Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

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Username123
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby Username123 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:37 am

Is it too early to negotiate merit aid? I feel as though the admissions department has a lot going on and would possibly blow off my email request for additional aid; but I also feel as though there is more $ to be offered this early in the cycle. I'm definitely confused as to when I should go about negotiating $.

northerniowan
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby northerniowan » Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:52 am

Uschoolqb10 wrote:Is it too early to negotiate merit aid? I feel as though the admissions department has a lot going on and would possibly blow off my email request for additional aid; but I also feel as though there is more $ to be offered this early in the cycle. I'm definitely confused as to when I should go about negotiating $.


I would do it now. I would call and not email though. Two of my classmates called about negotiating stipulations (I guess that is different than asking for more money, but still...) and got the stip dropped from a 3.0 to a 2.5. I didn't ask, as well as some others. . . now that grades are coming in I really regret not asking haha. What's the worst that could happen? Nothing.

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rosieb9
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby rosieb9 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:14 am

I have a question about the best negotiation tool among a few different offers. I have a half-ride with top 50% stipulation to my top choice, which is great, but I would love to at least get the stipulation lowered, or removed, and possibly some more money. I have a full ride offer from a slightly lower ranked school, another half-ride from a slightly better ranked school with the same stip (mid T2 to higher T2), and an offer w/o scholarship from a better ranked school. There are numerous reasons why my number one choice is first, including a better location for me and better job placement rankings than the two higher schools (in general, and in the area I want to practice). I am waiting for a few more decisions, but am anticipating being wl'ed. I would love to know, with what I have, what do you all feel are my strongest negotiation tools? Thanks for any input!

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Unoriginalist
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby Unoriginalist » Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:56 am

Xs20 wrote:Does anyone know of/have any experience with negotiating with WUSTL using a scholly from Iowa? I was offered a full ride ($105k) from Iowa today, but it has top 50% stips. Scholarships from WUSTL haven't been given out yet, but I'm wondering if this will be an effective bargaining chip when they are?


Would love more info on this, if anyone has insight to offer!

superhopefulwoo
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby superhopefulwoo » Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:23 am

Would an offer from UCI have any effect on most schools ranked 1-100? Just curious where the school stands because of its provisional accreditation (though its been indicated it should be ranked in the top 20-30 if I'm not mistaken?)

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Dmini7
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby Dmini7 » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:42 am

superhopefulwoo wrote:Would an offer from UCI have any effect on most schools ranked 1-100? Just curious where the school stands because of its provisional accreditation (though its been indicated it should be ranked in the top 20-30 if I'm not mistaken?)


I would imagine UCI would be a powerful negotiation tool in Socal. With that said, I don't think USC/UCLA would match a scholarship from UCI, dollar for dollar. It would be interesting to see how much they think of UCI as a "peer". I know UCI says they are all peer schools, and that is their goal, but I am unsure of the other way around. If you applied to other schools in socal (chapman, USD, etc) I think it would be a strong tool. It may even have some power against hastings/davis (but those are two schools i hear are super stingy).

If you are not interested in CA schools, what location are the schools you are trying to negotiate it with?

mh33
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby mh33 » Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:35 am

Anyone have some insight on BC's scholarship tendencies?

I was accepted with 3.51/166 (between 25th and median GPA/right at 75th LSAT). Looking at LSN, it seems last year it took a median GPA (3.6) for those with a 166 to get money.

Assuming I strike out and they don't initially give me an offer when scholarships are given in February, how do you think I could leverage these results from the rest of my cycle?

-90K at Northeastern
-90K at Wake Forest
-Accepted and waiting to hear on money from George Mason and W&L but LSN shows I should get some
-Haven't gotten an admissions decision from BU yet (is even just an acceptance with no money enough to convince them to throw me something so I don't go to BU instead?)

-Unfortunately, I was WL'ed at Fordham, ND, and GW which seem like BC's true peer schools as far as employment scores

Thanks for the help.

superhopefulwoo
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby superhopefulwoo » Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:10 pm

Dmini7 wrote:
superhopefulwoo wrote:Would an offer from UCI have any effect on most schools ranked 1-100? Just curious where the school stands because of its provisional accreditation (though its been indicated it should be ranked in the top 20-30 if I'm not mistaken?)


I would imagine UCI would be a powerful negotiation tool in Socal. With that said, I don't think USC/UCLA would match a scholarship from UCI, dollar for dollar. It would be interesting to see how much they think of UCI as a "peer". I know UCI says they are all peer schools, and that is their goal, but I am unsure of the other way around. If you applied to other schools in socal (chapman, USD, etc) I think it would be a strong tool. It may even have some power against hastings/davis (but those are two schools i hear are super stingy).

If you are not interested in CA schools, what location are the schools you are trying to negotiate it with?


I was looking to use it toward Seattle u and Penn state since I figured the rankings are predicted to be higher than those two schools. Or even W&M if its employment stats and bar passage could be used as an argument. Any input?

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alwayssunnyinfl
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby alwayssunnyinfl » Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:32 am

Xs20 wrote:Does anyone know of/have any experience with negotiating with WUSTL using a scholly from Iowa? I was offered a full ride ($105k) from Iowa today, but it has top 50% stips. Scholarships from WUSTL haven't been given out yet, but I'm wondering if this will be an effective bargaining chip when they are?

Congrats on the awesome offer! I, too, would like to know how well WUSTL does (or doesn't) negotiate against other Midwestern schools.

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Steve2207
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby Steve2207 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:47 am

Thats awesome! congrats!

Jredelman15
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby Jredelman15 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:59 am

Is this too abrasive? Looking for comments

I was ecstatic to find that XXXX has extended the offer of admission to the Class of 2016, as it remains my top choice. However, I do not anticipate being eligible for need based grants; the availability of merit aid will be an important factor in my decision. Additionally, I have received acceptances at the higher ranked and lower ranked. While XXXXX remains my top choice,without merit-based aid I am not sure it is economically feasible. In addition there are certain things that XXXXX does not offer. School is a higher ranked school with the availability to work in the XXX and XXX market while XXX offering a half scholarship and still allows me to work in the XXX and XXX legal market. I look forward to your response and I am anxiously awaiting my visit for ASW in March.

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rabbitrun
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby rabbitrun » Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:21 am

Jredelman15 wrote:Is this too abrasive? Looking for comments

I was ecstatic to find that XXXX has extended the offer of admission to the Class of 2016, as it remains my top choice. However, I do not anticipate being eligible for need based grants; the availability of merit aid will be an important factor in my decision. Additionally, I have received acceptances at the higher ranked and lower ranked. While XXXXX remains my top choice,without merit-based aid I am not sure it is economically feasible. In addition there are certain things that XXXXX does not offer. School is a higher ranked school with the availability to work in the XXX and XXX market while XXX offering a half scholarship and still allows me to work in the XXX and XXX legal market. I look forward to your response and I am anxiously awaiting my visit for ASW in March.


I think this is too abrasive and kind of snarky. You are asking for money, you don't want to hit the gift horse in the mouth. I'm not sure I would explicitly say "higher ranked and lower ranked". The school knows the rankings. And, you don't want to emphasize that some of your bargaining chips are lower ranked.

I'm planning on just saying basically, "School A, you are my top choice, but School B & C are more economically feasible for me. Please find it in your heart to reconsider my scholarship". (not really but you know what I mean). Then I'm sending copies of all my acceptances and scholarship offers.

Jredelman15
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby Jredelman15 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:55 am

I agree and I pared it down significantly. I guess when you have to ask if it's abrasive you already know the answer. Thanks for the help. Some people are saying to call the office and talk to them about it. What are TLS opinions?

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20130312
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby 20130312 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:01 am

I negotiated mine over the phone. It seemed less callous that way and I had good results.

Jredelman15
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby Jredelman15 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:09 am

InGoodFaith wrote:I negotiated mine over the phone. It seemed less callous that way and I had good results.


Can you give insight into the phone conversation and what it will hopefully go like?

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20130312
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby 20130312 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:17 am

Jredelman15 wrote:
InGoodFaith wrote:I negotiated mine over the phone. It seemed less callous that way and I had good results.


Can you give insight into the phone conversation and what it will hopefully go like?

It was pretty much the same as it would have been over email. I told the school that I would love to attend, but had reservations about whether I could afford it and was also considering attending school X because they had offered me a scholly. Person on the phone tells me she will email an updated offer. Sure enough, a week later I have more money in my inbox.

slicksuits44
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby slicksuits44 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 12:40 am

InGoodFaith wrote:
Jredelman15 wrote:
InGoodFaith wrote:I negotiated mine over the phone. It seemed less callous that way and I had good results.


Can you give insight into the phone conversation and what it will hopefully go like?

It was pretty much the same as it would have been over email. I told the school that I would love to attend, but had reservations about whether I could afford it and was also considering attending school X because they had offered me a scholly. Person on the phone tells me she will email an updated offer. Sure enough, a week later I have more money in my inbox.


what school did you contact?

fbmelms
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby fbmelms » Tue Feb 05, 2013 5:26 pm

When negotiating scholarships is it best to include details of other acceptances and scholarship offers or just to explain that you would like for the school to be a more affordable option.

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hhockberger
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby hhockberger » Tue Feb 05, 2013 5:49 pm

fbmelms wrote:When negotiating scholarships is it best to include details of other acceptances and scholarship offers or just to explain that you would like for the school to be a more affordable option.


Tell them about other offers, preferrably from peer schools.

whsy
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby whsy » Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:09 pm

For those who called to negotiate, did you call financial aid or admissions?

wisteria
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby wisteria » Tue Feb 05, 2013 7:29 pm

So if you have a need-based grant and a merit-based grant from X school, and you want to negotiate with Y school. Do they only consider the merit-based part, or do they take into account the total package?

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manofjustice
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby manofjustice » Tue Feb 05, 2013 9:11 pm

Ladies and gentleman, you are all being naive.

Using terms like "need-based" and "merit-based" and wondering "if I can do this."

You have numbers and the school has a ranking. Your numbers equals the school's rankings.

Supply and demand. There are only a few people with the numbers you have, and a lot of schools who needs those numbers.

This applies all the way to the top 1. (You don't think Harvard and Yale are in a dogfight?)

So, listen to me, and do the following. I speak from experience, from my friends experience, from cold-hard statistics, and from the wisdom of law professors.

a) STALL!!! Why? Because the longer you stall, the more the supply of numbers dwindles. The best deals always come late in the cycle. How do you stall? Get the fuck out of your "ask permission" mindset. You stall by saying "I'm gonna stall." You don't stay it like that, exactly, but you come up with an excuse and you make it. Say you're poor and you can't afford to make deposits at multiple schools but many schools are still considering your aid package and you can't decide what to do until they are done.

b) Work from the bottom up. Fuck this "peer school" nonsense. If you tell a school a rank-above that the school a rank-below offered me a bunch of money, in this economy, in this legal job market, with tuition at these prices, you say "I have to take the offer of the school a rank-below." They will respond. Then, once you have the new offer in hand, look to the rank above, and climb the ladder.

c) You will get "nos." There are a lot of reasons. Your numbers could be too low. Your numbers could be too high. But the schools profit from this aura of "prestige" and "untouchableness" they cultivate. Do not play into it. Once they accept you, you have the massive upper hand. Use it. The worst they can do is say "no." And at least one school won't.

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manofjustice
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby manofjustice » Tue Feb 05, 2013 9:12 pm

whsy wrote:For those who called to negotiate, did you call financial aid or admissions?


Always admissions. Always the Dean of admissions. The financial aid department is meaningless.

nba101790
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby nba101790 » Tue Feb 05, 2013 9:12 pm

manofjustice wrote:Ladies and gentleman, you are all being naive.

Using terms like "need-based" and "merit-based" and wondering "if I can do this."

You have numbers and the school has a ranking. Your numbers equals the school's rankings.

Supply and demand. There are only a few people with the numbers you have, and a lot of schools who needs those numbers.

This applies all the way to the top 1. (You don't think Harvard and Yale are in a dogfight?)

So, listen to me, and do the following. I speak from experience, from my friends experience, from cold-hard statistics, and from the wisdom of law professors.

a) STALL!!! Why? Because the longer you stall, the more the supply of numbers dwindles. The best deals always come late in the cycle. How do you stall? Get the fuck out of your "ask permission" mindset. You stall by saying "I'm gonna stall." You don't stay it like that, exactly, but you come up with an excuse and you make it. Say you're poor and you can't afford to make deposits at multiple schools but many schools are still considering your aid package and you can't decide what to do until they are done.

b) Work from the bottom up. Fuck this "peer school" nonsense. If you tell a school a rank-above that the school a rank-below offered me a bunch of money, in this economy, in this legal job market, with tuition at these prices, you say "I have to take the offer of the school a rank-below." They will respond. Then, once you have the new offer in hand, look to the rank above, and climb the ladder.

c) You will get "nos." There are a lot of reasons. Your numbers could be too low. Your numbers could be too high. But the schools profit from this aura of "prestige" and "untouchableness" they cultivate. Do not play into it. Once they accept you, you have the massive upper hand. Use it. The worst they can do is say "no." And at least one school won't.



Written by someone who knows how to negotiate the real way. I agree with most everything you have to say.

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manofjustice
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Re: Negotiating scholarships works!!!!!

Postby manofjustice » Tue Feb 05, 2013 9:27 pm

One other protip: always be respectful. The way you negotiate can actually make the school want you even more. Your negotiating with the school is your demonstrating how professional and effective you are. And that's important to the school because its next big headache is to bring employers onto campus and make them impressed with its students so that its employment numbers look good.

Be demanding, but very respectful. Then good things will happen.




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