting in their post-graduate career prospects.

If it turns out that I can only get into a fourth tier school and it turns out they really aren't worth graduating from, isn't it usually possible to transfer after the first year to a better school? I out-performed my SAT score (did well at a school I shouldn't have gotten into according to their admission statistics), so I'm quite confident I can out-perform my LSAT score by doing very well at a fourth tier school, making me eligible to transfer to a better school.

What do you guys think abou that?


Ok. I really hope this is a flame now. Don't ever go to a school with the idea of transferring. It rarely happens. As for avoiding 4th tier schools. You should probably avoid 3rd and 2nd tier schools as well ITE. I seriously wouldn't even apply for law school with <160.

ewj
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:28 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby ewj » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:21 pm

Well considering I'm posting on a forum on the TOP-LAW-SCHOOLS.COM website, I think many of you are just a little biased... That's like saying that the only undergraduate institutions worth going to are the ivy leagues.

A law school admissions counselor gave me the impression that transferring after your first year of law school is not uncommon, and not that difficult, as long as performed well that year.

User avatar
glitter178
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 8:21 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby glitter178 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:23 pm

ewj wrote:Well considering I'm posting on a forum on the TOP-LAW-SCHOOLS.COM website, I think many of you are just a little biased... That's like saying that the only undergraduate institutions worth going to are the ivy leagues.

A law school admissions counselor gave me the impression that transferring after your first year of law school is not uncommon, and not that difficult, as long as performed well that year.


?? then why are you asking for the advice here, if you don't want it from the sources that frequent this site? makes no sense. how about this: don't retake, get into a TTTT, attempt to transfer, and come back after that and let everyone know how it went.

User avatar
FuManChusco
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:56 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby FuManChusco » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:25 pm

ewj wrote:Well considering I'm posting on a forum on the TOP-LAW-SCHOOLS.COM website, I think many of you are just a little biased... That's like saying that the only undergraduate institutions worth going to are the ivy leagues.

A law school admissions counselor gave me the impression that transferring after your first year of law school is not uncommon, and not that difficult, as long as performed well that year.


Ok, FLAME.

gambelda
Posts: 300
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:44 am

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby gambelda » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:31 pm

ewj wrote:Well considering I'm posting on a forum on the TOP-LAW-SCHOOLS.COM website, I think many of you are just a little biased... That's like saying that the only undergraduate institutions worth going to are the ivy leagues.

A law school admissions counselor gave me the impression that transferring after your first year of law school is not uncommon, and not that difficult, as long as performed well that year.


You are a retard. This is not a biased opinion. It will be almost impossible to transfer from a 3rd or 4th tier law school. The debt you take on will be massive and you will never make enough money to pay it back. Above posters are correct in that realistically, most people shouldn't go to law school outside T1.

If you don't trust us then do your own research. Better yet, go to a tier 4 and let us know how you are doing financially in 5 years.

Grow up. Study Hard. Retake. Go to a decent school. Have a decent future. If you can't handle that then you are extremely naiive and don't belong in law school.

User avatar
Patriot1208
Posts: 7044
Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 11:28 am

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby Patriot1208 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:34 pm

why do people even respond to these threads?

ewj
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:28 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby ewj » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:37 pm

Geez, guys - I definitely value your opinions. I am taking them in and considering them but if you're saying things that contradict what I've heard from other valuable sources (admissions counselors, successful lawyers), then should I really just blindly follow what you're saying? I think the better route is to tell you what I've heard and wait to see what you think.

I'm taking all the advice and information I can get and considering it all - I very much appreciate your input. I hope more people will reply to my post because I want to be informed as I can in making this life-altering decision.

No need to be mean.

gambelda
Posts: 300
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:44 am

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby gambelda » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:39 pm

One admissions counselor once told me no one can ever raise their LSAT more than 6 points. Just because they are in admissions does not make the intelligent.

User avatar
beachbum
Posts: 2766
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:35 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby beachbum » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:44 pm

ewj wrote:Geez, guys - I definitely value your opinions. I am taking them in and considering them but if you're saying things that contradict what I've heard from other valuable sources (admissions counselors, successful lawyers), then should I really just blindly follow what you're saying? I think the better route is to tell you what I've heard and wait to see what you think.

I'm taking all the advice and information I can get and considering it all - I very much appreciate your input. I hope more people will reply to my post because I want to be informed as I can in making this life-altering decision.

No need to be mean.


a) Most practicing lawyers are unaware of current admissions practices and legal hiring/recruiting. After all, they graduated long ago and have not had to follow these trends and statistics for quite some time. So unless the lawyers you spoke with are hiring partners and/or actively recruiting, they might not be the most reliable sources.

b) Admissions officers will tell you anything to get you to apply and (if admitted) to attend. From your application, your acceptance (and matriculation) or rejection contributes to their selectivity and/or yield statistics. From your attendance, well, they get your money. There's a lot of incentive for adcomms to "rosy-up" the facts.

User avatar
Patriot1208
Posts: 7044
Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 11:28 am

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby Patriot1208 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:44 pm

Pre-Law advisors and admissions counselors are, without a doubt, the most uninformed people on the entire process.

ewj
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:28 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby ewj » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:45 pm

Yeah, that's true - he may be an unreliable resource. I will do some outside research about transferring law schools.

gambelda wrote:One admissions counselor once told me no one can ever raise their LSAT more than 6 points. Just because they are in admissions does not make the intelligent.

User avatar
PinkCow
Posts: 786
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2010 2:03 am

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby PinkCow » Wed Dec 01, 2010 7:00 pm

All your info really depends on your source. Heck, I worked for/know a handful of lawyers who are really nice people. All of them went to a TTT and now make ~50k/yr. Their opinions sound about like the ones you're getting.

So, I guess if that's what you want, go for it. I find the whole idea pretty dismal, but whatever.

Concerning your LSAT, 149 kills your prospects. Sure, some people are just crappy test takers, but if you wanted to, I highly doubt 160 would be impossible. Retake in Feb, get some WE, and apply next year.

Or, screw everybody and apply this year with a 149 and hope for the best. Just try not settle for a place like UIdaho, or you'll end up practicing hill-people litigation for the rest of your life.

User avatar
FuManChusco
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:56 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby FuManChusco » Wed Dec 01, 2010 7:03 pm

Patriot1208 wrote:Pre-Law advisors and admissions counselors are, without a doubt, the most uninformed people on the entire process.


Agree completely. I went to a good UG with a T25 LS and the pre-law advisor is an idiot. I have a 170 and she said I probably couldn't get into a T50 because of my shit gpa. She told me transferring was a good option and I should think about it. Told me turning down schools and re-applying the next cycle was a terrible decision and that an addendum wasn't good enough. Basically everything they say is wrong. She almost discouraged me from applying at all until I realized she's an idiot. I just feel bad for kids, like OP, who don't do enough research and listen to these jerk offs.

Anyways I'm done giving advice. OP is obviously a flame.

ewj
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:28 pm

Re: 3.5 GPA, 149 LSAT, White/Caucasian female

Postby ewj » Wed Dec 01, 2010 7:07 pm

Thank you for your reply. The lawyers I've talked to have pretty well established careers - they're in their 40s-50s. Two of these lawyers that I spoke to went to the same tier one school and they're making really good money. Another lawyer I talked to went to a tier three school (Willamette University) and hes making about 110,000 a year which is where I'd like to be when I'm 40-50.

chip3341 wrote:All your info really depends on your source. Heck, I worked for/know a handful of lawyers who are really nice people. All of them went to a TTT and now make ~50k/yr. Their opinions sound about like the ones you're getting.

So, I guess if that's what you want, go for it. I find the whole idea pretty dismal, but whatever.

Concerning your LSAT, 149 kills your prospects. Sure, some people are just crappy test takers, but if you wanted to, I highly doubt 160 would be impossible. Retake in Feb, get some WE, and apply next year.

Or, screw everybody and apply this year with a 149 and hope for the best. Just try not settle for a place like UIdaho, or you'll end up practicing hill-people litigation for the rest of your life.




Return to “What are my chances?”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests