Wake Forest 2010

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kalvano
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby kalvano » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:53 pm

Kchuck wrote:You are destroying this article because it is supported by 'anonymous claims reported over the internet'. Yet, you backed your initial claim by the statement that you gathered your information by asking around 'here', a message board full of anonymous claims. This seems ignorant.



Ah. I see now. I did not mean "here" as in TLS. I meant amongst attorneys where I live.

And there may be tons of truth to that article, I don't know. I just wanted to make a sarcastic remark. People tell me it's a defense mechanism.

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:56 pm

kalvano wrote:
Kchuck wrote:You are destroying this article because it is supported by 'anonymous claims reported over the internet'. Yet, you backed your initial claim by the statement that you gathered your information by asking around 'here', a message board full of anonymous claims. This seems ignorant.



Ah. I see now. I did not mean "here" as in TLS. I meant amongst attorneys where I live.

And there may be tons of truth to that article, I don't know. I just wanted to make a sarcastic remark. People tell me it's a defense mechanism.


Fair enough =). all schools game the system, the question of the article's validity doesn;t really bother me, and shouldn't bother anyone else either
Last edited by Nicholasnickynic on Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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84Sunbird2000
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby 84Sunbird2000 » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:56 pm

THis is BS. Wake's NLJ 250 and Federal Clerkship placements were damn good for 2009 - moved up significantly in fact in overall terms as well as relative to other schools. Plus, they have had no or nearly no "academic" placement to fill out their employment as of 2008. There is certainly no evidence that Wake has a history of padding stats or even having low reporting %'s.

On a side note, I withdrew (very begrudgingly) from the 28k I was offered last week. Good luck to all those here on the Wake board. I wish I could have joined you, but William and Mary has my heart.

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kalvano
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby kalvano » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:59 pm

Nicholasnickynic wrote:all schools game the system



To an extent, sure they do. But there are schools that actively engage in it to an enormous extent, and there are others that just kind of go along with whatever may be.


Speaking of which, where is everyone getting the 2009 numbers?

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:59 pm

84Sunbird2000 wrote:THis is BS. Wake's NLJ 250 and Federal Clerkship placements were damn good for 2009 - moved up significantly in fact in overall terms as well as relative to other schools. Plus, they have had no or nearly no "academic" placement to fill out their employment as of 2008. There is certainly no evidence that Wake has a history of padding stats or even having low reporting %'s.

On a side note, I withdrew (very begrudgingly) from the 28k I was offered last week. Good luck to all those here on the Wake board. I wish I could have joined you, but William and Mary has my heart.


All the NLJ 250 tells us is that there is a big disparity between the top and bottom at wake.

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traehekat
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby traehekat » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:00 am

% employed is kind of a dumb stat anyway. Like... so only 74% of Wake Graduates are employed at graduation. Meaning that the majority of students who make up the 26% NOT employed probably come from the bottom 26% of the class (who we wouldn't expect to be employed upon graduation ITE anyway, right?).

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:02 am

when uga has a 90% at graduation, employed at grad doesn't seem like a dumb stat anymore.

It makes it feel like its a safer bet to go there; that I can do much worse at UGA and still be fine (or better off than a wake grade in the same situation anyway).

I mean, at wake, 1 in 4 won't be employed at graduation.

At UGa, 1 in 10 wont be employed at graduation.

I think if you are going to argue against the employed at graduation stat, a better argument would be what really matters is employed after 9 months.
Last edited by Nicholasnickynic on Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:07 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:04 am

kalvano wrote:
Nicholasnickynic wrote:all schools game the system



To an extent, sure they do. But there are schools that actively engage in it to an enormous extent, and there are others that just kind of go along with whatever may be.


Speaking of which, where is everyone getting the 2009 numbers?


Look at a photocopied list of the new rankings. The columns to the right of the rankings give all the new info.

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traehekat
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby traehekat » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:06 am

Nicholasnickynic wrote:when uga has a 90% at graduation, employed at grad doesn't seem like a dumb stat anymore.

It makes it feel like its a safer bet to go there; that I can do much worse at UGA and still be fine (or better off than a wake grade in the same situation anyway).


Call me a pessimist, but I have a hard time believing you can fall in the bottom 15-20% of your class at Georgia and still find meaningful legal work. I could be wrong though.

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Kchuck
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Kchuck » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:08 am

kalvano wrote:Ah. I see now. I did not mean "here" as in TLS. I meant amongst attorneys where I live.

And there may be tons of truth to that article, I don't know. I just wanted to make a sarcastic remark. People tell me it's a defense mechanism.


Ahhh, I got you. I still don't know if the selective group of attorneys where you live is enough to support your claim, but I'll let it slide.

Just Kidding. In all seriousness, though, I agree with the other poster. I don't think it's fair to say that Wake doesn't game the rankings. I'd imagine that they game the rankings about as much as any other school would/does. It seems like that is just par for the course.

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:09 am

traehekat wrote:
Nicholasnickynic wrote:when uga has a 90% at graduation, employed at grad doesn't seem like a dumb stat anymore.

It makes it feel like its a safer bet to go there; that I can do much worse at UGA and still be fine (or better off than a wake grade in the same situation anyway).


Call me a pessimist, but I have a hard time believing you can fall in the bottom 15-20% of your class at Georgia and still find meaningful legal work. I could be wrong though.



lol. No one said anything about meaningful.
Thats a good point.
Perhaps UGA is just better at getting thier grads shitty jobs (doc review etc) than wake forest.

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traehekat
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby traehekat » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:11 am

Nicholasnickynic wrote:
traehekat wrote:
Nicholasnickynic wrote:when uga has a 90% at graduation, employed at grad doesn't seem like a dumb stat anymore.

It makes it feel like its a safer bet to go there; that I can do much worse at UGA and still be fine (or better off than a wake grade in the same situation anyway).


Call me a pessimist, but I have a hard time believing you can fall in the bottom 15-20% of your class at Georgia and still find meaningful legal work. I could be wrong though.



lol. No one said anything about meaningful.
Thats a good point.
Perhaps UGA is just better at getting thier grads shitty jobs (doc review etc) than wake forest.


Heh, exactly what I was thinking.

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:13 am

For the record, I'm only playing devil's advocate: I'd love some one to convince me that Wake is better than UGA. I had pretty much made up my mind on wake, but than most recent stats threw me for a loop... it's probably just my fear of commitment though O.o

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gogo
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby gogo » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:26 am

Nicholasnickynic wrote:For the record, I'm only playing devil's advocate: I'd love some one to convince me that Wake is better than UGA. I had pretty much made up my mind on wake, but than most recent stats threw me for a loop... it's probably just my fear of commitment though O.o


+1

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traehekat
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby traehekat » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:32 am

Nicholasnickynic wrote:For the record, I'm only playing devil's advocate: I'd love some one to convince me that Wake is better than UGA. I had pretty much made up my mind on wake, but than most recent stats threw me for a loop... it's probably just my fear of commitment though O.o


What stats are you referring to? I hope you don't mean UGA's jump in the rankings! Schools fluctuate so much, I really don't think it matters too much. It isn't like employers are looking at the rankings and saying, "Well everyone, looks like UGA moved up two spots this year in the rankings. This means this year we will be hiring x amount more UGA graduates than last year!" Just look at the history of the rankings - every school has been pretty much in its place for the last ten years. They move around a bit here and there, but generally speaking, employers know how good of a school UGA is.

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tstyler98
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby tstyler98 » Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:27 am

kalvano wrote:
tstyler98 wrote:I'll turn 30 in October, but people think I'm straight out of undergrad. It's annoying at times, but hopefully means when I'm much older people will still think I'm younger. :?

I'm sure there will be some differences, but I don't think the age-differences will be that much of an issue.



You do not look 29 / 30.

True story.


Thanks. :mrgreen:

Took me a second to realize who you were...I had gotten so used to your other avatar.

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lml09
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby lml09 » Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:04 am

So, had my very first "first day of law school nightmare". They put all tls members in one section, made us carry around duffle bags of books, and then one of you jerks knocked my coffee out of my hand and stole my lunch :x

But seriously, a section comprised entirely of tls members=intense

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Nicholasnickynic
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby Nicholasnickynic » Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:42 am

traehekat wrote:
Nicholasnickynic wrote:For the record, I'm only playing devil's advocate: I'd love some one to convince me that Wake is better than UGA. I had pretty much made up my mind on wake, but than most recent stats threw me for a loop... it's probably just my fear of commitment though O.o


What stats are you referring to? I hope you don't mean UGA's jump in the rankings! Schools fluctuate so much, I really don't think it matters too much. It isn't like employers are looking at the rankings and saying, "Well everyone, looks like UGA moved up two spots this year in the rankings. This means this year we will be hiring x amount more UGA graduates than last year!" Just look at the history of the rankings - every school has been pretty much in its place for the last ten years. They move around a bit here and there, but generally speaking, employers know how good of a school UGA is.


Except that UGA hasn't done this well in over a decade, so perhaps its outside thier normal range>

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moandersen
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby moandersen » Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:55 am

Im not going to lie, that % employed at graduation number for wake stuck out like a sore thumb, and made me scan the entire list of 100 schools to compare it to. The optimist in me thinks that maybe wake doesnt fudge employment numbers like other schools because I asked a teacher during the ASD about employment and she seemed to give me an honest answer that they dont. But really, what else is she going to say?

The poor employment rate combined with the other school I was considering (wisconsin) jump in to the T30 made me hesitate a little. Just a little.

LiveFree
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby LiveFree » Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:01 am

moandersen wrote:Im not going to lie, that % employed at graduation number for wake stuck out like a sore thumb, and made me scan the entire list of 100 schools to compare it to. The optimist in me thinks that maybe wake doesnt fudge employment numbers like other schools because I asked a teacher during the ASD about employment and she seemed to give me an honest answer that they dont. But really, what else is she going to say?

The poor employment rate combined with the other school I was considering (wisconsin) jump in to the T30 made me hesitate a little. Just a little.


Where are you getting the employment rate figures??

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moandersen
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby moandersen » Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:13 am

LiveFree wrote:
moandersen wrote:Im not going to lie, that % employed at graduation number for wake stuck out like a sore thumb, and made me scan the entire list of 100 schools to compare it to. The optimist in me thinks that maybe wake doesnt fudge employment numbers like other schools because I asked a teacher during the ASD about employment and she seemed to give me an honest answer that they dont. But really, what else is she going to say?

The poor employment rate combined with the other school I was considering (wisconsin) jump in to the T30 made me hesitate a little. Just a little.


Where are you getting the employment rate figures??


http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=114393

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jlnoa0915
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby jlnoa0915 » Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:31 am

18k/year back in the pot; that was immensely difficult to do :-(. Good luck everyone.

d-cannon
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby d-cannon » Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:41 am

traehekat wrote:
Nicholasnickynic wrote:when uga has a 90% at graduation, employed at grad doesn't seem like a dumb stat anymore.

It makes it feel like its a safer bet to go there; that I can do much worse at UGA and still be fine (or better off than a wake grade in the same situation anyway).


Call me a pessimist, but I have a hard time believing you can fall in the bottom 15-20% of your class at Georgia and still find meaningful legal work. I could be wrong though.


The thing to remember, knowing that both schools are great, is that the Atlanta legal market alone is bigger than the entire state of NC's legal market. Plus, Charlotte is taking a harder hit in this economy than other mid-sized cities. Also, UGA's alumni base in Atlanta is huge and loyal. A UGA grad would have more options than a WF grad with a similar class rank (in GA and NC, respectively). However, a high-ranked WF student would have more options outside of their state than a similar UGA student at graduation.

***I probably did not add anything of value to this thread.

d-cannon
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby d-cannon » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:13 pm

d-cannon wrote:
***I probably did not add anything of value to this thread.


Actually, I did. With a heavy heart and a wife in tears, I have opened up a spot for someone on the WL. I hope it goes to a TLSer.

I am attending UGA this fall. It is tough because I felt a strong connection with both schools. Also, my wife's family is only a couple of hours northeast of W-S, but several hours from Athens (the distance from my children's grandparents is a big deal). No matter which school I chose, I felt I would be missing out on some great experiences at the other. Wake's Litigation Clinic sounds so great. I will always hold WF Law in high regard.

I dread packing and unpacking a five bedroom house, but as the head of a household of four, I need to maximize my employment opportunities and minimize debt.

Good luck to all of you and 'GO DEACONS'!

keemos
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Re: Wake Forest 2010

Postby keemos » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:16 pm

wish you the best of luck




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