Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

(Where, When and What Did You Think)
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robin600
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby robin600 » Sat Mar 27, 2010 8:01 pm

MoS wrote:
robin600 wrote:Damn it I missed everyone!!!! So pissed! Got to meet a few though!! So next year (if I don't get off any wait lists) I will be living in old gold ct. apartments which is a seven min. walk to the law school, which is awesome! Super excited! For anyone who was wondering I have medium length curly blond hair wore a grey sweater and pants today, navy dress yesterday.

What did everyone think? I'm not going to lie, at first I was a bit turned off, 1) because mr. byrd had no idea who I was AFTER I told him about my PS and accommodated testing (either I must suck, or he wasn't on his game). 2) All the students who were on the panel were scholarship students, and me, not being a scholarship student wanted to talk to someone who wasn't a scholarship recipient to get their perspective on costs/debt management and loans. When I asked the scholarship students about it their response was "IDK I'm on scholarship." "Do you know who I can talk to?" "I guess Financial Aid." I felt like I was stupid or not "up to par", almost second class because I wasn't "scholarship material."

BUT...I think (I hope) this is only admissions talk, and things will change once I attend. I really liked that the law school is separated from the undergraduate sector and the class size is small. I also liked how willing career services are to work with you to find a job that you want in a place you want to work in, which is really important.

IDK, I don't think I'd be unhappy attending Iowa, but it's not my first choice, and if I'm accepted off of one of the three wait lists I am keeping I will attend there instead. IDK mixed vibes, need to think things over...someone talk some sense into me please!


I wouldn't worry about Mr. Byrd not knowing who you were. He seemed to be like a pretty busy man. He didn't even know where restaurants were in coralville because he was out of town so much. I didn't even try to say who I was to him as if he would know me. Then again my story wasn't as unique as yours.

I agree about the panel. I wish there were some students who were more in the middle. I got a scholarship, but I was curious how it was for average people, not just the people at the top. What, three present or former Student Bar presidents, a dual degree student who interns for Ford, two editors for the the journals; I didn't think that was a representative sample of the students.

But overall I was really impressed by the school and their programs. The clinics were a surprise to me. The website makes them seem a bit below par, which I guess they are on some level. But it doesn't talk about how they are more intensive than most programs because you can take them for 9hrs so students end up working in their "law firm" 30-35 hours a week. I like their writing programs too. Because that really is one of the most important part of the legal education. Also the abundance of research assistantships, and the open door policy made them look impressive.

All of that plus the scholarship was enough for me to look the other way from offers from some other schools. Though if I was going to pay full price, though the 2nd and 3rd really wouldn't be full price, I might consider somewhere else. But I like the openness and student center approach that permeated the school.

Oh and I thought the reception was a bust more than anything else, but I am not super sociable, so that may just be me.

You're right about Mr. Byrd being busy, he's very proactive. What really bugged me about meeting him in person was the fact that we have been conversing through email about setting up accommodations and what that entails. When I introduced myself, I said my name and I'm your accommodated prospective with visual problems, AND he still didn't know who I was. That to me is a HUGE slap in the face -1 Iowa.

Slimpee
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby Slimpee » Sat Mar 27, 2010 8:04 pm

Hey, it was great to meet a few of you!

I dug the school. I definitely think I could be happy and successful there. My only hangup is Iowa City. It seems lovely but i'd rather be in a bigger city. Overall, I could totally see myself at Iowa because of it's student-centric administration and the intellectual curiosity that seems to be prevalent amongst the students and faculty.

I also had a great chat with Dean Byrd after his closing remarks...

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dt22
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby dt22 » Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:07 am

all students (tour leaders and panelists) were volunteers...they either signed up on their own or their RAs encouraged them to do it. there was no selection process. the fact that many were scholarship recipients may just correlate with them being very involved in the school in various activities, including ASW.

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MoS
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby MoS » Sun Mar 28, 2010 2:39 pm

I didn't have a problem with the student reps. I liked them allot. The panel was very entertaining. I just didn't feel it was as diverse as I would like. Both 1Ls were non-trads with families. There's nothing wrong with that, its just a limited perspective. Either way you saw it, it was nice of them to take time out of their schedules to help us see the law school.

And Slimpee,

I feel the similar with the size of the city. Its not like I feel that I will miss out on allot of things. Anything I want to do or buy will be in Iowa City, there just won't be variety or breathing room from undergrads. But I also think that is probably balances with the fact you won't have enough time to do everything you would like to in a big city. And there are always weekends in Minneapolis or Chicago.

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Jerome
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby Jerome » Sun Mar 28, 2010 5:45 pm

MoS wrote:I feel the similar with the size of the city. Its not like I feel that I will miss out on allot of things. Anything I want to do or buy will be in Iowa City, there just won't be variety or breathing room from undergrads. But I also think that is probably balances with the fact you won't have enough time to do everything you would like to in a big city. And there are always weekends in Minneapolis or Chicago.


I had some reservations about Iowa City, but upon thinking about it more, it is not bad for a state school town. Between the law school, med school, and the Writer's Workshop, students will be surrounded by engaged and intelligent peers, the bars and restaurants were pretty good for a smaller town, and for me at least, being away from the hustle of a big city will probably help my studies.

After the ASD I drove to Lafayette, Indiana (home of Purdue) to see my fiance. Iowa City is much less lame than Lafayette. MUCH LESS.

sebastian0622
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby sebastian0622 » Mon Mar 29, 2010 2:38 am

It was my first ASW. Without being able to compare it to any others, my first impression was that it was alright. I was annoyed that they don't reimburse travel unless you receive a scholarship and not until/unless you matriculate. I thought the morning reception was a flop. They had one line for everyone to get food in a half-hour (I skipped it), a crowded lobby, and overall just an awkward vibe. But I'm not particularly social...

The faculty panel was boring and, aside from the information on the clinical program, pretty uninformative. I fought zoning out for most of it. I felt that the students on the panel were candid and offered some good info. I had two big problems with the student feedback and the day in general:

1) There was a vibe amongst the panelists of, "I got into better schools, but (insert excuse for going to Iowa here)."

2) I felt there was a lot of blatant dishonesty about Iowa's national placement ability. Saying that Iowa regularly places in Dallas, New York, D.C., etc...the numbers say that's simply not true. Sure, you CAN get a job anywhere with an Iowa degree, but that doesn't mean it's your best option to attend Iowa if a job in D.C. is your goal.

I thought most of the current students were likable. A lot of the admitted students seemed really kind of annoying and rude, though. My first impression was that it seemed like a really homogeneous (racially/economically), spoiled/entitled, and very young group of admitted students.

On the good side, the library is great. The clinical program is really unique and offers something a lot of other schools do not. Professors did seem genuinely accessible. Iowa City is a cool college town, and placement remains strong in Chicago as far as I can tell. It's not my top choice right now, but I'll see after another ASW or two elsewhere.

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Jerome
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby Jerome » Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:24 am

sebastian0622 wrote:The faculty panel was boring and, aside from the information on the clinical program, pretty uninformative. I fought zoning out for most of it. I felt that the students on the panel were candid and offered some good info. I had two big problems with the student feedback and the day in general:

1) There was a vibe amongst the panelists of, "I got into better schools, but (insert excuse for going to Iowa here)."

2) I felt there was a lot of blatant dishonesty about Iowa's national placement ability. Saying that Iowa regularly places in Dallas, New York, D.C., etc...the numbers say that's simply not true. Sure, you CAN get a job anywhere with an Iowa degree, but that doesn't mean it's your best option to attend Iowa if a job in D.C. is your goal.


I don't think that the panelists were saying that Iowa is your best option for getting a job in DC or NY. They simply said it was possible, and that Iowa's reputation coupled with the career services office can get you jobs outside the mid-west. There is certainly a selection bias to be considered - many Iowa students attend Iowa because they want to live and work in the mid-west. If they wanted to work and live in DC you could expect them to go to American, if they wanted CA they could go to Davis, if they want NY they could select any number of similarly ranked NY schools. Just because there aren't tons of students practicing in those areas does not mean that Iowa can't place well there. I don't think they were being dishonest at all.

sebastian0622 wrote:I thought most of the current students were likable. A lot of the admitted students seemed really kind of annoying and rude, though. My first impression was that it seemed like a really homogeneous (racially/economically), spoiled/entitled, and very young group of admitted students.


On the whole, I got a different impression. Many of the admitted students were young and white, but I don't know about economically homogeneous. And surely there were rude and annoying students, but most of those that I met and spoke with were nice and engaging. I liked all of the current students, and many, if not most, of the admitted students.

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MoS
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby MoS » Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:31 am

Jerome wrote:
sebastian0622 wrote:I thought most of the current students were likable. A lot of the admitted students seemed really kind of annoying and rude, though. My first impression was that it seemed like a really homogeneous (racially/economically), spoiled/entitled, and very young group of admitted students.


On the whole, I got a different impression. Many of the admitted students were young and white, but I don't know about economically homogeneous. And surely there were rude and annoying students, but most of those that I met and spoke with were nice and engaging. I liked all of the current students, and many, if not most, of the admitted students.


I think most of the admitted students who attended were from Iowa or near to it. It was easily 90+% white. I thought that was a bit odd, but Iowa is 90+% white so I guess I should have expected it.

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webbylu87
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby webbylu87 » Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:39 am

robin600 wrote:All the students who were on the panel were scholarship students, and me, not being a scholarship student wanted to talk to someone who wasn't a scholarship recipient to get their perspective on costs/debt management and loans. When I asked the scholarship students about it their response was "IDK I'm on scholarship." "Do you know who I can talk to?" "I guess Financial Aid." I felt like I was stupid or not "up to par", almost second class because I wasn't "scholarship material."


definitely agree with you on this point. i'm in-state but wasn't nominated for any scholarshps either. i was very disappointed in the fact that they didn't have very much non-scholarship representation on the panel (or at least it appeared that way). my impression was that a lot of them basically said they came for the scholarships, and as someone without a scholarship i'm looking for another reason to pick iowa. i feel like the question at the student panel as to what caused them to ultimately pick iowa over the other schools they were choosing between was blown off. i thought it was an opportunity to draw me in and give a good, honest answer but wasn't really embraced.

as a side note on the scholarship point, collins byrd told multiple people that the scholarship money offered which was turned down would be reallocated to those nominated. however, the representative of financial aid said the exact opposite. she said they count on a portion of scholarship recipients turning down offers every year and allocate accordingly. which is correct?

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Jerome
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby Jerome » Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:45 am

webbylu87 wrote:as a side note on the scholarship point, collins byrd told multiple people that the scholarship money offered which was turned down would be reallocated to those nominated. however, the representative of financial aid said the exact opposite. she said they count on a portion of scholarship recipients turning down offers every year and allocate accordingly. which is correct?


I don't know which is correct, but I have heard both. My interactions (via e-mail) with the Fin Aid office have been, to say the least, unhelpful. I suspect that some money may re-enter the pool given that most students this cycle applied to many more schools and as a result, typically have more options, than in years past. I was told it would only be awarded to previously nominated students, though.

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traehekat
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby traehekat » Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:49 am

sebastian0622 wrote:I thought most of the current students were likable. A lot of the admitted students seemed really kind of annoying and rude, though. My first impression was that it seemed like a really homogeneous (racially/economically), spoiled/entitled, and very young group of admitted students.


Heh, I got SORT OF a similar feeling. I left thinking, "Man, everyone on that panel seemed pretty cool, I'd love to spend three years with people like this," but then I thought, "Wait, none of the prospective students really seemed that cool - I want to be in classes with the panel people!"

That isn't really a fair assessment though, on my part - as prospective law students I think on the whole we are all a little shy and timid at first, especially when meeting people who may be our future classmates for the first time. I think everyone has a sense of, "I don't want to look like an idiot, I'll just keep my mouth shut," or something like that. Of the few admitted students I talked to everyone was pretty friendly, so it's not like I had some bad experience or anything.

Here is how I look at it - I think Iowa has a very relaxed atmosphere that (a) attracts a certain type of student and weeds out (for the most part) other types of students, and (b) breeds healthy relationships among students, meaning that even if a student matriculates with a certain attitude that may not line up with the culture at Iowa, it is very possible that student will end up "falling in line," so to speak, with the culture. Obviously this isn't to say everyone is the same at Iowa or anything, I just think there is a certain attitude you can sense throughout the student body and faculty. I'm confident if I end up a Hawkeye, I won't have any problems liking most of my fellow classmates.

sebastian0622 wrote:1) There was a vibe amongst the panelists of, "I got into better schools, but (insert excuse for going to Iowa here)."


I tend to agree, with the excuse seeming to be, "I received a large scholarship." As I have mentioned, I would have liked to hear from current students paying sticker price.

sebastian0622 wrote:2) I felt there was a lot of blatant dishonesty about Iowa's national placement ability. Saying that Iowa regularly places in Dallas, New York, D.C., etc...the numbers say that's simply not true. Sure, you CAN get a job anywhere with an Iowa degree, but that doesn't mean it's your best option to attend Iowa if a job in D.C. is your goal.


Eh, you have to be pretty naive to believe any of that, anyway. I think most people understand not very many schools are going to tell you, "Oh yeah, you are pretty much stuck here - hope you like it here!" I mean, MOST schools' answer to placement questions is just, "We have alumni in 50 states."

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Jerome
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby Jerome » Mon Mar 29, 2010 12:10 pm

traehekat wrote:Here is how I look at it - I think Iowa has a very relaxed atmosphere that (a) attracts a certain type of student and weeds out (for the most part) other types of students, and (b) breeds healthy relationships among students, meaning that even if a student matriculates with a certain attitude that may not line up with the culture at Iowa, it is very possible that student will end up "falling in line," so to speak, with the culture. Obviously this isn't to say everyone is the same at Iowa or anything, I just think there is a certain attitude you can sense throughout the student body and faculty. I'm confident if I end up a Hawkeye, I won't have any problems liking most of my fellow classmates.


Totally agree.

traehekat wrote:Eh, you have to be pretty naive to believe any of that, anyway. I think most people understand not very many schools are going to tell you, "Oh yeah, you are pretty much stuck here - hope you like it here!" I mean, MOST schools' answer to placement questions is just, "We have alumni in 50 states."


I mostly agree with this, with the following caveats:
1) Like I noted above, at most schools outside the T-14, there is bound to be a selection bias. Students dead-set on a job in Boston wont attend Iowa assuming they'll get it, unless they are naive, stupid, or have some sort of extreme extenuating circumstance. If you go to Iowa in the first place, you should know that you're somewhat limited in location, at least for a first job.

2) That being said, I got the impression from current students with whom I spoke that if you do well enough and actively pursue it, you can find jobs in markets outside of Iowa's typical regional reach. One current student, for example, wanted a job in Portland, OR and was able to land a summer job with the Multhnomah County DA in the Violent Crime Division. He had to put in extra leg-work, but its doable (and I know students at Lewis and Clark who can't get jobs there despite being down the street, so to speak.

All in all, Iowa's reputation seems to be strong enough that, with some work and the help from career services, good students should be able to get jobs in most markets. Of course, getting a job in DC would be easier with a degree from W&L or American than Iowa, but Iowa will place better in Chicago.

cojonelso
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby cojonelso » Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:01 pm

I really enjoyed the ASW, though the faculty panel was a bit boring. I didn't feel that Iowa was being "blatantly dishonest" about their career placement, as I have talked to Iowa grads currently working in Dallas, NY, DC. That's not to say that someone in the bottom half at Iowa can just head to NY and find a job, but it's not unreasonable for Iowa to state that they have grads working everywhere.

Regarding the admitted students, I felt the majority I spoke with were very nice and friendly. While most were white and young (including myself) I didn't get the impression that they were economically homogeneous or spoiled/entitled.

I thought it was fair for some panelists to hint that they had other competitive options when considering Iowa and yet chose Iowa over those other options ("better schools"). Absolutely nothing wrong with that. I would say they offered reasons for going to Iowa, not excuses.

The thing that I really liked about Iowa was the people. The school really seems to develop a tight-knit, supportive community of friends and I am looking forward to attending in the fall.

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ILoveClowns8
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby ILoveClowns8 » Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:25 pm

I enjoyed the visit and had a good time meeting fellow admitted students. Maybe it was the friendly people I ended up being around for most of the event, but I would definitely enjoy going to school with them for three years, and I hope I see some of you again!

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dt22
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby dt22 » Mon Mar 29, 2010 7:19 pm

i also thought the admitted students around me seemed super young...don't know why I expected a diverse group age-wise...that didn't happen. Enjoyed the current students.

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jaskat
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby jaskat » Mon Mar 29, 2010 8:01 pm

dt22 wrote:i also thought the admitted students around me seemed super young...don't know why I expected a diverse group age-wise...that didn't happen. Enjoyed the current students.


How much older can you be though? (Just curious, didn't mean it meanly or anything)

Slimpee
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby Slimpee » Mon Mar 29, 2010 8:05 pm

dt22 wrote:i also thought the admitted students around me seemed super young...don't know why I expected a diverse group age-wise...that didn't happen. Enjoyed the current students.


Keep in mind, many "older" admitted students may have been unable to get off work during the week to travel. I would imagine there are a lot of spring breakers able to make trips...

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dt22
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Re: Iowa, March 25-28 ASW

Postby dt22 » Mon Mar 29, 2010 9:36 pm

Slimpee wrote:
dt22 wrote:i also thought the admitted students around me seemed super young...don't know why I expected a diverse group age-wise...that didn't happen. Enjoyed the current students.


Keep in mind, many "older" admitted students may have been unable to get off work during the week to travel. I would imagine there are a lot of spring breakers able to make trips...


that's what i thought as well.

jaskat - how much older? well, i don't actually know that they were young, first of all. the group just appeared young to me, as if i were back in undergrad several years ago. age range is said to be 21-46; felt like 21-22ish. that doesn't mean that it was the case whatsoever.




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