If you were me, would you retake?

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sven
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If you were me, would you retake?

Postby sven » Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:44 pm

Hi, all.

I've been having doubts about whether or not it's worth it to retake the LSAT...

Here's the rundown:
I have a 3.9+ GPA from a good university. And a 168 on the LSAT.
As for softs, I have average UG softs, plus an English-teaching Fulbrigt grant in an Asian country and a year of experience as a paralegal at a big NYC firm.

I want to stay in NYC so I would ideally want to go to NYU or Columbia, and obviously, I would love one of HYS, too. Those are really the only schools I would want to pay full price for... Do you think it's worth the effort to study for this test again if I can probably ED to NYU and get in? Or should I try to take full advantage of my almost universally-above-the-75th-percentile GPA and retake the test so that I have a shot at Columbia and HYS (even though they all average anyway)?

PS: I'm applying next cycle regardless of whether or not I decide to retake.

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dresden doll
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby dresden doll » Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:45 pm

RETAKE./end thread.

sven
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby sven » Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:47 pm

Hahah. Even if I don't think I can hit above a 173 or so, and all the schools that I would be aiming to increase my chances at average multiple scores?

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dresden doll
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby dresden doll » Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:51 pm

sven wrote:Hahah. Even if I don't think I can hit above a 173 or so, and all the schools that I would be aiming to increase my chances at average multiple scores?


173 >>>>>> 168, especially with that solid of a GPA. Retake, seriously. A 170+ will in all likelihood do wonders for your cycle.

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im_blue
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby im_blue » Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:53 pm

With a 3.9+, you should aim for a 170 to be safe for NYU and a 171 for Columbia. NYU has taken 3.9+/168 applicants with good softs, so it's not impossible if you don't retake, either.

sven
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby sven » Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:57 pm

im_blue wrote:With a 3.9+, you should aim for a 170 to be safe for NYU and a 171 for Columbia. NYU has taken 3.9+/168 applicants with good softs, so it's not impossible if you don't retake, either.


Would my softs be considered good? I'm particulalry referring to the fulbright.. all my friends seem to think that's all i need to overcome my sub-25th percentile LSAT.

edit: Also, do you mean I should aim for a 170 on a retake, or a 172 due to averaging?

Marisa5252
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby Marisa5252 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:32 am

sven wrote:
im_blue wrote:With a 3.9+, you should aim for a 170 to be safe for NYU and a 171 for Columbia. NYU has taken 3.9+/168 applicants with good softs, so it's not impossible if you don't retake, either.


Would my softs be considered good? I'm particulalry referring to the fulbright.. all my friends seem to think that's all i need to overcome my sub-25th percentile LSAT.

edit: Also, do you mean I should aim for a 170 on a retake, or a 172 due to averaging?



um...aim for 180

not to say you NEED a 180 but obviously you should never be "aiming" for less than that... a 170>>168 and a 172>>>170

09042014
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:33 am

dresden doll wrote:RETAKE./end thread.

thisguy456
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby thisguy456 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:43 am

I am in almost exactly the same situation as the OP, and conventional wisdom is obviously RETAKE. What are the risks though of getting a lower score? Say you've taken all the PTs, and your LSAT score was maybe 1-2 points below your PT average. Should you get back in gear and spend another 5-6 months studying and then retake?

hitmon33
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby hitmon33 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:45 am

Do schools discriminate if one retakes and scores lower than the original score?

Say OP retakes, scores a 166. Would that hurt him or have little effect?

09042014
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:46 am

thisguy456 wrote:I am in almost exactly the same situation as the OP, and conventional wisdom is obviously RETAKE. What are the risks though of getting a lower score? Say you've taken all the PTs, and your LSAT score was maybe 1-2 points below your PT average. Should you get back in gear and spend another 5-6 months studying and then retake?


You'll need to give specifics. If you were averaging 174 and got a 172 then no. If you were averaging 170 and got a 168 then probably but don't take it in 5-6 months. Take it in June.

09042014
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:48 am

hitmon33 wrote:Do schools discriminate if one retakes and scores lower than the original score?

Say OP retakes, scores a 166. Would that hurt him or have little effect?


Some schools it will hurt, but most don't care. The lower you go the less they will care. Below CCN and I don't think it will hurt at all.

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ogman05
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby ogman05 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:54 am

Desert Fox wrote:
thisguy456 wrote:I am in almost exactly the same situation as the OP, and conventional wisdom is obviously RETAKE. What are the risks though of getting a lower score? Say you've taken all the PTs, and your LSAT score was maybe 1-2 points below your PT average. Should you get back in gear and spend another 5-6 months studying and then retake?


You'll need to give specifics. If you were averaging 174 and got a 172 then no. If you were averaging 170 and got a 168 then probably but don't take it in 5-6 months. Take it in June.


Wouldnt 5-6 months be June?

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scribelaw
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby scribelaw » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:56 am

sven wrote:Hahah. Even if I don't think I can hit above a 173 or so, and all the schools that I would be aiming to increase my chances at average multiple scores?


Who averages multiple scores?

09042014
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:57 am

ogman05 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
thisguy456 wrote:I am in almost exactly the same situation as the OP, and conventional wisdom is obviously RETAKE. What are the risks though of getting a lower score? Say you've taken all the PTs, and your LSAT score was maybe 1-2 points below your PT average. Should you get back in gear and spend another 5-6 months studying and then retake?


You'll need to give specifics. If you were averaging 174 and got a 172 then no. If you were averaging 170 and got a 168 then probably but don't take it in 5-6 months. Take it in June.


Wouldnt 5-6 months be June?


More like 4.5 months.

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ogman05
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby ogman05 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:00 am

Desert Fox wrote:
ogman05 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
thisguy456 wrote:I am in almost exactly the same situation as the OP, and conventional wisdom is obviously RETAKE. What are the risks though of getting a lower score? Say you've taken all the PTs, and your LSAT score was maybe 1-2 points below your PT average. Should you get back in gear and spend another 5-6 months studying and then retake?


You'll need to give specifics. If you were averaging 174 and got a 172 then no. If you were averaging 170 and got a 168 then probably but don't take it in 5-6 months. Take it in June.


Wouldnt 5-6 months be June?


More like 4.5 months.


tru tru. closer to 5 though. 8)
Last edited by ogman05 on Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

thisguy456
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby thisguy456 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:00 am

Desert Fox wrote:
thisguy456 wrote:I am in almost exactly the same situation as the OP, and conventional wisdom is obviously RETAKE. What are the risks though of getting a lower score? Say you've taken all the PTs, and your LSAT score was maybe 1-2 points below your PT average. Should you get back in gear and spend another 5-6 months studying and then retake?


You'll need to give specifics. If you were averaging 174 and got a 172 then no. If you were averaging 170 and got a 168 then probably but don't take it in 5-6 months. Take it in June.


Not meant to hijack original post, but like the OP I have a 168, 3.9. My average was maybe a 169-170, with not too much deviation from the average. So it's not retake AND score better, it's retake and MAYBE score 1-2 points higher. It's also retake and MAYBE score 1-2 points lower.

I'm abroad now, which will make it a little difficult to study and put as much effort into it as I did the first time.

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ogman05
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby ogman05 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:03 am

168 is a great score. If you need to get into HYSCCN or bust then apply this cycle and see what happens (maybe consider ED). If not or that doesnt work evaluate your PT average and retake if it is higher or you can make it higher. Other then that if really need to go to above, ED. Good luck peeps

09042014
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:07 am

thisguy456 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
thisguy456 wrote:I am in almost exactly the same situation as the OP, and conventional wisdom is obviously RETAKE. What are the risks though of getting a lower score? Say you've taken all the PTs, and your LSAT score was maybe 1-2 points below your PT average. Should you get back in gear and spend another 5-6 months studying and then retake?


You'll need to give specifics. If you were averaging 174 and got a 172 then no. If you were averaging 170 and got a 168 then probably but don't take it in 5-6 months. Take it in June.


Not meant to hijack original post, but like the OP I have a 168, 3.9. My average was maybe a 169-170, with not too much deviation from the average. So it's not retake AND score better, it's retake and MAYBE score 1-2 points higher. It's also retake and MAYBE score 1-2 points lower.

I'm abroad now, which will make it a little difficult to study and put as much effort into it as I did the first time.


Have you already applied? Or are you applying next year?

If you already applied, I'd wait it out to see how your cycle goes. You've got a good shot at Penn, UVa, NU, Cornell, and Duke. If you end up getting WL'd take June to get off it.

If you are applying next year, I'd only retake if you can study 10 hours a week to keep your skills sharp.

sven
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby sven » Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:18 pm

OP here. So I actually took the test last June, so while I'm not starting from scratch, I do have to start studying again to get back into the swing of things. I had mostly been preptesting at a pretty consistent 170-172 and never really got below a 169 except for one or two preptests. This means that I can't expect to do too much better than I had already done, but I don't expect to do worse. I mean, I'll just cancel if I feel unsure about it.

Regarding my softs, though, would they be considered strong enough to get me a serious shot at HYSC even if I only improve to from my 168 to a 170?

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MahaloMontana
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby MahaloMontana » Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:27 pm

sven wrote:OP here. So I actually took the test last June, so while I'm not starting from scratch, I do have to start studying again to get back into the swing of things. I had mostly been preptesting at a pretty consistent 170-172 and never really got below a 169 except for one or two preptests. This means that I can't expect to do too much better than I had already done, but I don't expect to do worse. I mean, I'll just cancel if I feel unsure about it.

Regarding my softs, though, would they be considered strong enough to get me a serious shot at HYSC even if I only improve to from my 168 to a 170?


Just FYI: Last June's test was an anomaly. Everyone I know who took in June (myself included) ended up with scores _way_ lower than they were practicing at and went up about 7-10 points when they re-took in September. It's normal to go up a little bit when you retake, but not that much. So unless next June's test is crazy like last June's, you should do well.

sven
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby sven » Mon Jan 25, 2010 5:19 pm

redhead77 wrote:
sven wrote:OP here. So I actually took the test last June, so while I'm not starting from scratch, I do have to start studying again to get back into the swing of things. I had mostly been preptesting at a pretty consistent 170-172 and never really got below a 169 except for one or two preptests. This means that I can't expect to do too much better than I had already done, but I don't expect to do worse. I mean, I'll just cancel if I feel unsure about it.

Regarding my softs, though, would they be considered strong enough to get me a serious shot at HYSC even if I only improve to from my 168 to a 170?


Just FYI: Last June's test was an anomaly. Everyone I know who took in June (myself included) ended up with scores _way_ lower than they were practicing at and went up about 7-10 points when they re-took in September. It's normal to go up a little bit when you retake, but not that much. So unless next June's test is crazy like last June's, you should do well.


I'm just afraid that the normal slight-bump on a retake is due to taking the test again soon after you had taken it the first time. In my case, I'm a year removed from my first sitting (which I had prepped for with a class) and I'm abroad now so I'm not exactly going to be living and breathing the LSAT until June...

Anyway, can someone address this:
sven wrote:Regarding my softs, though, would they be considered strong enough to get me a serious shot at HYSC even if I only improve to from my 168 to a 170?

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im_blue
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby im_blue » Mon Jan 25, 2010 7:18 pm

sven wrote:
redhead77 wrote:
sven wrote:OP here. So I actually took the test last June, so while I'm not starting from scratch, I do have to start studying again to get back into the swing of things. I had mostly been preptesting at a pretty consistent 170-172 and never really got below a 169 except for one or two preptests. This means that I can't expect to do too much better than I had already done, but I don't expect to do worse. I mean, I'll just cancel if I feel unsure about it.

Regarding my softs, though, would they be considered strong enough to get me a serious shot at HYSC even if I only improve to from my 168 to a 170?


Just FYI: Last June's test was an anomaly. Everyone I know who took in June (myself included) ended up with scores _way_ lower than they were practicing at and went up about 7-10 points when they re-took in September. It's normal to go up a little bit when you retake, but not that much. So unless next June's test is crazy like last June's, you should do well.


I'm just afraid that the normal slight-bump on a retake is due to taking the test again soon after you had taken it the first time. In my case, I'm a year removed from my first sitting (which I had prepped for with a class) and I'm abroad now so I'm not exactly going to be living and breathing the LSAT until June...

Anyway, can someone address this:
sven wrote:Regarding my softs, though, would they be considered strong enough to get me a serious shot at HYSC even if I only improve to from my 168 to a 170?


Your softs are strong enough to have a chance at Stanford and Columbia with a 3.9+/170, but not HY.

sven
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby sven » Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:31 pm

Thanks! Anyone else have an opinion?

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MC Southstar
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Re: If you were me, would you retake?

Postby MC Southstar » Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:32 pm

Yes.

I only read your two numbers. I don't care about the rest.




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