2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

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Grizz
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby Grizz » Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:24 pm

rwallis wrote:Lazy? Maybe a little. However...

...a 152 puts me in good, realistic standing considering my list of schools. I could study harder, retake and improve my score for the next cycle and shoot for TT schools, but there's no telling that the extra 2-3 points I could accrue (the average improvement for the 150-160 range) would make a huge difference.

All that being said, I think the only thing I can really do is wait and see the decisions for this cycle and retake the exam regardless. Based on that I can decide whether or not to wait until the 2011 cycle.


Do not go to those schools. With the law market the way it is now, you will pay out the nose and probably not get a good job, even if you were at the top of your class. Try to at least get into the best law school in the state you want to practice in. Otherwise, you may be unable to find a job.

Study your ass off. I bet the avg. improvement is only 2-3 points because people in that range are lazy or don't really want to go to law school. The LSAT can be learned. Nut up and do it.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:17 pm

You should probably give some thought to the fact that there are people in the top 10% at T1 law schools who aren't going to get jobs that pay enough to justify the investment/comfortably deal with loan payments.

It's your life and everything, but the obvious advice here is to either retake with the aim of doing considerably better, or find something else to do.

Honestly, I was barely able to justify paying full in-state tuition at a T1. I truly don't see how anyone can consider paying full tuition at a private, or a $30k+/year private T3-4.

thegor1987
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby thegor1987 » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:39 pm

average is good for running in a marathon. but for LSAT/GPA not so much.

I also agree with jawsthegreat, I think it could easily be argued the average college student is lazy.

thegor1987
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby thegor1987 » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:40 pm

OP, will your parents be paying the tuition?

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jawsthegreat
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby jawsthegreat » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:27 am

thegor1987 wrote:average is good for running in a marathon. but for LSAT/GPA not so much.

I also agree with jawsthegreat, I think it could easily be argued the average college student is lazy.


Thanks for the support, I mean think about the person you knew from undergrad who always made Bs and with the occasional C thrown in every other semester. I would be hard pressed to believe that they were not either stupid or lazy.

This argument obviously does not apply if you were a science, engineering, etc major.

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reasonable_man
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby reasonable_man » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:44 am

ITT I laugh as people that are really screwed take shots at someone only slightly more screwed than they are..

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:45 am

reasonable_man wrote:ITT I laugh as people that are really screwed take shots at someone only slightly more screwed than they are..


We're not all completely screwed :lol: Just mostly.

thatguyyouknow
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby thatguyyouknow » Tue Jan 05, 2010 4:50 pm

Just so the original poster doesn't feel so bad...

FP is actually very well respected in NH. NH's largest law firms always recruit from FP and the school's graduates hold many highly respected positions throughout the state. A NH Supreme Court Justice is a graduate of FP. So, a degree from FP will not be looked down upon in NH.

That being said, outside of NH your options will be limited.

NH is great though! I've lived here my entire life and I love it! My advice would be to go to FP if you get accepted.

Good Luck!

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Space_Cowboy
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby Space_Cowboy » Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:01 pm

If you're pissing away your parents money, go for it.

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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby Space_Cowboy » Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:03 pm

reasonable_man wrote:ITT I laugh as people that are really screwed take shots at someone only slightly more screwed than they are..


Yeah, cuz the kids accepted to UVA, NU and Michigan are clearly almost as screwed as the candidate going to a T3/T4

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reasonable_man
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby reasonable_man » Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:09 pm

Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:ITT I laugh as people that are really screwed take shots at someone only slightly more screwed than they are..


Yeah, cuz the kids accepted to UVA, NU and Michigan are clearly almost as screwed as the candidate going to a T3/T4


Missing OCI at a bigname school and finding yourself on the open job market from said bigname school places you in a pretty bad spot. Not as bad as someone from a TTT, but still, a pretty ugly spot. ITE, UVA, NU and UM are not nearly as safe as they used to be.

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Space_Cowboy
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby Space_Cowboy » Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:32 pm

reasonable_man wrote:
Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:ITT I laugh as people that are really screwed take shots at someone only slightly more screwed than they are..


Yeah, cuz the kids accepted to UVA, NU and Michigan are clearly almost as screwed as the candidate going to a T3/T4


Missing OCI at a bigname school and finding yourself on the open job market from said bigname school places you in a pretty bad spot. Not as bad as someone from a TTT, but still, a pretty ugly spot. ITE, UVA, NU and UM are not nearly as safe as they used to be.


I agree. Just saying there's a fair bit of daylight between killself and "pretty ugly spot."

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reasonable_man
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby reasonable_man » Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:34 pm

Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:
Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:ITT I laugh as people that are really screwed take shots at someone only slightly more screwed than they are..


Yeah, cuz the kids accepted to UVA, NU and Michigan are clearly almost as screwed as the candidate going to a T3/T4


Missing OCI at a bigname school and finding yourself on the open job market from said bigname school places you in a pretty bad spot. Not as bad as someone from a TTT, but still, a pretty ugly spot. ITE, UVA, NU and UM are not nearly as safe as they used to be.


I agree. Just saying there's a fair bit of daylight between killself and "pretty ugly spot."


Really? I don't know about that. To be honest, the TTT-grad probably realized about half way through that 60k was his max starter salary.. If he was smart and went out and nailed that down for himself and is not steadily working away, gaining experieince and slowly increasing that salary by 5 or 10k a year, he might actually be better situated than the Michigan grad doing the temp circuit (or worse, nothing) with 200k in loans and no end in sight..

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Space_Cowboy
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby Space_Cowboy » Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:54 pm

reasonable_man wrote:
Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:
Space_Cowboy wrote:
Yeah, cuz the kids accepted to UVA, NU and Michigan are clearly almost as screwed as the candidate going to a T3/T4


Missing OCI at a bigname school and finding yourself on the open job market from said bigname school places you in a pretty bad spot. Not as bad as someone from a TTT, but still, a pretty ugly spot. ITE, UVA, NU and UM are not nearly as safe as they used to be.


I agree. Just saying there's a fair bit of daylight between killself and "pretty ugly spot."


Really? I don't know about that. To be honest, the TTT-grad probably realized about half way through that 60k was his max starter salary.. If he was smart and went out and nailed that down for himself and is not steadily working away, gaining experieince and slowly increasing that salary by 5 or 10k a year, he might actually be better situated than the Michigan grad doing the temp circuit (or worse, nothing) with 200k in loans and no end in sight..


This does not sound like the OP. Making a $100k+ gamble on a T3 diploma based on USNWR's specialty rankings? And on top of that, not recognizing that even if those specialty ranking had SOME value, that outcomes might be drastically different for soft IP job seekers versus counterparts in patent law.

But yes, in a mythical world of the street-savy T3/T4 graduates and clueless T14 grads with $200k in debt, I concede the point. Sadly T3/T4 indebtedness isn't drastically different from peers in the T14.

Image

EDIT: This pre-bust article is still worth a read (http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 0005561381)

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reasonable_man
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby reasonable_man » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:19 pm

Not sure if you've read any of my prior posts, but typically, I take the position you do. I am usually the one cautioning people away from taking on massive debt to attend a TTT. That said, I am the living example of the TTT-Grad that did it right and landed in a good job, so when I see the open bashing gang-up against the low LSAT scorer that was going on in this thread, I feel compelled to take up the other side...

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Space_Cowboy
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby Space_Cowboy » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:26 pm

reasonable_man wrote:Not sure if you've read any of my prior posts, but typically, I take the position you do. I am usually the one cautioning people away from taking on massive debt to attend a TTT. That said, I am the living example of the TTT-Grad that did it right and landed in a good job, so when I see the open bashing gang-up against the low LSAT scorer that was going on in this thread, I feel compelled to take up the other side...


I have. 90% of the time, I find myself agreeing with you. So I was a little shocked that you were defending someone about to choose a T3/T4 diploma based on a ridiculously piss poor rationale. If OP was signing up for the T3/T4 show without the "zOMG T10 in IP" enthusiasm, I'd understand your willingness to defend OP. :D

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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby reasonable_man » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:33 pm

Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:Not sure if you've read any of my prior posts, but typically, I take the position you do. I am usually the one cautioning people away from taking on massive debt to attend a TTT. That said, I am the living example of the TTT-Grad that did it right and landed in a good job, so when I see the open bashing gang-up against the low LSAT scorer that was going on in this thread, I feel compelled to take up the other side...


I have. 90% of the time, I find myself agreeing with you. So I was a little shocked that you were defending someone about to choose a T3/T4 diploma based on a ridiculously piss poor rationale. If OP was signing up for the T3/T4 show without the "zOMG T10 in IP" enthusiasm, I'd understand your willingness to defend OP. :D


Fair enough. The top ten IP rationale is fucking retarded in general. Add to it that its 'soft ip' he is after and its even worse. I just thought some of the posts seemed a bit arrogant. Thats all.

09042014
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby 09042014 » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:39 pm

reasonable_man wrote:
Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:Not sure if you've read any of my prior posts, but typically, I take the position you do. I am usually the one cautioning people away from taking on massive debt to attend a TTT. That said, I am the living example of the TTT-Grad that did it right and landed in a good job, so when I see the open bashing gang-up against the low LSAT scorer that was going on in this thread, I feel compelled to take up the other side...


I have. 90% of the time, I find myself agreeing with you. So I was a little shocked that you were defending someone about to choose a T3/T4 diploma based on a ridiculously piss poor rationale. If OP was signing up for the T3/T4 show without the "zOMG T10 in IP" enthusiasm, I'd understand your willingness to defend OP. :D


Fair enough. The top ten IP rationale is fucking retarded in general. Add to it that its 'soft ip' he is after and its even worse. I just thought some of the posts seemed a bit arrogant. Thats all.


Yea I was being an arrogant son of a bitch, but it was a poor attempt to encourage OP into studying for the LSAT to get into better schools. Probably not a good way to do it.

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Space_Cowboy
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby Space_Cowboy » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:41 pm

reasonable_man wrote:
Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:Not sure if you've read any of my prior posts, but typically, I take the position you do. I am usually the one cautioning people away from taking on massive debt to attend a TTT. That said, I am the living example of the TTT-Grad that did it right and landed in a good job, so when I see the open bashing gang-up against the low LSAT scorer that was going on in this thread, I feel compelled to take up the other side...


I have. 90% of the time, I find myself agreeing with you. So I was a little shocked that you were defending someone about to choose a T3/T4 diploma based on a ridiculously piss poor rationale. If OP was signing up for the T3/T4 show without the "zOMG T10 in IP" enthusiasm, I'd understand your willingness to defend OP. :D


Fair enough. The top ten IP rationale is fucking retarded in general. Add to it that its 'soft ip' he is after and its even worse. I just thought some of the posts seemed a bit arrogant. Thats all.


A bit?

--ImageRemoved--

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reasonable_man
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Re: 2.93/ 152 applying for T3 and T4 schools

Postby reasonable_man » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:46 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:
Space_Cowboy wrote:
reasonable_man wrote:Not sure if you've read any of my prior posts, but typically, I take the position you do. I am usually the one cautioning people away from taking on massive debt to attend a TTT. That said, I am the living example of the TTT-Grad that did it right and landed in a good job, so when I see the open bashing gang-up against the low LSAT scorer that was going on in this thread, I feel compelled to take up the other side...


I have. 90% of the time, I find myself agreeing with you. So I was a little shocked that you were defending someone about to choose a T3/T4 diploma based on a ridiculously piss poor rationale. If OP was signing up for the T3/T4 show without the "zOMG T10 in IP" enthusiasm, I'd understand your willingness to defend OP. :D


Fair enough. The top ten IP rationale is fucking retarded in general. Add to it that its 'soft ip' he is after and its even worse. I just thought some of the posts seemed a bit arrogant. Thats all.


Yea I was being an arrogant son of a bitch, but it was a poor attempt to encourage OP into studying for the LSAT to get into better schools. Probably not a good way to do it.


I'm not exactly the nicest person in the world on here either, so I wouldn't lose and cyber-sleep over it.




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