3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

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shock259
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3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby shock259 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:32 pm

Hi everyone,

There are so many numbers/opinions out there that it is sometimes difficult to get a sense of where it is possible to gain admission. I recently applied to 18 different schools across the country. I've used Lawschoolpredictor and Chiashu, but gotten different perceptions on whether or not I will gain admission to many of them. I seem to gravitate between believing I'll get into all and believing I won't get into any. I do not have a particular affinity for a region or area to go to school/practice in. I simply want to get the best education I can for the time being.

For the record, I got a 3.40, 161, and am a non-URM applying straight out of grad school. I also put in my apps in the last few days (very late - I know).

These are the schools. I've also included the LSP percentages, for what they are worth. What do you guys think? Too many safeties? Too few? Too many reaches? Too few? Any suggestions for others to apply to?

Arizona State - 52%
Emory - 5%
American - 51%
Colorado - 30%
Tulane - 41%
Santa Clara - 65%
Villanova - 46%
Brooklyn - 29%
University of Oregon - 68%
UConn - 59%
University of Richmond - 58%
St John's - 61%
Seattle - 71%
University of Denver - 64%
SMU Dedman - 47%
Wake Forest - 36%
Penn State - 68%
San Diego - 60%

am060459
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby am060459 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:35 pm

if money isnt an issue add the following (although its kinda late in the cycle):

Indiana - Bloomington
Iowa
Alabama
Ohio State
Wisconsin

edit: can you retake? if so then wait til next cycle. a few points higher and you can make it into T30.

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scribelaw
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby scribelaw » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:36 pm

You'd have a good shot at Florida State.

shock259
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby shock259 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:10 pm

Retaking is on the table, but I am hoping I can get at the bottom of T1 or top/middle T2 without retaking. I suppose if I don't get into the schools I mentioned, I will most certainly be retaking. In the mean time, I figured there isn't any harm in applying to a lot of schools right now, then deciding if I get accepted.

Thanks for the school suggestions. I'll check them out.

shock259
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby shock259 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:44 pm

Applied to Florida State. I think I'll give Ohio State a shot, although it looks like it would be a stretch.

Any insight into my chances for the schools listed? I guess I need to realize how to be a bit more patient.

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gatorlion
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby gatorlion » Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:49 pm

shock259 wrote:Hi everyone,

There are so many numbers/opinions out there that it is sometimes difficult to get a sense of where it is possible to gain admission. I recently applied to 18 different schools across the country. I've used Lawschoolpredictor and Chiashu, but gotten different perceptions on whether or not I will gain admission to many of them. I seem to gravitate between believing I'll get into all and believing I won't get into any. I do not have a particular affinity for a region or area to go to school/practice in. I simply want to get the best education I can for the time being.

For the record, I got a 3.40, 161, and am a non-URM applying straight out of grad school. I also put in my apps in the last few days (very late - I know).

These are the schools. I've also included the LSP percentages, for what they are worth. What do you guys think? Too many safeties? Too few? Too many reaches? Too few? Any suggestions for others to apply to?

Arizona State - 52%
Emory - 5%
American - 51%
Colorado - 30%
Tulane - 41%
Santa Clara - 65%
Villanova - 46%
Brooklyn - 29%
University of Oregon - 68%
UConn - 59%
University of Richmond - 58%
St John's - 61%
Seattle - 71%
University of Denver - 64%
SMU Dedman - 47%
Wake Forest - 36%
Penn State - 68%
San Diego - 60%


So by "straight out of grad school" you mean no time in between UG and grad (i.e. work experience)?

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T_Easy
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby T_Easy » Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:52 pm

If you applied to Florida State, you should DEFINITELY apply to the University of Georgia.

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patrickd139
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby patrickd139 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:55 pm

shock259 wrote:Arizona State - 52% WL-In
Emory - 5% Out
American - 51% Out
Colorado - 30% Out
Tulane - 41% Out
Santa Clara - 65% In
Villanova - 46% WL-In
Brooklyn - 29% Out
University of Oregon - 68% In
UConn - 59% Out (The numbers on this are a bit skewed b/c they combine day and night divisions to reach the 25/75 on LSAT)
University of Richmond - 58% In
St John's - 61% In
Seattle - 71% In
University of Denver - 64% In
SMU Dedman - 47% Out
Wake Forest - 36% Out
Penn State - 68% In
San Diego - 60% In


See bolded for predictions. In all, you seem to be in a similar position I was when choosing law school (detached, good education, etc.). I would look at it this way, if you got in, would you go to that school? If no, don't apply. If yes, apply (cost permitting).

Additional schools to apply to: OU, University of Houston, Baylor (for $$) and the schools listed above.

HTH.

shock259
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Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:30 am

Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby shock259 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:57 pm

Oops, grad. Straight out of undergrad.

I've been working during school about 15-20 hours/week since sophomore year and have interned with a non-profit that promotes international law, but I don't have professional full-time work experience.

I'll look into Georgia as well.

Thanks!

arundodonax
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby arundodonax » Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:45 am

You'll be fine.

That being said, spend more time thinking about where you want to live for at least the next 5-10+ years. I know this is tough coming out of undergrad, but be sure to think as far into the future as possible. What does the long term look like? Are you looking for a spouse? If you have kids, will it be helpful to be near grandma so that she can babysit? Can you stand the weather? Are you sure you can stand X city for the rest of your life? These are not questions I would want to be answering after just graduating college, nonetheless, I think they are important to at least have in the back of your mind while making this decision. Jot down all the life possibilities on paper and then make sure your school choices accommodate your long-term non-work-related personal needs and wants.

It seems a T1-2 law degree will not allow much flexibility with relocation, as institution familiarity plays a big part in who will hire you. 90% of those of us who will not be attending T20 schools will be, in all likelihood, working near where we go to school.
Last edited by arundodonax on Wed Jan 20, 2010 1:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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mhd08
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby mhd08 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:57 am

shock259 wrote:Hi everyone,

There are so many numbers/opinions out there that it is sometimes difficult to get a sense of where it is possible to gain admission. I recently applied to 18 different schools across the country. I've used Lawschoolpredictor and Chiashu, but gotten different perceptions on whether or not I will gain admission to many of them. I seem to gravitate between believing I'll get into all and believing I won't get into any. I do not have a particular affinity for a region or area to go to school/practice in. I simply want to get the best education I can for the time being.

For the record, I got a 3.40, 161, and am a non-URM applying straight out of grad school. I also put in my apps in the last few days (very late - I know).

These are the schools. I've also included the LSP percentages, for what they are worth. What do you guys think? Too many safeties? Too few? Too many reaches? Too few? Any suggestions for others to apply to?

Arizona State - 52%
Emory - 5%
American - 51%
Colorado - 30%
Tulane - 41%
Santa Clara - 65%
Villanova - 46%
Brooklyn - 29%
University of Oregon - 68%
UConn - 59%
University of Richmond - 58%
St John's - 61%
Seattle - 71%
University of Denver - 64%
SMU Dedman - 47%
Wake Forest - 36%
Penn State - 68%
San Diego - 60%



OP, I have the same stats as you and have been rejected from Colorado and American. You may have better softs than me, but I wouldn't get your hopes up for those two. My list is pretty similar to yours, but I also applied to IU- Bloomington and Lewis & Clark. If you're interested in Oregon I would definitely check out L&C (it's ranked a little better than Oregon). Temple is also another good option.

shock259
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Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:30 am

Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby shock259 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:15 am

Thanks for the predictions! I'm feeling much better. I'm not sure why I even applied to Colorado, other than I am from there and was hoping for some kind of miracle.

Also: thanks for the thoughtful post on where to live! It is a reality of a T2 school that I can't quite shake. My mentality has been apply everywhere, get in somewhere, then do some soul searching and decide which region of the country I want to live in. I'm also a JAG hopeful, depending on how well classes go.

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mhd08
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby mhd08 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:49 pm

patrickd139 wrote:
shock259 wrote:Arizona State - 52% WL-In
Emory - 5% Out
American - 51% Out
Colorado - 30% Out
Tulane - 41% Out
Santa Clara - 65% In
Villanova - 46% WL-In
Brooklyn - 29% Out
University of Oregon - 68% In
UConn - 59% Out (The numbers on this are a bit skewed b/c they combine day and night divisions to reach the 25/75 on LSAT)
University of Richmond - 58% In
St John's - 61% In
Seattle - 71% In
University of Denver - 64% In
SMU Dedman - 47% Out
Wake Forest - 36% Out
Penn State - 68% In
San Diego - 60% In


See bolded for predictions. In all, you seem to be in a similar position I was when choosing law school (detached, good education, etc.). I would look at it this way, if you got in, would you go to that school? If no, don't apply. If yes, apply (cost permitting).

Additional schools to apply to: OU, University of Houston, Baylor (for $$) and the schools listed above.

HTH.


Just curious, why do you think she's out at UConn? I have the same stats and think I have a decent shot at getting in... their medians are 161/3.38 according to their website. It says their day division 25th/75th GPA is 3.2/3.59, so it seems like 3.39 would be the median for the day division.

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patrickd139
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby patrickd139 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 6:08 pm

mhd08 wrote:Just curious, why do you think she's out at UConn? I have the same stats and think I have a decent shot at getting in... their medians are 161/3.38 according to their website. It says their day division 25th/75th GPA is 3.2/3.59, so it seems like 3.39 would be the median for the day division.


First, OP is applying pretty late in the game. A quick perusal of last year's lsn shows that applicants who applied in January, who were accepted to UConn, were mostly URMs/non-trads with higher LSAT scores or engineering degrees. Almost all of the admitted students with a 161 and comparable GPA applied early.
http://uconn.lawschoolnumbers.com/appli ... order=desc

Second, as a general rule, most successful applicants have numbers above the median in at least one category, if not both. As another across-the-board assumption, my prediction excludes ties to the area (state residency, family lives there, etc.) which tend to be the type of thing which push borderline applicants over the edge.

Pretty specific to the OP's situation, but hth and good luck with your cycle.

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thexfactor
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby thexfactor » Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:28 am

Take a look at Case and Illinois. Illinois would be a good reach.

shock259
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby shock259 » Thu Jan 21, 2010 5:52 pm

This all is going pretty fast: I'm already complete at 5 schools. I'm guessing by mid-March, I will be mostly informed. Does this sound reasonable?

lawhawk
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Re: 3.4, 161 - Did I apply to the right schools?

Postby lawhawk » Thu Jan 21, 2010 5:55 pm

make sure you check sites like LSN to see if there is an "invisible LSAT cutoff" like there is at IU, UGA, and Wake. LSP doesn't take these into consideration and so may be a bit misleading one way or the other.

Apply to Tennessee and Georgia State




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