Online AA ..gained in a war zone

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Jessecitrus
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Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby Jessecitrus » Mon Apr 26, 2010 8:18 pm

I received my associate’s degree at an online university while serving in Iraq. I am finishing my Bachelors at a tier 4 University. I have a 3.89 GPA, and have taken 15 practice LSATs with scores ranging from 165-169. Have my undergraduate schools made admission to a top law school impossible? Or will the fact that I attained a high GPA while in a war zone be seen favorably? What are my chances at a top 5 school?

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im_blue
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby im_blue » Mon Apr 26, 2010 8:25 pm

If you're a non-URM, you're going to need at least a 169-171 LSAT for top 5.

colemf
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby colemf » Mon Apr 26, 2010 8:26 pm

No school is going to care about where you did your UG at, that said they are also not going to care very much that you were in Iraq, if you can do well on your lsat (165-169) you will have a decent shoot at just about every school outside the T14.

rando
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby rando » Mon Apr 26, 2010 8:36 pm

Actually. I think being in a war zone may be one of the few softs that may actually make a meaningful difference.

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im_blue
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby im_blue » Mon Apr 26, 2010 8:39 pm

rando wrote:Actually. I think being in a war zone may be one of the few softs that may actually make a meaningful difference.

Not to the extent that a 3.89/165-169 gets into top 5, especially since most people drop a few points from their PTs.

rando
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby rando » Mon Apr 26, 2010 8:43 pm

im_blue wrote:
rando wrote:Actually. I think being in a war zone may be one of the few softs that may actually make a meaningful difference.

Not to the extent that a 3.89/165-169 gets into top 5, especially since most people drop a few points from their PTs.


True. Though I would hardly be shocked at 3.89/169 getting in.

colemf
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby colemf » Mon Apr 26, 2010 8:57 pm

OP your best chance (Assuming you get a 165-169) would be to make your personal statement all about studying and completing your degree in a war zone.

Jessecitrus
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby Jessecitrus » Mon Apr 26, 2010 9:14 pm

What are the best "softs" to have anyway? I am the first person in my family to attend college, overcame tremendous poverty etc.. How many points is a well written personal statement worth?

ncct07
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby ncct07 » Mon Apr 26, 2010 9:23 pm

Here's a fellow combat veteran...Stanford liked what they saw:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Black6Delta/jd

And another:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Rawlsian

And one more for good measure:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/gtbubblehead

Good luck!

Jessecitrus
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby Jessecitrus » Mon Apr 26, 2010 9:42 pm

ncct07 wrote:Here's a fellow combat veteran...Stanford liked what they saw:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Black6Delta/jd

And another:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Rawlsian

And one more for good measure:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/gtbubblehead

Good luck!

Thanks that is helpful. esp the first link.. very similar numbers. If I can just push my lsat up a few more points!

ncct07
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby ncct07 » Mon Apr 26, 2010 9:59 pm

Jessecitrus wrote:... very similar numbers. If I can just push my lsat up a few more points!


I think it's important to note the application dates....no doubt it helped the applicant tremendously.

Moral of the story: An early application is ALWAYS better

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big_blue79
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby big_blue79 » Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:44 pm

Probably late to this party, but I got my Bachelors from AMU (online), and, while my cycle isn't perfect, I got into some good schools. I don't think it's a huge deal outside of Yale/Stanford/Harvard/Berkeley. Maybe Chicago.

the lantern
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby the lantern » Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:46 pm

If you look closely at LSN, you'll see a lot of people who went to online schools fared drastically worse than those who didn't with the same numbers. Many of these people earned their degrees while in the military and it didn't help them. Since you have half your schooling at a real college, maybe they'll look past it, but an online degree undermines a lot of your GPA's cred.

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bceagles182
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby bceagles182 » Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:58 pm

Write your PS about your experiences in Iraq. I imagine that would grab their attention.

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Drew2010
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby Drew2010 » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:01 pm

boo jersey shore wrote:I'm a combat vet who got in nowhere my numbers wouldn't have gotten me in anyway. Take it fwiw.


same, I didn't think it helped, at least not this year...

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dlac
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby dlac » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:06 pm

I can't believe nobody's asked, but did you experience any difficulty/hardship/obstacle during said time in Iraq that would distinguish you considerably? Sometimes all it takes is an intriguing hook presented in eloquent prose to catch someone's eye. For instance, a story from a former dean of admissions was of a guy who was a Chechnyan rebel. The opening of his personal statement vividly described the flight of a flaming molotov through the air as he lobbed it onto a tank.

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amputatedbrain
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby amputatedbrain » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:35 pm

Hey OP, I'm Black6Delta from LSN. The military soft is just that . . . a fairly powerful soft. But you have to know how to sell it, it's not good enough to sell itself. IMO, perfecting your PS is crucial to getting max benefit out of your service. The military and my Iraq experience was the formative experience in my life, and consequently, a huge part of my application package. As you can see, I greatly overperformed my numbers. There are few aspects of my military service that were a bit out of the ordinary (PM if you're curious), but I think military service, and achieving academically during it, is looked on very favorably.

03121202698008
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby 03121202698008 » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:36 pm

OP, I got into several T14 and will start Michigan with a BA/MA obtained from AMU online while deployed.

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amputatedbrain
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby amputatedbrain » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:43 pm

bceagles182 wrote:Write your PS about your experiences in Iraq. I imagine that would grab their attention.


I would be cautious about this. Not that it can't be a great idea, but there are a lot more OIF/OEF vets out there applying to law schools than you might think. After almost a decade of war, there are hundreds of thousands of vets who come back, go to undergrad, and many who apply to law school. There are many cliche Iraq-vet PS topics that you have to make sure you don't fall into. The worst one I've seen several times is the "I saw how lawless Iraq/Afghanistan was and it made me realize how important legal procedure/lawyers are."
Like I said in my previous post, the military soft is great tool, but it's not great enough to carry you without context the same way hard numbers will. If you craft a compelling narrative around it, it can really work wonders I believe.


I also sent my applications in within a week of them becoming available. I'm not sure how much it helped since most of my reaches took 5-6 months to reach a decision anyway, but it can't hurt, and you definitely don't want to wait too long.

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amputatedbrain
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby amputatedbrain » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:49 pm

blhoward2 wrote:OP, I got into several T14 and will start Michigan with a BA/MA obtained from AMU online while deployed.


Also, Air Force deployments don't count :D

03121202698008
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby 03121202698008 » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:00 pm

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Last edited by 03121202698008 on Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

03121202698008
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Re: Online AA ..gained in a war zone

Postby 03121202698008 » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:02 pm

amputatedbrain wrote:
bceagles182 wrote:Write your PS about your experiences in Iraq. I imagine that would grab their attention.


I would be cautious about this. Not that it can't be a great idea, but there are a lot more OIF/OEF vets out there applying to law schools than you might think. After almost a decade of war, there are hundreds of thousands of vets who come back, go to undergrad, and many who apply to law school. There are many cliche Iraq-vet PS topics that you have to make sure you don't fall into. The worst one I've seen several times is the "I saw how lawless Iraq/Afghanistan was and it made me realize how important legal procedure/lawyers are."
Like I said in my previous post, the military soft is great tool, but it's not great enough to carry you without context the same way hard numbers will. If you craft a compelling narrative around it, it can really work wonders I believe.


I also sent my applications in within a week of them becoming available. I'm not sure how much it helped since most of my reaches took 5-6 months to reach a decision anyway, but it can't hurt, and you definitely don't want to wait too long.


I agree with this. Sell your military service on your resume and in your PS if you can incorporate it. Don't write a typical "There I was in Iraq...". Adcomms have read these a million times. I even read somewhere where Adcomms specifically mentioned not doing it.




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