WUSTL c/o 2017 Applicants (2013-2014 Cycle) Forum

[mes10d]

What question do you have about NYC biglaw? I was probably who you were referencing.

what's your question

I guess the very stereotypical how realistic is it to get NY BigLaw from WUSTL/what needs to be done, should be expected, etc. just a general Q about the WUSTL/NY BigLaw connection, thanks!

[chuckbass]

What question do you have about NYC biglaw? I was probably who you were referencing.

what's your question

I guess the very stereotypical how realistic is it to get NY BigLaw from WUSTL/what needs to be done, should be expected, etc. just a general Q about the WUSTL/NY BigLaw connection, thanks!

As 0L, I defer to Cuse.

[DoveBodyWash]

What question do you have about NYC biglaw? I was probably who you were referencing.

what's your question

I guess the very stereotypical how realistic is it to get NY BigLaw from WUSTL/what needs to be done, should be expected, etc. just a general Q about the WUSTL/NY BigLaw connection, thanks!

As 0L, I defer to Cuse.

To preface this, if you want the list of the New York employers that recruited from WUSTL from last year's off-campus NYC program or our OCI, then PM me.

NYC is the hardest and easiest market to break into.

Hardest because you need the grades. Like many of our peers we operate on a pre-select system. So you submit your resume to the NY program or OCI and the employers review them and pre-select the candidates that they want to interview. Yes softs matter (e.g. law review, leadership, summer experience) but getting a screener interview is largely about your grades.

Once you have a screener, it's up to you to win them over during the interview. (As is the same in any firm interview in any city from any law school)

It's the easiest because you don't need ties to NYC. It's probably the only market that really does not care about "why you want to stay in NYC"

To answer your specific questions,
What needs to be done: You need top grades. Definitely top third, top 20% is probably more secure. My 2L mentors said that everyone who was top 20% and participated in the NYC program got several screeners.

Should be expected: Not sure what this was asking. But if you mean what you should expect as a student, then you should expect to have a hard time if you don't have top third grades and have trouble being personable in an interview. But that's true from anywhere.

As far as which firms hire us, it's small in number but the quality of the firms are top notch. We send people to firms like Clearly, Cravath, SimpsonThatcher, Shearman, etc... But none of those firms are hiring like 10 WUSTL kids at once. This isn't CLS or NYU. We have a small class size, so only like 30-40 kids are even "eligible" to get NYC screeners. Divide that number up by all the employers, then it'll end up being like 1-2 kids at most going to each firm.

But also remember that most people don't come to WUSTL wanting NYC. Demographically the people that come here are more likely to want Chicago or other Midwestern markets, or the South. A lot of my classmates are i-want-have-a-personal-life-outside-of-work kind of people. So NYC doesn't really appeal to them as much. And then also consider that the people who are most likely to get the top grades necessary to get NYC are also the kids who came to WUSTL on a large scholarship despite having T14 options. These are the people that turned down the prestige, and are therefore less likely to be gunning for Vault NYC firms just in terms of their personality. Cost/debt conscious people who want to maximize their buying power and care less about prestige generally don't pursue NYC too passionately. Ultimately there's a limited number of people who even want NYC, and then that number is further reduced by the grade cutoffs.

So if you want NYC and you do well here, then you will have opportunities. I'm not sure what else to tell you unless you want specific details about which firms we send people to. If that's what you wanna know then feel free to PM me.

The real issue if you want NYC BigLaw is how to get the best grades possible. And it's probably too early to be thinking about that.

[aesth24]

^ Pretty much what my alumni connection (provided by WUSTL) told me who is now in NYC big law.

to add to that, I'm pleasantly surprised by the current student and alumni connection that WUSTL provided. They've provided some great insight and have been a tremendous resource.

[bigfeature]

.

[hukchobo]

What question do you have about NYC biglaw? I was probably who you were referencing.

what's your question

I guess the very stereotypical how realistic is it to get NY BigLaw from WUSTL/what needs to be done, should be expected, etc. just a general Q about the WUSTL/NY BigLaw connection, thanks!

As 0L, I defer to Cuse.

To preface this, if you want the list of the New York employers that recruited from WUSTL from last year's off-campus NYC program or our OCI, then PM me.

NYC is the hardest and easiest market to break into.

Hardest because you need the grades. Like many of our peers we operate on a pre-select system. So you submit your resume to the NY program or OCI and the employers review them and pre-select the candidates that they want to interview. Yes softs matter (e.g. law review, leadership, summer experience) but getting a screener interview is largely about your grades.

Once you have a screener, it's up to you to win them over during the interview. (As is the same in any firm interview in any city from any law school)

It's the easiest because you don't need ties to NYC. It's probably the only market that really does not care about "why you want to stay in NYC"

To answer your specific questions,
What needs to be done: You need top grades. Definitely top third, top 20% is probably more secure. My 2L mentors said that everyone who was top 20% and participated in the NYC program got several screeners.

Should be expected: Not sure what this was asking. But if you mean what you should expect as a student, then you should expect to have a hard time if you don't have top third grades and have trouble being personable in an interview. But that's true from anywhere.

As far as which firms hire us, it's small in number but the quality of the firms are top notch. We send people to firms like Clearly, Cravath, SimpsonThatcher, Shearman, etc... But none of those firms are hiring like 10 WUSTL kids at once. This isn't CLS or NYU. We have a small class size, so only like 30-40 kids are even "eligible" to get NYC screeners. Divide that number up by all the employers, then it'll end up being like 1-2 kids at most going to each firm.

But also remember that most people don't come to WUSTL wanting NYC. Demographically the people that come here are more likely to want Chicago or other Midwestern markets, or the South. A lot of my classmates are i-want-have-a-personal-life-outside-of-work kind of people. So NYC doesn't really appeal to them as much. And then also consider that the people who are most likely to get the top grades necessary to get NYC are also the kids who came to WUSTL on a large scholarship despite having T14 options. These are the people that turned down the prestige, and are therefore less likely to be gunning for Vault NYC firms just in terms of their personality. Cost/debt conscious people who want to maximize their buying power and care less about prestige generally don't pursue NYC too passionately. Ultimately there's a limited number of people who even want NYC, and then that number is further reduced by the grade cutoffs.

So if you want NYC and you do well here, then you will have opportunities. I'm not sure what else to tell you unless you want specific details about which firms we send people to. If that's what you wanna know then feel free to PM me.

The real issue if you want NYC BigLaw is how to get the best grades possible. And it's probably too early to be thinking about that.

this was very informative thank you

[Attax]

Cuse is good about doing that

[wittyhandle]

Cuse is good about doing that

And he is good at convincing us to go to WUSTL.

[DoveBodyWash]

Cuse is good about doing that

And he is good at convincing us to go to WUSTL.

LOL just making u guys realize what you already want.

Just kidding, if i don't think WUSTL is a good option for you then i'll tell you haha

This is an amazingly helpful advice. Thanks, Cusenation! I was debating between WUSTL and Emory in their chances to break the NYC market. According to LST, the percentage of people landing into NYC are less than 10% in both schools, which I thought was relatively small(of course there should be self-selection issue). But I guess it all boils down to the 1L grades.

WUSTL(Out of 92% Employed) Breakdown
Missouri 24.7%
Illinois 8%
Washington D.C. 8%
New York 7%
California 5.3%
Texas 5%

NYC is just one of those markets where any of the top students have a shot at as long as they go to a decent school.

This is our upcoming off-campus interviewing schedule for my class. Remember this doesn't include on-campus interviewing, which is later in mid-august. We share the New York program with Tulane and Vanderbilt. Dates have been omitted.

NY
DC
San Francisco
New England
Atlanta
Chicago
Dallas, Houston

[Lebrarian_Booker]

It's been a week since I've emailed asking whether I'll be considered for a scholarship...no response...

[Ricky-Bobby]

Just kidding, if i don't think WUSTL is a good option for you then i'll tell you haha

This is true. I did see him throw his hands up in disgust when Attax mentioned his UT tuition exemption. He totally shilled to everyone else, though.

[rion91]

It's been a week since I've emailed asking whether I'll be considered for a scholarship...no response...

They're prob swamped w/ new admissions after the Feb LSAT posted

[DoveBodyWash]

just because several people have PMed me about it, this is list of the NYC law firms that recruited from WUSTL last year. This ONLY includes the law firms.

Remember the timeline. Off-Campus interviewing happens two weeks earlier than On-Campus. And when you look at the resume collects, there will be repeat firms that actually recruit us from off-campus interviewing but then also collect our resumes later during on-campus interviewing.

Do not quote this if you reply

Firms that participated in our off-campus interviewing program (End of July/Early August)
Nicoletti Hornig & Sweeney
olshan frome wolosky llp
Proskauer
Ruskin Moscou Faltischek, P.C.
Schulte Roth & Zabel LLP
Seward & Kissel LLP
Shearman & Sterling LLP
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom
Sullivan & Cromwell LLP
Weil Gotshal & Manges, LLP
WilmerHale
Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McCloy LLP
Fitzpatrick, Cella, Harper & Scinto
Jones Day
Kelley Drye & Warren LLP
Cahill Gordon & Reindel LLP
Chadbourne & Parke LLP
Cleary Gottlieb Steen & Hamilton LLP
Cravath, Swaine & Moore LLP
Davis Polk & Wardwell LLP
blank rome llp

Firms that came to our campus for OCI (Early-to-Mid August)
Axinn, Veltrop & Harkrider (on campus)
Hunton & Williams (on campus)
Paul Weiss (on campus)
Bryan Cave (on campus)
Simpson Thacher & Bartlett (on campus)
Vinson & Elkins (on campus)
Kenyon & Kenyon (on campus)

Firms that collected resumes during OCI (remember there could be repeats)
Allen & Overy (resume collect)
Baker Botts (resume collect)
Bickel & Brewer (resume collect)
Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft (resume collect)
Cravath, Swaine & Moore (resume collect)
Jones Day (resume collect)
Latham & Watkins (resume collect)
Ropes & Gray (resume collect)
Thompson Hine (resume collect)

[rion91]

Wow.

[kitkatmcm14]

Has anyone successfully negotiated? I read a lot of posts about people waiting until March but didn't see if anyone heard back from them with good or bad news. Just trying to see what my odds are, because I do not have the kind of money I'd need to attend with the offer they gave me originally.

[Marquis]

Feel like Wash U is really stringing me along here. I interviewed on 2/17, status changed to "interview complete" on 2/20, was told I'd hear back "in about a week" and still no word. I'm also still getting form emails inviting me to apply/come visit/etc. Should I contact them or continue to sit tight?

[rion91]

Feel like Wash U is really stringing me along here. I interviewed on 2/17, status changed to "interview complete" on 2/20, was told I'd hear back "in about a week" and still no word. I'm also still getting form emails inviting me to apply/come visit/etc. Should I contact them or continue to sit tight?

Did you get that explore St. Louis email this morning?

[chuckbass]

Feel like Wash U is really stringing me along here. I interviewed on 2/17, status changed to "interview complete" on 2/20, was told I'd hear back "in about a week" and still no word. I'm also still getting form emails inviting me to apply/come visit/etc. Should I contact them or continue to sit tight?

It really just seems like the office is swamped, I'd probably wait another week to email them.

[Marquis]

Feel like Wash U is really stringing me along here. I interviewed on 2/17, status changed to "interview complete" on 2/20, was told I'd hear back "in about a week" and still no word. I'm also still getting form emails inviting me to apply/come visit/etc. Should I contact them or continue to sit tight?

Did you get that explore St. Louis email this morning?

Sure did! It just felt a little weird. Like I wasn't sure what to make of it. Probably reading too much into it though. I'm sure it just some auto-email they send out to everyone on some list.

I'll follow the above poster's advice and wait it out a little longer.

[yossarian]

Cuse. You're a beautiful person.

ND students are reporting that biglaw went really deep this OCI. Like top 1/3 for sure got it if they wanted it and several between 1/3 and median getting it. (this seems suspect to me) WUSTL reporting the same or still top 20-25%?

[couchpizza]

Cuse. You're a beautiful person.

ND students are reporting that biglaw went really deep this OCI. Like top 1/3 for sure got it if they wanted it and several between 1/3 and median getting it. (this seems suspect to me) WUSTL reporting the same or still top 20-25%?

+1--> VERY interested in this trend

[palbatron]

^^^ same. I am still interested in WashU, but ND gave me much more money (like 20k/yr more). Looking for Chicago Biglaw, so an answer here could prove helpful.

[rion91]

Wow at this thread. From 2009.

[Lebrarian_Booker]

Wow at this thread. From 2009.

all of my wut

[Ricky-Bobby]

Wow at this thread. From 2009.

What's up? You have to remember that in a normal situation Wash U and UIUC are peer schools. 2009 was before the numbers-fudging scandal, so these people were talking about two T25 schools. Sucks to be the ones who picked UIUC and got burned, though (if this actually happened, I still haven't really seen enough conclusive, empirical evidence that UIUC suffered in hiring).