4.19, 170 - Advice?

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andrew1024
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4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby andrew1024 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:01 am

I expected to get ~165 on the October test. An hour ago, I found out I got a 170. I haven't really planned for this - it might open up more possibilities than I had considered before - and I'm looking for advice. I know I can see likelihoods of where I can get into on various sites by entering my info, but I'd like to hear the infinite wisdom of TLS.

170
4.19 from a good public school
Non-URM
Good softs (but not "saved the children of Haiti with the UN" good)
average PS?
2 strong LORs

A couple questions:
- What are the best schools I can "safely" count on getting into?
- Which of those schools are likely to offer me the most money?
- Any thoughts on attending a school on full scholarship vs. a T14 (or any top tier) with no money?

I would prefer California, but I'm keeping my options open. I had been looking at UC Davis and Hastings back when I expected a 165. Maybe look at Berkeley/UCLA now?
Last edited by andrew1024 on Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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BioEBear2010
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby BioEBear2010 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:03 am

In at both Boalt and UCLA (with $$$). Those are arguably YHS numbers.

mlee85
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby mlee85 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:44 am

you have nothing to lose by applying to the entire t14 and wherever else you choose to apply to.

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andrew1024
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby andrew1024 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 3:18 am

Thanks for the advice so far. Any thoughts on attending a lower-ranked school with a lot of money? Let's say, University of San Diego with a generous scholarship offer (or any other lower-ranked school) vs. a private T14 without money. Let's say the total difference over three years would approach $100k.

I know a lot of top graduates from top schools are struggling to find employment. So the prospect of getting a respectable (if not prestigious) law degree without debt is pretty appealing. I realize I would be locked into a certain region, but that may or may not be a problem for me. Any thoughts on that?

rui
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby rui » Sat Oct 30, 2010 3:28 am

You should apply to every school in the T14 you're even remotely interested in attending, as soon as possible, and make a decision after you see what you have in front of you. I wouldn't go any lower, even for a free ride, but that's just me.

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veragood
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby veragood » Sat Oct 30, 2010 3:28 am

There's definitely something to be said for it. It's a hard choice. In an idealized world, I guess it would be like choosing between ~$160k/year with $100k in debt, or ~$110k/year with barely any debt. I mean, that's just starting, too.

On one hand, the prestigious degree is.. well, prestigious. There's something to be said for self-confidence, the way people react to you, when you go to a T14 school. It's all very haughty and materialistic and slightly evil, of course, but it's true.

Don't really have an answer for you, I guess.

nleefer
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby nleefer » Sat Oct 30, 2010 3:44 am

Apply to the T14, you'll get money from some. There's no good reason not to go to a top school with those numbers. Getting biglaw from a top school right now is basically a coin flip, and below that your chances are not good unless you finish near the top of the class. If you don't care about biglaw that's a slightly different issue.

But, keep in mind there's basically no such thing as a $110k job right out of law school.
See: http://abovethelaw.com/2010/07/nalp-giv ... er-salary/

BeachedBrit
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby BeachedBrit » Sat Oct 30, 2010 5:45 am

I'd try Stanford too.

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Mike12188
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby Mike12188 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 5:56 am

I'm jealous. My LSAT is a point higher though....but your GPA is literally a whole point higher than mine :oops: lol. But, Congrats OP. You should def. be looking at money from T14 I wouldn't consider anything lower than UCLA with $$.

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invisiblesun
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby invisiblesun » Sat Oct 30, 2010 7:05 am

Definitely try Stanford. LSN shows that even at 170 Stanford is waitlisting/accepting a ton of people above 3.9. I would argue that you should definitely aim higher than UC San Diego, as you will likely get generous scholarships from schools like UCLA and perhaps even a lower T10. You'll have a great shot at Boalt and a good shot at any school (with the possible exceptions of HY).

Nleefer, although there isn't a major clustering around the 110k range, T14 grads who miss BigLaw still often have an easier time finding MidLaw jobs that pay 100-140k when compared to lower T25 grads.

Also, to the OP: congrats on the impressive GPA! If you don't mind sharing, what was your major?

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existenz
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby existenz » Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:23 am

Apply everywhere. That GPA is insane.

I don't know how you were doing on PTs and whether you have room for improvement, but I'd consider retaking if you want to improve your shot at Yale.

You'll get into a bunch of T14s with those stats if you apply now. You'll also be offered half-tuition or more at many of them. Congrats.
Last edited by existenz on Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

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JazzOne
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby JazzOne » Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:24 am

Retake

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joeshmo39
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby joeshmo39 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:27 am

Just to be crystal clear I don't think you would want want to take money from lower ranked schools. You'll have to wait until it's all in front of you, but the money Berkley and UCLA will give you will probably be enough to justify the reduced rate at those schools as opposed to paying 0 at UCSD.

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Mike12188
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby Mike12188 » Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:35 am

joeshmo39 wrote:Just to be crystal clear I don't think you would want want to take money from lower ranked schools. You'll have to wait until it's all in front of you, but the money Berkley and UCLA will give you will probably be enough to justify the reduced rate at those schools as opposed to paying 0 at UCSD.


+1. I would def pay to have my chances of landing a job greatly increased by attending Berkley or UCLA

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andrew1024
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby andrew1024 » Sun Oct 31, 2010 2:05 am

invisiblesun wrote:Also, to the OP: congrats on the impressive GPA! If you don't mind sharing, what was your major?


Political Science with IR focus.

existenz wrote:I don't know how you were doing on PTs and whether you have room for improvement, but I'd consider retaking if you want to improve your shot at Yale.


170 was above my average on PTs. If I really devoted to studying I could probably improve a bit more (my scores were trending upward). But honestly, I'm more than satisfied with a lower T14, especially with $. Before the scores were released I was seriously considering schools like Hastings. Now, according to LSAC's applicant profile, they would likely reject me because my score is slightly too high.

Aggiegrad2011
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Re: 4.19, 170 - Advice?

Postby Aggiegrad2011 » Sun Oct 31, 2010 3:11 am

No reason not to blanket the entirety of the T14 and see where the money comes from with those numbers. I bet some of the lower T14 will throw you a lot of money since you'll do great things for their median and 75th percentiles.

Retaking a 170 seems foolish to me, especially this late in the cycle. A December LSAT for a 1 or 2 point improvement when you could have probably been rendered decisions at fantastic schools like CCN and the the rest of the bunch seems foolhardy, particularly because 170 was ABOVE your average on PTs.




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