Harvard 2010!

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CG614
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby CG614 » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:40 am

DoubleChecks wrote:
Jericwithers wrote:
DoubleChecks wrote:
Jericwithers wrote:D'oh. Too late to mail them another $70 at this point?


iunno about HLS, but its never too late to mail it to me. pm for address.


Give me bank account information, I will direct deposit.


i would, but i currently gave out the info to an African prince in need of some aid, and he told me to keep the line clear of all electronic and wire transfers

You too? I hope he uses the $5,000 I sent him to free up the $10 Million soon.

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of Benito Cereno
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby of Benito Cereno » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:41 am

grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!

just now?

r6_philly
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:42 am

DoubleChecks wrote:
Jericwithers wrote:
DoubleChecks wrote:
Jericwithers wrote:D'oh. Too late to mail them another $70 at this point?


iunno about HLS, but its never too late to mail it to me. pm for address.


Give me bank account information, I will direct deposit.


i would, but i currently gave out the info to an African prince in need of some aid, and he told me to keep the line clear of all electronic and wire transfers


I can put it in escrow for you guys while you work out the specifics. I will send you each a cashier check with some extra for your troubles.

r6_philly
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:43 am

grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!


Why are they WL your numbers? You guys must be right about this >3.8 thing.

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grrrstick
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby grrrstick » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:44 am

of Benito Cereno wrote:
grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!

just now?


Yeah, just got the email.

pissantvache
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby pissantvache » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:47 am

r6_philly wrote:
grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!


Why are they WL your numbers? You guys must be right about this >3.8 thing.


yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though

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grrrstick
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby grrrstick » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:49 am

r6_philly wrote:
grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!


Why are they WL your numbers? You guys must be right about this >3.8 thing.


I assume so. Granted, I have multiple LSATs and went to a public school, but I am in a fairly impressive grad school for my program and have some above average work experience. Makes me regret taking calculus.

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iminlstrick
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby iminlstrick » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:50 am

pissantvache wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!


Why are they WL your numbers? You guys must be right about this >3.8 thing.


yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Without going too far into the "value of GPA as a measure" debate, may I just say that right now I really loathe my UG for curving science distribution courses to a C. That's right amazing UG, curses!

pissantvache
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby pissantvache » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:51 am

iminlstrick wrote:
pissantvache wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!


Why are they WL your numbers? You guys must be right about this >3.8 thing.


yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Without going too far into the "value of GPA as a measure" debate, may I just say that right now I really loathe my UG for curving science distribution courses to a C. That's right amazing UG, curses!


yep. sucks for people who decide to take chinese or arabic, as well.

r6_philly
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:51 am

pissantvache wrote:yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Then I wonder if they are picking all high GPA's or only quality high GPA's. Maybe JR belives in student quality (major/GPA/softs) over numbers quality (LSAT)?

pissantvache
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby pissantvache » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:08 pm

r6_philly wrote:
pissantvache wrote:yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Then I wonder if they are picking all high GPA's or only quality high GPA's. Maybe JR belives in student quality (major/GPA/softs) over numbers quality (LSAT)?


maybe so. and it's clear that a 4.0 170 is just as much on the margin as a 3.8 180, so this really does only affect people at the margins. I just think it's surprising that there would be such a clear (and transparent) shift in the applicant evaluation metrics that seem, at least at first glance, to be entirely rankings-driven, rather than student-quality driven (that is, what is it about a 3.79 vs. a 3.81 that makes the 3.81 so much better? that's a difference of perhaps one course grade. maybe the student was sick that day. sucks)

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grrrstick
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby grrrstick » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:11 pm

pissantvache wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
pissantvache wrote:yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Then I wonder if they are picking all high GPA's or only quality high GPA's. Maybe JR belives in student quality (major/GPA/softs) over numbers quality (LSAT)?


maybe so. and it's clear that a 4.0 170 is just as much on the margin as a 3.8 180, so this really does only affect people at the margins. I just think it's surprising that there would be such a clear (and transparent) shift in the applicant evaluation metrics that seem, at least at first glance, to be entirely rankings-driven, rather than student-quality driven (that is, what is it about a 3.79 vs. a 3.81 that makes the 3.81 so much better? that's a difference of perhaps one course grade. maybe the student was sick that day. sucks)


I don't want to be too optimistic about my own or any one person's chances, but I find it hard to believe that the LSN graph will look significantly different from past years'. The absolute top candidates will deposit at YS or take full rides other places and a lot of the 4.0/170s and 3.8/180s will get in.

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ShibaDan
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby ShibaDan » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:12 pm

pissantvache wrote:
pissantvache wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
grrrstick wrote:Joining the ranks of the WL today. Hooray for more uncertainty!


Why are they WL your numbers? You guys must be right about this >3.8 thing.


yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Without going too far into the "value of GPA as a measure" debate, may I just say that right now I really loathe my UG for curving science distribution courses to a C. That's right amazing UG, curses!


yep. sucks for people who decide to take chinese or arabic, as well.[/quote]

Or Japanese FWIW

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of Benito Cereno
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby of Benito Cereno » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:14 pm

grrrstick wrote:
pissantvache wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
pissantvache wrote:yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Then I wonder if they are picking all high GPA's or only quality high GPA's. Maybe JR belives in student quality (major/GPA/softs) over numbers quality (LSAT)?


maybe so. and it's clear that a 4.0 170 is just as much on the margin as a 3.8 180, so this really does only affect people at the margins. I just think it's surprising that there would be such a clear (and transparent) shift in the applicant evaluation metrics that seem, at least at first glance, to be entirely rankings-driven, rather than student-quality driven (that is, what is it about a 3.79 vs. a 3.81 that makes the 3.81 so much better? that's a difference of perhaps one course grade. maybe the student was sick that day. sucks)


I don't want to be too optimistic about my own or any one person's chances, but I find it hard to believe that the LSN graph will look significantly different from past years'. The absolute top candidates will deposit at YS or take full rides other places and a lot of the 4.0/170s and 3.8/180s will get in.

wasn't JR himself a high-gpa splitter admitted off the waitlist? maybe he just doesn't think there's as much of a difference (quite reasonable) between a 172 and 178 as between a 3.75 and a 3.85. in which case he'd just prefer to take more 170/3.9 applicants than usual at the expense of sub-3.8 applicants (even those with 180s etc). I'm a high lsat splitter so I hope not but its not an unreasonable possibility. Meanwhile, I am still sitting here waiting. Every time my mailbox goes "bing!" my heart is in my mouth.

r6_philly
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:14 pm

pissantvache wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
pissantvache wrote:yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Then I wonder if they are picking all high GPA's or only quality high GPA's. Maybe JR belives in student quality (major/GPA/softs) over numbers quality (LSAT)?


maybe so. and it's clear that a 4.0 170 is just as much on the margin as a 3.8 180, so this really does only affect people at the margins. I just think it's surprising that there would be such a clear (and transparent) shift in the applicant evaluation metrics that seem, at least at first glance, to be entirely rankings-driven, rather than student-quality driven (that is, what is it about a 3.79 vs. a 3.81 that makes the 3.81 so much better? that's a difference of perhaps one course grade. maybe the student was sick that day. sucks)


Wouldn't that arguement be better applied to the LSAT? What if they are actually evaluating the qualify of the coursework/major more than years past? What if they are giving more emphasis on personality/EC/WE because those roughly equal to employablity upon graduation? I think a Harvard degree is a golden ticket to a decent job unless the applicants themselves are not up to par in non-academic capacities. Maybe there is a shift to better graduates than better students. (like PN alluded to a while ago)

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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:17 pm

def2104 wrote:
pissantvache wrote:
yep. sucks for people who decide to take chinese or arabic, as well.


Or Japanese FWIW


Or Spanish and English!!! :mrgreen:

It sucks when you have a 4.0 in a major that curves to C+ and LSDAS still calculate you to around a 3.9 because of 2 101 courses 8)

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CoaltoNewCastle
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby CoaltoNewCastle » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:17 pm

grrrstick wrote:I don't want to be too optimistic about my own or any one person's chances, but I find it hard to believe that the LSN graph will look significantly different from past years'. The absolute top candidates will deposit at YS or take full rides other places and a lot of the 4.0/170s and 3.8/180s will get in.


Please be right.

Also I believe JR was an outright admit.

Edit: I'd also like to thank LmaoZedong, who on paper is pretty much me but better, for withdrawing. You really should have gotten in, this cycle is rough.
Last edited by CoaltoNewCastle on Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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of Benito Cereno
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby of Benito Cereno » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:18 pm

r6_philly wrote:
pissantvache wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
pissantvache wrote:yeah, well, if this is the case, perhaps their lsat numbers will take a hit. Annoying to have the changes occur this cycle, though


Then I wonder if they are picking all high GPA's or only quality high GPA's. Maybe JR belives in student quality (major/GPA/softs) over numbers quality (LSAT)?


maybe so. and it's clear that a 4.0 170 is just as much on the margin as a 3.8 180, so this really does only affect people at the margins. I just think it's surprising that there would be such a clear (and transparent) shift in the applicant evaluation metrics that seem, at least at first glance, to be entirely rankings-driven, rather than student-quality driven (that is, what is it about a 3.79 vs. a 3.81 that makes the 3.81 so much better? that's a difference of perhaps one course grade. maybe the student was sick that day. sucks)


Wouldn't that arguement be better applied to the LSAT? What if they are actually evaluating the qualify of the coursework/major more than years past? What if they are giving more emphasis on personality/EC/WE because those roughly equal to employablity upon graduation? I think a Harvard degree is a golden ticket to a decent job unless the applicants themselves are not up to par in non-academic capacities. Maybe there is a shift to better graduates than better students. (like PN alluded to a while ago)

I think Harvard would be well served by favoring high gpas (though this policy would not serve me well) as this would project the image that it is less numbers driven (when people think about diploma-mill's obsessed with numbers they think of the lsat and lsat walls and not schools like Boalt, Yale, or Stanford that are all focused on high gpas).

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DoubleChecks
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby DoubleChecks » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:25 pm

havent a lot of the sub-3.8 GPA/really high LSAT cases been LSAT retakes as well?

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AdmiralNelson
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby AdmiralNelson » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:26 pm

redacted
Last edited by AdmiralNelson on Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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of Benito Cereno
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby of Benito Cereno » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:26 pm

DoubleChecks wrote:havent a lot of the sub-3.8 GPA/really high LSAT cases been LSAT retakes as well?

yes. i've noticed this as well.

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someones alt
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby someones alt » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:27 pm

Waitlist offer today, received about an hour ago. I'll be staying on it just to see what happens. Good luck to everyone still pending, I'm rooting for at least one person to get some good news this week.

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nixxers
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby nixxers » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:28 pm

AdmiralNelson wrote:
CoaltoNewCastle wrote:Also I believe JR was an outright admit.


JR - "My trip to Harvard Law was pretty non-traditional. By May, I was still on the wait-list at HLS and had subsequently made arrangements to go to a different law school. I was quick to set up my housing and financial aid with that school because I knew that I was going to be be out of the country all summer doing volunteer work in South Africa. I left for my summer abroad in early June, assuming that there was little to no chance I was going to make it off the waitlist so late in the admissions game.

I arrived back in the US in late July and almost immediately received an email asking if I was still interested in a spot in the entering class at HLS. To put this in context, I had been in the country for less than a day and I was planning on leaving my home in less than a week to go to a different law school. Even if I were able to prepare for the phone interview, I would still need to divert all of my energies to going to a new law school, essentially accomplishing in a couple days the preparations that every other 1L had all summer to arrange. However, HLS was my dream school, and if I didn’t at least try to get in I would always wonder if I could have. I replied to the email and arranged to take my phone interview the following Monday."

--LinkRemoved--


That was written by Anit, one of their student bloggers...

tamlyric
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby tamlyric » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:29 pm

nixxers wrote:
AdmiralNelson wrote:
CoaltoNewCastle wrote:Also I believe JR was an outright admit.


JR - "My trip to Harvard Law was pretty non-traditional. By May, I was still on the wait-list at HLS and had subsequently made arrangements to go to a different law school. I was quick to set up my housing and financial aid with that school because I knew that I was going to be be out of the country all summer doing volunteer work in South Africa. I left for my summer abroad in early June, assuming that there was little to no chance I was going to make it off the waitlist so late in the admissions game.

I arrived back in the US in late July and almost immediately received an email asking if I was still interested in a spot in the entering class at HLS. To put this in context, I had been in the country for less than a day and I was planning on leaving my home in less than a week to go to a different law school. Even if I were able to prepare for the phone interview, I would still need to divert all of my energies to going to a new law school, essentially accomplishing in a couple days the preparations that every other 1L had all summer to arrange. However, HLS was my dream school, and if I didn’t at least try to get in I would always wonder if I could have. I replied to the email and arranged to take my phone interview the following Monday."

--LinkRemoved--


That was written by Anit, one of their student bloggers...


Pfft. Details... :P

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Na_Swatch
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Re: Harvard 2010!

Postby Na_Swatch » Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:29 pm

of Benito Cereno wrote:I think Harvard would be well served by favoring high gpas (though this policy would not serve me well) as this would project the image that it is less numbers driven (when people think about diploma-mill's obsessed with numbers they think of the lsat and lsat walls and not schools like Boalt, Yale, or Stanford that are all focused on high gpas).


A point in your favor (your application and not your idea, that is) is that I highly doubt Harvard is very concerned about the "diploma-mill" image. In fact the only place I've ever seen this mentioned is on TLS itself, and I doubt the the actual admissions office/ alumni/ lawyer population holds this perception.

At the ASW, Harvard's dean kept stressing the advantages of such a large program, the connections that a large class can have, and the many classes/clinics that can be offered. I think the general focus is to talk about how much benefit a large law school can provide, not address any concerns about "degree-mill." The shift in emphasis on higher GPAs does seem to be evident this year, but I'm not sure if its accompanied by a decline in the LSAT quartiles.




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