Money at T30

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HeavenWood
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Money at T30

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Nov 05, 2010 6:21 pm

166/3.94/non-URM

Am I likely to get money at W&M, BU, BC, GW, and WUSTL? If so, how much? I've checked lawschoolnumbers already, and it seems like I should be good for anywhere between 1/4 and 1/2 ride, but I was just wondering if anyone with similar numbers had personal experience with this past cycle.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Money at T30

Postby whymeohgodno » Fri Nov 05, 2010 6:51 pm

Puhaha! You and I both know you will be taking that sticker at Cornell!

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Grizz
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Re: Money at T30

Postby Grizz » Fri Nov 05, 2010 7:28 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:Puhaha! You and I both know you will be taking that sticker at Cornell!


Sticker at Cornell isn't a great idea but whatever.

dakatz
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Re: Money at T30

Postby dakatz » Fri Nov 05, 2010 7:30 pm

Tuition at Cornell is over $51,000. There is sticker, and then there is STICKER. If you can stomach the idea of being nearly a quarter of a million in debt for anything but HYS, then I guess its not a big deal.

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RMstratosphere
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Re: Money at T30

Postby RMstratosphere » Fri Nov 05, 2010 7:36 pm

W&M (Y), BU (Y), BC (Y), GW(?), and WUSTL (?).

Consider IU-B. Your numbers would pull a full scholly.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Money at T30

Postby whymeohgodno » Fri Nov 05, 2010 7:42 pm

dakatz wrote:Tuition at Cornell is over $51,000. There is sticker, and then there is STICKER. If you can stomach the idea of being nearly a quarter of a million in debt for anything but HYS, then I guess its not a big deal.


Never said it wasn't a big deal - I'm not sure where you are even inferring this from.

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Kswizzie
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Re: Money at T30

Postby Kswizzie » Fri Nov 05, 2010 8:45 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
dakatz wrote:Tuition at Cornell is over $51,000. There is sticker, and then there is STICKER. If you can stomach the idea of being nearly a quarter of a million in debt for anything but HYS, then I guess its not a big deal.


Never said it wasn't a big deal - I'm not sure where you are even inferring this from.


COL in Ithaca is CHEAP. In the grand scheme of things, Cornell ends up being cheaper then a good chunk of the T-14

HowdyYall
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Re: Money at T30

Postby HowdyYall » Fri Nov 05, 2010 9:02 pm

Kswizzie wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
dakatz wrote:Tuition at Cornell is over $51,000. There is sticker, and then there is STICKER. If you can stomach the idea of being nearly a quarter of a million in debt for anything but HYS, then I guess its not a big deal.


Never said it wasn't a big deal - I'm not sure where you are even inferring this from.


COL in Ithaca is CHEAP. In the grand scheme of things, Cornell ends up being cheaper then a good chunk of the T-14


Thats not true. Im renting a crappy place in collegetown here in ithaca for $700/month and im pretty sure thats the cheapest it gets in ithaca. Dont expect to save on COL of living at Cornell compared to elsewhere

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Kswizzie
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Re: Money at T30

Postby Kswizzie » Fri Nov 05, 2010 9:08 pm

HowdyYall wrote:
Kswizzie wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
dakatz wrote:Tuition at Cornell is over $51,000. There is sticker, and then there is STICKER. If you can stomach the idea of being nearly a quarter of a million in debt for anything but HYS, then I guess its not a big deal.


Never said it wasn't a big deal - I'm not sure where you are even inferring this from.


COL in Ithaca is CHEAP. In the grand scheme of things, Cornell ends up being cheaper then a good chunk of the T-14


Thats not true. Im renting a crappy place in collegetown here in ithaca for $700/month and im pretty sure thats the cheapest it gets in ithaca. Dont expect to save on COL of living at Cornell compared to elsewhere


Depends on the elsewhere... (see: NYU, Columbia, NW, Chi, Berkeley) are you living alone?... if you can put up with roommates I know for a fact you can go cheaper

HeavenWood
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Re: Money at T30

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:25 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:Puhaha! You and I both know you will be taking that sticker at Cornell!


That would require a chain of ifs: if I am waitlisted or rejected from Penn ED, if I am waitlisted or rejected from UVA and Georgetown EDs, if I don't get into Berkeley, and, of course, if I get into Cornell (I'm confident in my chances, but I know it's no guarantee).

I wouldn't have an issue paying sticker at Cornell, but that's only because my law school will be 100% taken care of.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Money at T30

Postby whymeohgodno » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:32 pm

HeavenWood wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:Puhaha! You and I both know you will be taking that sticker at Cornell!


That would require a chain of ifs: if I am waitlisted or rejected from Penn ED, if I am waitlisted or rejected from UVA and Georgetown EDs, if I don't get into Berkeley, and, of course, if I get into Cornell (I'm confident in my chances, but I know it's no guarantee).

I wouldn't have an issue paying sticker at Cornell, but that's only because my law school will be 100% taken care of.


Well I'm 99% sure you will get into UVA if you ED.

HeavenWood
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Re: Money at T30

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:40 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
HeavenWood wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:Puhaha! You and I both know you will be taking that sticker at Cornell!


That would require a chain of ifs: if I am waitlisted or rejected from Penn ED, if I am waitlisted or rejected from UVA and Georgetown EDs, if I don't get into Berkeley, and, of course, if I get into Cornell (I'm confident in my chances, but I know it's no guarantee).

I wouldn't have an issue paying sticker at Cornell, but that's only because my law school will be 100% taken care of.


Well I'm 99% sure you will get into UVA if you ED.


I like those odds, but I can't help but feel that's an overconfident estimation. :wink:

whymeohgodno
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Re: Money at T30

Postby whymeohgodno » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:41 pm

HeavenWood wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
HeavenWood wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:Puhaha! You and I both know you will be taking that sticker at Cornell!


That would require a chain of ifs: if I am waitlisted or rejected from Penn ED, if I am waitlisted or rejected from UVA and Georgetown EDs, if I don't get into Berkeley, and, of course, if I get into Cornell (I'm confident in my chances, but I know it's no guarantee).

I wouldn't have an issue paying sticker at Cornell, but that's only because my law school will be 100% taken care of.


Well I'm 99% sure you will get into UVA if you ED.


I like those odds, but I can't help but feel that's an overconfident estimation. :wink:


I don't think UVA has rejected a 3.9+ 165+ ED applicant lol.

HeavenWood
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Re: Money at T30

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:44 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:I don't think UVA has rejected a 3.9+ 165+ ED applicant lol.


Maybe not on LSN, but LSN isn't a full picture. I'm confident that I have a shot, maybe even a decent shot, but I doubt they'll just let me in. I'm out of state, and wouldn't be applying until late December/early January.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Money at T30

Postby whymeohgodno » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:46 pm

HeavenWood wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:I don't think UVA has rejected a 3.9+ 165+ ED applicant lol.


Maybe not on LSN, but LSN isn't a full picture. I'm confident that I have a shot, maybe even a decent shot, but I doubt they'll just let me in. I'm out of state, and wouldn't be applying until late December/early January.


Why so late?

HeavenWood
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Re: Money at T30

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:50 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
HeavenWood wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:I don't think UVA has rejected a 3.9+ 165+ ED applicant lol.


Maybe not on LSN, but LSN isn't a full picture. I'm confident that I have a shot, maybe even a decent shot, but I doubt they'll just let me in. I'm out of state, and wouldn't be applying until late December/early January.


Why so late?


I'm applying to Penn ED first.

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booboo
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Re: Money at T30

Postby booboo » Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:55 pm

You should be fine with a late UVA ED submission. If I remember correctly, last cycle they let in more ED applicants that helped their 75th percentile for GPA than those for the LSAT when it was later in the cycle because they get a lot of lower GPA, high LSAT ED applicants.

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thexfactor
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Re: Money at T30

Postby thexfactor » Sat Nov 06, 2010 12:17 am

i think sticker at cornell is better than half scholarship at wustl/bc/bu level. I think it s even when you get to full scholarship.

Cornell doubles your chances of getting biglaw/meaningful job as compared to wustl/bc/bu/emory......

There is a huge gap between T14 vandy and WUSTL/fordham/bu/bc/gw....

Ive heard ghost stories of people at cornell getting biglaw from median and below. I ve been specifically told that you need top 1/3 at wustl to be competitive for OCI.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Money at T30

Postby whymeohgodno » Sat Nov 06, 2010 1:16 am

thexfactor wrote:i think sticker at cornell is better than half scholarship at wustl/bc/bu level. I think it s even when you get to full scholarship.

Cornell doubles your chances of getting biglaw/meaningful job as compared to wustl/bc/bu/emory......

There is a huge gap between T14 vandy and WUSTL/fordham/bu/bc/gw....

Ive heard ghost stories of people at cornell getting biglaw from median and below. I ve been specifically told that you need top 1/3 at wustl to be competitive for OCI.


What about between t14 vandy and Texas and UCLA?

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hellojd
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Re: Money at T30

Postby hellojd » Sat Nov 06, 2010 7:21 am

thexfactor wrote:i think sticker at cornell is better than half scholarship at wustl/bc/bu level. I think it s even when you get to full scholarship.

Cornell doubles your chances of getting biglaw/meaningful job as compared to wustl/bc/bu/emory......

There is a huge gap between T14 vandy and WUSTL/fordham/bu/bc/gw....

Ive heard ghost stories of people at cornell getting biglaw from median and below. I ve been specifically told that you need top 1/3 at wustl to be competitive for OCI.


Not sure I'd agree with this advice. Sticker at Cornell means that you'd really have to get a solid Biglaw job or you're financially screwed. A half or 3/4 scholly at wustl gives you much more flexibility, expecially since your home market is in the not as saturated midwest market, as opposed to NYC, where you'd have to compete with, well, everyone ranked higher than you more or less.

Besides, the prospects for the median or below Cornell grad aren't looking too great right now - you'll have a lot of people on this board debating about whether sticker is worth it even at Penn (I personally think it is). Cornell/GULC are pretty safe to say bad options at sticker, despite the fact that they're T14. IMHO.

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KMaine
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Re: Money at T30

Postby KMaine » Sat Nov 06, 2010 8:47 am

hellojd wrote:
thexfactor wrote:i think sticker at cornell is better than half scholarship at wustl/bc/bu level. I think it s even when you get to full scholarship.

Cornell doubles your chances of getting biglaw/meaningful job as compared to wustl/bc/bu/emory......

There is a huge gap between T14 vandy and WUSTL/fordham/bu/bc/gw....

Ive heard ghost stories of people at cornell getting biglaw from median and below. I ve been specifically told that you need top 1/3 at wustl to be competitive for OCI.


Not sure I'd agree with this advice. Sticker at Cornell means that you'd really have to get a solid Biglaw job or you're financially screwed. A half or 3/4 scholly at wustl gives you much more flexibility, expecially since your home market is in the not as saturated midwest market, as opposed to NYC, where you'd have to compete with, well, everyone ranked higher than you more or less.

Besides, the prospects for the median or below Cornell grad aren't looking too great right now - you'll have a lot of people on this board debating about whether sticker is worth it even at Penn (I personally think it is). Cornell/GULC are pretty safe to say bad options at sticker, despite the fact that they're T14. IMHO.


Not a bad post overall, but am getting pretty tired of this distinction. I do not think I would have paid sticker at either Penn or Cornell, but the risk is essentially the same. Most people at either school have some shot at big law. A certain percentage at each school will not get it. I am not sure the calculus changes that much based on a few percentage points. I don't really understand the reasoning "I will risk 200+K for a 47% chance at Biglaw, but I have to draw the line at 42%." (note: I know these are not the exact numbers, but the difference is somewhere in that ballpark).

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tallboone
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Re: Money at T30

Postby tallboone » Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:48 am

What was the quality of your undergrad?

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thexfactor
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Re: Money at T30

Postby thexfactor » Sat Nov 06, 2010 10:46 am

KMaine wrote:
hellojd wrote:
thexfactor wrote:i think sticker at cornell is better than half scholarship at wustl/bc/bu level. I think it s even when you get to full scholarship.

Cornell doubles your chances of getting biglaw/meaningful job as compared to wustl/bc/bu/emory......

There is a huge gap between T14 vandy and WUSTL/fordham/bu/bc/gw....

Ive heard ghost stories of people at cornell getting biglaw from median and below. I ve been specifically told that you need top 1/3 at wustl to be competitive for OCI.


Not sure I'd agree with this advice. Sticker at Cornell means that you'd really have to get a solid Biglaw job or you're financially screwed. A half or 3/4 scholly at wustl gives you much more flexibility, expecially since your home market is in the not as saturated midwest market, as opposed to NYC, where you'd have to compete with, well, everyone ranked higher than you more or less.

Besides, the prospects for the median or below Cornell grad aren't looking too great right now - you'll have a lot of people on this board debating about whether sticker is worth it even at Penn (I personally think it is). Cornell/GULC are pretty safe to say bad options at sticker, despite the fact that they're T14. IMHO.


Not a bad post overall, but am getting pretty tired of this distinction. I do not think I would have paid sticker at either Penn or Cornell, but the risk is essentially the same. Most people at either school have some shot at big law. A certain percentage at each school will not get it. I am not sure the calculus changes that much based on a few percentage points. I don't really understand the reasoning "I will risk 200+K for a 47% chance at Biglaw, but I have to draw the line at 42%." (note: I know these are not the exact numbers, but the difference is somewhere in that ballpark).


I dont know if it is a few point difference between WUSTL/uiuc and Cornell.... the ranking difference might be just a couple of spots, but placement is a day n night difference... not to be confused with kid cuddi's song....

More like mid 40s% vs 20%.......

Even if you get a full ride that is still close to 40k you will need to take out in loans. 40k vs 160k. One will give you a better chance to pay it back than the other.....

The problem with law is that you either get the 100k+ jobs, 30k job or no job. There is a much high chance of the latter two at Wustl/uiuc....

whymeohgodno
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Re: Money at T30

Postby whymeohgodno » Sat Nov 06, 2010 4:20 pm

hellojd wrote:
thexfactor wrote:i think sticker at cornell is better than half scholarship at wustl/bc/bu level. I think it s even when you get to full scholarship.

Cornell doubles your chances of getting biglaw/meaningful job as compared to wustl/bc/bu/emory......

There is a huge gap between T14 vandy and WUSTL/fordham/bu/bc/gw....

Ive heard ghost stories of people at cornell getting biglaw from median and below. I ve been specifically told that you need top 1/3 at wustl to be competitive for OCI.


Not sure I'd agree with this advice. Sticker at Cornell means that you'd really have to get a solid Biglaw job or you're financially screwed. A half or 3/4 scholly at wustl gives you much more flexibility, expecially since your home market is in the not as saturated midwest market, as opposed to NYC, where you'd have to compete with, well, everyone ranked higher than you more or less.

Besides, the prospects for the median or below Cornell grad aren't looking too great right now - you'll have a lot of people on this board debating about whether sticker is worth it even at Penn (I personally think it is). Cornell/GULC are pretty safe to say bad options at sticker, despite the fact that they're T14. IMHO.


A half ride to WUSTL will still leave you 110k+ in debt with a sub 20% chance at finding biglaw.

Sticker at Cornell leaves you 200k in debt with a 40%+ chance at finding biglaw.

I wouldn't say one is that much better than the other.

r6_philly
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Re: Money at T30

Postby r6_philly » Sat Nov 06, 2010 4:33 pm

If you want to be quantitative, do a cost benefit analysis using available data. Calculate the ratio between present value of tuition paid to present value of potential future earning (using reported averagess). Because the big law percentage is lower at the lower ranked school, the average earning power at graduation is certainly less (because median starting biglaw is 160k across the board). Then pick the average interest rate as the time discount rate, and do an analysis for 1 year, 5 year, 10 year out and see how it comes out. That's how businesses make decisions between options FWIW.

ETA, with that calculation, you can estimate how much the the cost needs to be reduced to justify the lower earning power. I am planning to use this to compare offers.




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