Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Share Your Experiences, Read About Other Experiences. Please keep posts organized by school and expected year of graduation.
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sophistry
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby sophistry » Tue May 18, 2010 10:29 am

sibley wrote:
yeah I want an update too please. the dean gave me to tomorrow to decide. I couldn't get off work to drive the 6 hours to nyc and just moved this weekend too so it didn't really work out but I'd like to get an idea of the atmosphere and your perceptions.


Oh no, you're still undecided?! I totally understand, though. You have a tough decision. As I said above, I think people who are undecided really need to find a way to visit the school. Everyone's perception will be different.

My experience: I thought the professors were surprisingly approachable and fun to talk with, but I thought parts of the campus were cramped and felt old. The overall neighborhood is odd--Brooklyn Heights is beautiful but downtown Brooklyn is terribly ugly and trashed. There is a clear line between the two. The students were also varied. Some of them were really happy with their experience and seemed to be getting a lot out of the school A few others were clearly depressed to be there and complained about not finding jobs. Overall, I think it is a great place to spend three years, but I suspect that BLS evokes strong opinions in both directions depending on the person. Sorry if this doesn't help at all...

This will likely piss some people off, but maybe you could deposit at both to give yourself more time?? On the other hand, maybe it's telling that you haven't taken time to visit the school? I'm jealous of your GW acceptance so it's hard for me to feel too bad for you! :D Good luck and let us know what you decide!

Oakley84
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Oakley84 » Tue May 18, 2010 1:38 pm

Curious to know who is still waiting on a decision from BLS?

NYCG8TR
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby NYCG8TR » Tue May 18, 2010 2:18 pm

I'm still waiting for a decision....but at this point in time I think that pretty much indicates the obvious.

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Steve Zissou
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Steve Zissou » Tue May 18, 2010 3:37 pm

SaraT wrote:Hey guys, I would love your advice on my situation. I've been accepted to BLS with a full ride and Fordham with 22,000. Which do you think is the better choice if I want to do biglaw and stay in NYC?

Fordham is slightly better. More firms interview Fordham students, but at either school you'll have to get good grades. It's just going to depend on how much debt you can put up with. At BLS, you'll probably graduate with $55,000 in debt just to pay for housing and groceries. At Fordham, you'll have the same $55,000 + $60,000-ish? for tuition. If you have no undergraduate debt, I'd say Fordham is worth an extra $20,000-ish per year for better big law chances, if you put in the effort. Good luck.

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sophistry
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby sophistry » Tue May 18, 2010 3:50 pm

NYCG8TR wrote:I'm still waiting for a decision....but at this point in time I think that pretty much indicates the obvious.


I wouldn't give up just yet. Remember that there are a lot of admits who are still making their final decision and may back out. BLS even sent letters to some people who withdrew asking them to reconsider. I'm pretty sure the deadlines for all of these are no later than June 1. You probably still have some waiting to do, likely into mid-June. Good luck!

Mr. Pablo
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Mr. Pablo » Tue May 18, 2010 4:35 pm

Steve Zissou wrote:
SaraT wrote:Hey guys, I would love your advice on my situation. I've been accepted to BLS with a full ride and Fordham with 22,000. Which do you think is the better choice if I want to do biglaw and stay in NYC?

Fordham is slightly better. More firms interview Fordham students, but at either school you'll have to get good grades. It's just going to depend on how much debt you can put up with. At BLS, you'll probably graduate with $55,000 in debt just to pay for housing and groceries. At Fordham, you'll have the same $55,000 + $60,000-ish? for tuition. If you have no undergraduate debt, I'd say Fordham is worth an extra $20,000-ish per year for better big law chances, if you put in the effort. Good luck.

+1

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knickfan
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby knickfan » Tue May 18, 2010 4:36 pm

Mr. Pablo wrote:
Steve Zissou wrote:
SaraT wrote:Hey guys, I would love your advice on my situation. I've been accepted to BLS with a full ride and Fordham with 22,000. Which do you think is the better choice if I want to do biglaw and stay in NYC?

Fordham is slightly better. More firms interview Fordham students, but at either school you'll have to get good grades. It's just going to depend on how much debt you can put up with. At BLS, you'll probably graduate with $55,000 in debt just to pay for housing and groceries. At Fordham, you'll have the same $55,000 + $60,000-ish? for tuition. If you have no undergraduate debt, I'd say Fordham is worth an extra $20,000-ish per year for better big law chances, if you put in the effort. Good luck.

+1


-1 go to BLS, better looking student body ;)

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sophistry
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby sophistry » Tue May 18, 2010 4:51 pm

knickfan wrote:
-1 go to BLS, better looking student body ;)


I've noticed that most, if not all, of my non-lawyer friends think BLS is way better than Fordham. Strange lay-prestige effect. I haven't corrected them. Has anyone had similar experiences?

(Note that Sara, above, had her question answered in the Choosing a Law School forum.)

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Steve Zissou
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Steve Zissou » Tue May 18, 2010 5:17 pm

Someone asked about the Insider's Day. I went to an earlier one... I should probably go to another one though, because I didn't talk to anyone enough.

The campus: The tower campus is a bit more worn than Cardozo's, but in better shape than Fordham's dumpy-middle-school-vibe campus. The library seemed sprawling and the computer area felt like a bunker, but reading room was cozy. The moot court room is open and vast. If you go a few blocks south, the street scape improves dramatically from a sterile, concrete wasteland to a real "this is the Brooklyn everyone is clamoring about" neighborhood.

The professors: This is why I need to go back; I didn't talk to any. I just pray that I do NOT have Prof. Jason Mazzone. (The guy, um, can. Not make. Um. Any sentence cannot be. Um. Be made complete. Um, there is no. Complete. Sentence.) I'm sure he's a nice guy but I don't think I could survive his lectures. Prof. Serkin (I think) did the sample lecture and was fine. When I sat for lunch, I actually sat with one of the Deans of something-or-other-but-not-admissions. He was a nice guy. Aside from the pro-school talk you get from any Dean of any school, he told us a bit about the school's future plans for joint programs with other schools.

The applicants: I sat at a table with a lot of undecided applicants. Many were on waitlists for other schools or still weighing their options.

What was missing: Time to talk directly to current students. Probably the most valuable information you'd hope to get at one of these events. Cardozo was cool about this: They had us start by sitting 6-8 applicants at table with a current student who was completely uncensored. I had a hilariously jaded and honest 2L at my table. Later, in the afternoon, groups of maybe two dozen sat in a room with three 2 or 3Ls without any school reps. BLS had a moderated Q & A panel with school staff in the room. Totally lame by comparison.

Did anyone go to the Skaaden Arps reception?

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knickfan
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby knickfan » Tue May 18, 2010 5:51 pm

Steve Zissou wrote:Someone asked about the Insider's Day. I went to an earlier one... I should probably go to another one though, because I didn't talk to anyone enough.

The campus: The tower campus is a bit more worn than Cardozo's, but in better shape than Fordham's dumpy-middle-school-vibe campus. The library seemed sprawling and the computer area felt like a bunker, but reading room was cozy. The moot court room is open and vast. If you go a few blocks south, the street scape improves dramatically from a sterile, concrete wasteland to a real "this is the Brooklyn everyone is clamoring about" neighborhood.

The professors: This is why I need to go back; I didn't talk to any. I just pray that I do NOT have Prof. Jason Mazzone. (The guy, um, can. Not make. Um. Any sentence cannot be. Um. Be made complete. Um, there is no. Complete. Sentence.) I'm sure he's a nice guy but I don't think I could survive his lectures. Prof. Serkin (I think) did the sample lecture and was fine. When I sat for lunch, I actually sat with one of the Deans of something-or-other-but-not-admissions. He was a nice guy. Aside from the pro-school talk you get from any Dean of any school, he told us a bit about the school's future plans for joint programs with other schools.

The applicants: I sat at a table with a lot of undecided applicants. Many were on waitlists for other schools or still weighing their options.

What was missing: Time to talk directly to current students. Probably the most valuable information you'd hope to get at one of these events. Cardozo was cool about this: They had us start by sitting 6-8 applicants at table with a current student who was completely uncensored. I had a hilariously jaded and honest 2L at my table. Later, in the afternoon, groups of maybe two dozen sat in a room with three 2 or 3Ls without any school reps. BLS had a moderated Q & A panel with school staff in the room. Totally lame by comparison.

Did anyone go to the Skaaden Arps reception?


thanks...lol that must've been awkward, sitting alone with a dean for lunch..

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knickfan
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby knickfan » Tue May 18, 2010 5:53 pm

sophistry wrote:
knickfan wrote:
-1 go to BLS, better looking student body ;)


I've noticed that most, if not all, of my non-lawyer friends think BLS is way better than Fordham. Strange lay-prestige effect. I haven't corrected them. Has anyone had similar experiences?

(Note that Sara, above, had her question answered in the Choosing a Law School forum.)


actually i was completely joking. I have no idea how anybody in any particular law school looks...i was just trying to support Brooklyn..

I really don't think anyone should have the attractiveness of the student body play a factor in their decision of which school to attend.

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sophistry
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby sophistry » Tue May 18, 2010 6:17 pm

knickfan wrote:
sophistry wrote:
knickfan wrote:
-1 go to BLS, better looking student body ;)


I've noticed that most, if not all, of my non-lawyer friends think BLS is way better than Fordham. Strange lay-prestige effect. I haven't corrected them. Has anyone had similar experiences?

(Note that Sara, above, had her question answered in the Choosing a Law School forum.)


actually i was completely joking. I have no idea how anybody in any particular law school looks...i was just trying to support Brooklyn..

I really don't think anyone should have the attractiveness of the student body play a factor in their decision of which school to attend.


Yes yes, I think that was understood. I appreciate the pro BLS sentiment, though!

Mr. Pablo
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Mr. Pablo » Tue May 18, 2010 7:05 pm

Steve Zissou wrote:...stuff...
Did anyone go to the Skaaden Arps reception?

I went and I thought it was pretty cool. I got to chat with a few professors and some current students. The faculty I spoke with were really friendly as were the students. There were free drinks, so after a couple of hours people were talking pretty freely. I actually managed to speak with a hiring partner who wandered in looking for free food. My conversation with her was probably the best part.

fakemoney
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby fakemoney » Tue May 18, 2010 9:18 pm

Mr. Pablo wrote:Did anyone go to the Skaaden Arps reception?
I went and I thought it was pretty cool. I got to chat with a few professors and some current students. The faculty I spoke with were really friendly as were the students. There were free drinks, so after a couple of hours people were talking pretty freely. I actually managed to speak with a hiring partner who wandered in looking for free food. My conversation with her was probably the best part.


Whoa... whoa... whoa...

By free drinks, you mean adult beverages? They would get a lot better turnout at these things if they made that a bullet point.

Mr. Pablo
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Mr. Pablo » Tue May 18, 2010 9:27 pm

Yes, free wine and beer. The wine was so-so, but the had some Brooklyn Breweries beers and Sam Adams, so the beer selection was pretty good. Also, they had nice crudites.

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sophistry
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby sophistry » Wed May 19, 2010 12:11 pm

Mr. Pablo wrote:
Steve Zissou wrote:...stuff...
Did anyone go to the Skaaden Arps reception?

I went and I thought it was pretty cool. I got to chat with a few professors and some current students. The faculty I spoke with were really friendly as were the students. There were free drinks, so after a couple of hours people were talking pretty freely. I actually managed to speak with a hiring partner who wandered in looking for free food. My conversation with her was probably the best part.


Wow, I wish I would have gone. Pick up any good advice from the hiring partner?

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Steve Zissou
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Steve Zissou » Wed May 19, 2010 12:37 pm

sophistry wrote:I've noticed that most, if not all, of my non-lawyer friends think BLS is way better than Fordham. Strange lay-prestige effect. I haven't corrected them. Has anyone had similar experiences?

lol @ not correcting them.

Of those I know outside of NYC, many have heard of Brooklyn Law School (or think they have), but not a single one had heard of Fordham's law school or the university itself.

Strangely, older people I know who have NYC roots or live here seem to confuse Brooklyn Law School with Brooklyn College, which is part of the CUNY system. I always correct them. 8)

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dhg5004
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby dhg5004 » Wed May 19, 2010 12:49 pm

Oakley84 wrote:Curious to know who is still waiting on a decision from BLS?


me. I got an email a week or so ago saying they were reaching the final stages. I'm going on like 4 months? Wtf?

Oakley84
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Oakley84 » Wed May 19, 2010 2:20 pm

Does a decision letter just get mailed? Or does something pop up on the tracker when a decision has been rendered? Anyone know?

fakemoney
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby fakemoney » Wed May 19, 2010 2:41 pm

I got an email from admissions. I think that's how they notify everyone, as the email account is "AdmitBLS" or something to that effect.

Mr. Pablo
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Mr. Pablo » Wed May 19, 2010 4:25 pm

sophistry wrote:
Mr. Pablo wrote:
Steve Zissou wrote:...stuff...
Did anyone go to the Skaaden Arps reception?

I went and I thought it was pretty cool. I got to chat with a few professors and some current students. The faculty I spoke with were really friendly as were the students. There were free drinks, so after a couple of hours people were talking pretty freely. I actually managed to speak with a hiring partner who wandered in looking for free food. My conversation with her was probably the best part.


Wow, I wish I would have gone. Pick up any good advice from the hiring partner?

She actually made some things really clear, specifically her views on the schools in NYC. She basically lumped Cardozo, Brooklyn, and Fordham into one group, and NYU and CLS into the other. Just like everyone says, they (Skadden) basically just take more people from NYU&CLS, and really only look at the top 15% of the classes at the other schools. She also said that she would take a BLS kid over a Dozo kid, all other things being equal. She also thought that transferring to NYU or CLS was the best move if it was possible, that she interviews people who do that, that it is done frequently, and that the top students transfer out of BLS "is a big problem for the school".

fakemoney
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby fakemoney » Wed May 19, 2010 4:47 pm

I wonder how strong the perception of Brooklyn being lumped together with Fordham is out there. I applied to both and was rejected by Fordham, but accepted by BLS. From most applicants, and people on here, the sentiment seems pretty strong that there's a big drop-off from Fordham to BLS and 'Dozo

Mr. Pablo
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Mr. Pablo » Wed May 19, 2010 5:00 pm

fakemoney wrote:I wonder how strong the perception of Brooklyn being lumped together with Fordham is out there. I applied to both and was rejected by Fordham, but accepted by BLS. From most applicants, and people on here, the sentiment seems pretty strong that there's a big drop-off from Fordham to BLS and 'Dozo

I have no idea how pervasive it is, but this particular partner thought of them in a similar fashion. I think it points more to the separation between NYU/CLS and the other NYC schools. She also made a funny comment about how it's really only the old firms that go to BLS for associates. I wouldn't bet my life on it, but it was fun and informative to talk to someone who actually hires people into the world of biglaw.

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Steve Zissou
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby Steve Zissou » Wed May 19, 2010 6:27 pm

Mr. Pablo wrote:I have no idea how pervasive it is, but this particular partner thought of them in a similar fashion. I think it points more to the separation between NYU/CLS and the other NYC schools.


This seems like a no-brainer to me. OK, more big law firms interview at Fordham, but there's still plenty interviewing at BLS.

Mr. Pablo wrote:She also made a funny comment about how it's really only the old firms that go to BLS for associates. I wouldn't bet my life on it, but it was fun and informative to talk to someone who actually hires people into the world of biglaw.

Must be the partners that went to BLS pre-rankings and would be pissed if the firm didn't at least try to find a few BLS associates. Yikes, they won't be around forever. Hopefully they dump a good portion of their wills into BLS' endowment. :P

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sophistry
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Re: Brooklyn 09/10 cycle

Postby sophistry » Wed May 19, 2010 6:39 pm

Mr. Pablo wrote:She actually made some things really clear, specifically her views on the schools in NYC. She basically lumped Cardozo, Brooklyn, and Fordham into one group, and NYU and CLS into the other. Just like everyone says, they (Skadden) basically just take more people from NYU&CLS, and really only look at the top 15% of the classes at the other schools. She also said that she would take a BLS kid over a Dozo kid, all other things being equal. She also thought that transferring to NYU or CLS was the best move if it was possible, that she interviews people who do that, that it is done frequently, and that the top students transfer out of BLS "is a big problem for the school".


This is exactly what I've heard from a couple senior partners I've spoken with in NYC (the 'Dozo reference as well). That being said, the hard data still shows Fordham being well above BLS in terms of hiring, so I'm not sure what to make of our anecdotal evidence.




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