Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

(Where, When and What Did You Think)
r6_philly
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby r6_philly » Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:39 pm

Someone sounds angry.

Wharton is not a back up to law, Wharton is considered better than law. I think at Penn, it goes Med > Wharton > Law.

sonervous88
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby sonervous88 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:44 pm

r6_philly wrote:Someone sounds angry.

Wharton is not a back up to law, Wharton is considered better than law. I think at Penn, it goes Med > Wharton > Law.


yeah seriously. and everyone knows what Wharton is. in law. out of law. it's WHARTON. not that i am interested in that part of upenn but still. very unncessarily angry

r6_philly
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby r6_philly » Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:47 pm

sonervous88 wrote:
r6_philly wrote:Someone sounds angry.

Wharton is not a back up to law, Wharton is considered better than law. I think at Penn, it goes Med > Wharton > Law.


yeah seriously. and everyone knows what Wharton is. in law. out of law. it's WHARTON. not that i am interested in that part of upenn but still. very unncessarily angry


Wharton may not help much with legal hiring, it will help in the eyes of clients and other professional acquaintances.

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The Stig
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby The Stig » Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:49 pm

OldManHunger wrote:
The Stig wrote: Penn noted that it has excellent other graduate schools in which to take courses, and while this is true, I think that it is inaccurate to say that Penn is the only T14 to have great other grad programs.


Yes. And that's an understatement.

The Stig wrote:That said, they do seem to encourage students to take courses (up to 4 total, in comparison to duke's 2). They also have a ton of joint degree programs, which while they don't interest me personally...


Right. Because you're going to law school.

The Stig wrote:I think it would contribute very much to a more well-rounded group of classmates in law school classes...


What does that even mean? If you think that because Joe is taking a b-school class he's gonna be any less cutthroat come round exam time, you're wrong. You'd be better off if your classmates took yoga, not International Finance.

The Stig wrote:The Wharton certificate seems to be a big hit with the students (3 classes, Wharton brand on the resume).


God help those who believe in admissions porn. Nobody in law gives a shit or knows a shit about the Wharton brand. The Wharton brand won't save your median ass from unemployment, if that's your fate, or do a damn thing extra for you if you're at the top. Maybe it'll help you get a shit consulting job if you flame out on law, but make that choice now--you don't want to be looking there for a backup.


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Veyron
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby Veyron » Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:53 pm

God help those who believe in admissions porn. Nobody in law gives a shit or knows a shit about the Wharton brand. The Wharton brand won't save your median ass from unemployment, if that's your fate, or do a damn thing extra for you if you're at the top. Maybe it'll help you get a shit consulting job if you flame out on law, but make that choice now--you don't want to be looking there for a backup.


Biglaw employers generally don't care about the certificate for entry level hiring. However, if you want to do legal work that is more public policy focused, it can be a definite leg up depending on the organization.

It also will allow you to interact with people who have worked at organizations that are large firm clients and people who will be going to work for such firms. Knowing the way that clients think WILL give you a definite edge as a midlevel. Or, say you want to go in-house some day, can't hurt for that.

In addition, there is buisness development potential down the line to consider. Say you start your own firm someday or are gunning for partner and want to bring in some buisness. Do you plan to sit at your desk at Skadden making cold-calls? Hell no. The foundations for bringing in buisness take years to mature. In 10 years, your classmates at Wharton could be decision-makers at large companies that you are interested in having as clients. Or perhaps you had a well-connected professor in XYZ industry who you hit it off well with, perhaps he will put you in touch with the sort of people you want to speak with. I mean, the damn certificate costs like 200 bucks, its not like you aren't going to get your money's worth.

Wharton is not a back up to law, Wharton is considered better than law. I think at Penn, it goes Med > Wharton > Law.


I don't even get shit like this. What an apples to oranges comparison. That's as silly as saying that Julliard is more prestigious then Penn law. Well, it is. . ., for performance (sorry law revue). For law not so much. Its not like the applicant pools or employers overlap significantly beyond the JD/MBAs.

OldManHunger
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby OldManHunger » Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:58 am

.
Last edited by OldManHunger on Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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OutCold
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby OutCold » Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:28 am

OldManHunger wrote:
Veyron wrote:It also will allow you to interact with people ... In 10 years, your classmates at Wharton could be decision-makers at large companies that you are interested in having as clients. Or perhaps you had a well-connected professor ...


You can meet relevant, well connected, useful people dozens of ways that have nothing to do with your choice of law school. In 10 years, your classmates at Wharton, your professor, will almost certainly say, "Who the fuck are you?" ... because you spent most of your time taking law classes. Because you went to law school. Bottom line: it's not a relevant factor. The only relevant factor is tuition in, employment outcomes, and what the school will do to give you a safety net.

Wharton is not a back up to law, Wharton is considered better than law. I think at Penn, it goes Med > Wharton > Law.


By this logic, you should be applying to their med school. Was the law acceptance a third choice?

My point is this: all that matters is employment outcomes. The rest of this shit is a distraction, and it's depressing to see 0Ls act like it matters.


You seem hung up on employment, but you are missing the major point here. While no one is saying that Penn is the best school for networking, the proximity of the other strong graduate programs makes it extremely easy to do in the limited time that you have between studying.

As Veyron talked about already, in BigLaw, part of your value to the firm as you head down the partner track is your ability to bring in new clients and business. Taking the tiny bit of time required to get to know some of the brightest business minds over at Wharton can pay dividends when those same people are decisions makers are large corporations.

By that same token, if you plan to go into politics, it can be helpful to make some contacts over at Public Policy. The bottom line is that your view of "employment outcomes" is very short-sighted. Sure, your law school name and grades will get you in the door of your first job, but from there, it's irrelevant to building a strong career. It certainly won't help you make partner, but that little bit of time and effort you put into building your contacts might. Again, I'm not saying that Penn is the best school for building these contacts, but the centralized nature of its programs makes it very convenient. If this isn't a factor for you in admissions, great, but please don't act like your criteria of what makes a good law school is the end all be all for everyone else.

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swampthang
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby swampthang » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:03 am

OldManHunger wrote:My point is this: all that matters is employment outcomes. The rest of this shit is a distraction, and it's depressing to see 0Ls act like it matters.


To be sure. Good thing Penn placed 4th in the country for sending grads to NLJ 250 firms last year.

While I don't think the certificate is worth a whole heck of a lot, the opportunity to interact with all these other world class grad schools and the tangible emphasis placed on this interaction through things such as GAPSA or cross-disciplinary studies could be considered a "decent soft".

r6_philly
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:57 am

OldManHunger wrote:
By this logic, you should be applying to their med school. Was the law acceptance a third choice?

My point is this: all that matters is employment outcomes. The rest of this shit is a distraction, and it's depressing to see 0Ls act like it matters.


If I was pre-med sure. If I wanted to again climb the corporate ladder, I will apply to Wharton. You are over simplifying things. Employment outcome at mid T14s are similar, so choosing schools based on these other benefits is a reasonable approach. It's not like we are talking about HYS vs Penn w/ Wharton.

I don't get why you troll all these threads anyway, if you want employment outcomes only, choose a better career option. There are some careers where the hire rate is damn near 100%.

r6_philly
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:03 am

Veyron wrote:
I don't even get shit like this. What an apples to oranges comparison. That's as silly as saying that Julliard is more prestigious then Penn law. Well, it is. . ., for performance (sorry law revue). For law not so much. Its not like the applicant pools or employers overlap significantly beyond the JD/MBAs.


We are talking about school brand prestige, not practical/rational comparison. Penn made Wharton come back to the Penn brand years ago (and unified the Penn brand) precisely because Wharton has a better name in the world.

Of course you don't have to agree, but in every sector I worked in (not law), Wharton carries a better brand recognition than Penn. If it is about personal marketing, get Wharton on your resume.

Some people are not going to work in a big firm all their lives, having the Wharton name on your resume/bio will help, certainly worth the 3 classes that you are taking as electives anyway.

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Veyron
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby Veyron » Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:02 am

You can meet relevant, well connected, useful people dozens of ways that have nothing to do with your choice of law school.


Sure you can. You can also meet them in ways that do. You should try to meet them in every way possible.

pereira6
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Re: Penn - March 25-26 ASW!

Postby pereira6 » Sun Apr 24, 2011 9:15 pm

Anyone get their travel reimbursements yet? I haven't gotten mine yet...




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